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Why is Michael Jordan generally considered to be the GOAT? What would you say to persuade me to believe he's the best if I don't think so? đź«
- Thread starter TAYLONDO SAMSWORTHY
- Start date
MJ also played in an era where the pseudo-zone was illegal (where you have kats literally being unable to help off of their man, which means offenses were able to field line-ups with no shooters throughout without much consequence. Case in point, nikkas like Rodman or Charles Oakley having long-lasting careers as starters despite being inept offensively.) Kats like KD and LeBron would average similar scoring totals in that era. Imagine prime Bron without a quartet shielding him from the rimStrength and speed are the basis of your argument?
We've seen Bron be contained when he couldn't get into the paint. We've seen him struggle with his jump shot. We've seen him struggle at the line. We've seen him struggle in big moments.
MJ is the perfect player. There wasn't an effective way to neutralize him. There wasn't a way that you could dictate how he'd play. He'd kill you outside, mid range, off the dribble, at the line, and in the post. As big as Lebron is MJ was still better than him as a back to the basket post scorer. Double him and he'd dish to his shooters. You get terrorized when he's on offense and he's a dog on defense. The man put up 35ppg leading the league in scoring and won DPOY. The only player to do that.
MJ was 1st team all defense 9 times to Lebron's 5.
MJ >>>> and I'm not even sure if Lebron should be above Kobe. They're both great but have flaws in their game that MJ didn't.
. You can say that the bigs were more defensively sound, and would just camp out in the paint more, but you kats have to remember that Bron was around 250-280 of straight muscle, and he was agile and fast as shyt, so he'd get his regardless. You couldn't even "Jordan Rules" him because it'd be shoulder in chest season
. Oh, and for context, Pippen was 1st Team All-Defense 8 times, yet HE was actually the primary perimeter defender on all of those Bulls teams, yet Mike has more awards in that field despite guarding the 2nd or 3rd option.
After all these years, I'm still unable to find someone that was able to make that shyt make sense...
That's like a kat winning employee of the year for cleaning the office after all of their co-workers busted their asses to keep the company running.
Coli Hoecomb
Trollin' in my 64'
MJ was far and away a better defender.Bron was robbed of DPOY a few times in his career. Should have been the first unanimous MVP and DPOY in 2013 but the media wasn't fukking with him after the Decision. At his peak, he was a better and more versatile defender than Jordan. He wasn't a better scorer but his elite playmaking and IQ made him a greater offensive force.
Biggest difference between Jordan and all of these other tier 1 ATGs is that Jordan got to play in the 1990s
LeBron has never averaged more than 1.1 blocks in a season. In 88 Jordan averaged 3.2 (three x as many) blocks, at 3 inches shorter than LeBron.
LeBron averaged over 2 steals per game once (2.2) Jordan averaged over 2.5 steals per game 3 times. (2.9 steals in 88)
Marc Spector
the 4'11 Cuban
how does jordan get lauded for taking all of the shots but simultaneously scottie is worse than jimmy butler because as a small forward in the 90s NBA playing next to the greatest scorer ever, , he wasnt "taking over games"?
LeBron (who’s in my mt. Rushmore so no hating) has been the face of Nike basketball for the past 20 years. He had enough time and resources (I’m sure Nike’s marketing budget is many times bigger these days) to surpass MJ in everyone’s eyes if Nike’s marketing power was what gave MJ the advantage.
So I just don’t get the “Nike Machine” angle - it’s not like Bron’s been a LiNing athlete all his career. And outside of Nike, LeBron had plenty of and still has big name endorsements and even has I believe a deal with Audemars Piguet, a top tier luxury watch brand and worked closely with high fashion brands like Thom Browne whereas MJ’s endorsements never went outside of everyman brands like Wheaties, Gatorade, and Wilson so Bron kinda has an edge there when it comes to cachet and prestige of the brands he’s associated with.
So I just don’t get the “Nike Machine” angle - it’s not like Bron’s been a LiNing athlete all his career. And outside of Nike, LeBron had plenty of and still has big name endorsements and even has I believe a deal with Audemars Piguet, a top tier luxury watch brand and worked closely with high fashion brands like Thom Browne whereas MJ’s endorsements never went outside of everyman brands like Wheaties, Gatorade, and Wilson so Bron kinda has an edge there when it comes to cachet and prestige of the brands he’s associated with.
THE FACT THAT U SAID U UNDERSTAND CALLING BRON THE GOAT SHOWS THAT U URSELF UNDERRATE MJ LOL
BUT THE FAKE GOAT TALKS STARTED DUE TO THE COUNTING STATS BASED ON LONGEVITY
NOBODY WAS CALLIN BRON THE GOAT WHEN HE WAS IN HIS PRIME LOL
THIS IS HOW TRUE GOATS TALK
THE FACT THAT BRON CALLS HIMSELF THE GOAT IS THE REASON HE’S NOT CLOSE
A SENSE OF HUMILITY AND GIVIN THE NOD TO YOUR PREDECESSORS GOES A LONG WAY
that's going to happen with time regardless. no different than a lot of youngins now arguing with Bron as the GOAT. as time goes by the top dog you grew up with is going to get that shine
I love Bron, but, look at this bullshyt.
People act like Mike Played 8 seasons before Pip came
Mike had two full years and a broken foot shorted 2nd year
Pip got drafted before Mike's 4th year
He was supposed to have 3 rings before he played 190 games in his career?
NOT ONLY THAT, BUT HE WON RINGS WITOUT 1 SUPERSTAR BECAUSE HE RAN TO ANOTHER MULTIPLE TIMES LMAO
THATS TOO GOOD HOW THEY TRIED SPINNIN THAT
Marc Spector
the 4'11 Cuban
Stop it . until that point, there had NEVER been as aggressive and experimental an advertising campaign as nike had for Jordan. Y’all are not really understanding the power of television and how cable and satellite TV exploded during the 80s and 90s . Not to mention, the soviet union dissolves in 91. Nixon and Kissinger opening china up in 78 starts paying dividends in the 90s. Nike and Jordan had a global economy at their fingertips unlike any other time human history. it can never be underestimated how much of Jordan’s brand and fame can be attributed to just simply being in the right place at the right time in regards to the Geopolitical landscape.
the benefits that LeBron and other Nike spokes people are able to reap are only because the Jordan brand expanded what was possible for player branding.
Nike has been ass advertising wise for at least 15 years. probably more.
I’m in my 40s…I lived it. Here and overseas (I’ve been all over, Asia, Europe…) - that global economy at their fingertips is a hyperbolic US centric perspective lol. You think Nike had Jordan ads on airwaves all across the globe? not at all, at most they had posters or magazine ads here and there. The distribution wasn’t there for them to justify the ad spends - Japan, France, and other tier 1 countries had more campaigns and releases but other countries weren’t even getting regular Jordans released at the time. Most countries I lived or been to were getting like 1 NBA game per week or just the finals. That global reach shyt is way overrated. Compared that to 247 Youtube and social media and NBA being broadcasted all over in diff languages + true worldwide distribution channel for Nike right now it’s night and day. Yes, Jordan was the first athlete to have his own line named after him and had iconic campaigns but the right place and right timing stuff is indeed overrated. If you have to bring up Nixon and Kissinger you know you’re reaching. China in the 90s was dirt poor they couldn’t afford no Jordans it was in the 2000s when their economy grew Kobe became a god-like figure there. In the 90s, Nike’s reach was still contained to Japan and a select few European countries. Russia, I admit I never been but I doubt the whole Soviet region was ever a top priority for Nike as their disposable income level remains low.
The accolades and stats is one thing when you talk about MJ. Then you go to his highlights.....it's like damn he was doing THAT while averaging THAT??
Alot of Legends have highlight reels...but MJ averaging 30 with it on 50% with acrobatic layups, fadeaways, 2 dribble pull ups, catch and shoots, breakdown the man one on one pull up j etc. Mans got whole defensive compilations on top of that. He's the one of one
Alot of Legends have highlight reels...but MJ averaging 30 with it on 50% with acrobatic layups, fadeaways, 2 dribble pull ups, catch and shoots, breakdown the man one on one pull up j etc. Mans got whole defensive compilations on top of that. He's the one of one