No one was more dominant than Peak Shaq

Shadow King

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Breh. You are not in your athletic prime in your 30s. At best you are on the downward slope and starting to exit it. With your logic, Jordan was in his prime during the second three peat when he was 32-35 :beli: Which would be ridiculous. Everyone acknowledges that Jordan was his best from about 87 or 88 until 93. And that lines up with common sense as he would’ve been 25 to 30 years old those years.
A skilled player's prime can last into his 30s, just as it can emerge before 25.
 

NkrumahWasRight Is Wrong

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Shaq’s longevity is overlooked. He gets some criticism for not always taking care of his body and there probably is truth to that, but I often hear people talk like Shaq didn’t have a lot of longevity.

He was already a monster as a rookie, finishing 7th in MVP voting, then 4th the next season, then 2nd. He stayed an elite player through his 13th season, when he went to Miami was 2nd in MVP voting. That’s 12 to 13 seasons as an elite player, and was still a good player after that until he left the Suns 4 years later.

He was great on the celtics in limited minutes until a sniper took out his calf
 

Dwight Howard

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Shaq was not more dominant than LeBron peak-for-peak, and I have good cause to doubt he was more dominant than Mike, Kareem, or Wilt peak-for-peak, but I didnt see those guys to feel 100% confident in my assessment. I saw him and LeBron, get outta here...

I can definitely question whether he was more dominant than Giannis too...

Calling Shaq the most dominant player ever was a branding and marketing mantra that worked for both him and the NBA at large, but was never true. The only way that could be phrased to be true is you could say he was the most dominant player in The League at his peak...

That other shyt is bull...


:mjlol: this dude tryna imply LeBron was more dominant than Mj
 

jadillac

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On one hand, Shaq was dominant both skinny and chunky.

He could have been more dominant had he worked harder.

On the other hand, he went to LA in his prime and was able to enjoy everything LA had to offer and still won titles despite not being in the best shape.

He was 12-13 yrs in when he left LA and won 1 title in Miami(when he dropped weight) . At that point of his career he probably wouldn't have done much else even if he was in shape
 

Dwight Howard

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This is a horrible post...

First of all, you're only giving Kobe a 5-year prime, which is completely preposterous and unfair to Kobe. Then you're splitting his prime as if it was interrupted by either an injury disruption (think Durant missing an entire season) or a dramatic decline in play that served as a gulf between otherwise consistent high-level production (think CP3). Neither of these qualifiers apply to Kobe that warrant erasing a year or two of his prime as if they didn't exist...

And again saying Kobe had only a 5-year prime in a 20-year career is obviously untrue. What you're really referencing is Kobe's peak, but you're splitting it for some strange reason. He wasn't peaking in no damn 2001-03; though those were some of his best defensive seasons he wasn't anywhere near the complete player he became later...

Your premise to start is flawed at multiple points, and I want to say you and I have engaged a conversation on Kobe's career before in years past...

Second of all, his career path wasn't all that unusual. Magic had to "share" the spotlight in a similar situation. Russell entered The League on a team featuring the first great guard in Cousy and had to "share" that situation. Jerry West walked onto a squad featuring Elgin Baylor who was one of the best players in the sport and had to wait his turn to "shine". This is three situations I can call off the top of the dome easily, there are more. It's hardly unusual to enter The League on a team where there's an established superstar and you have to grow into your own...

This is a point to circle back to later because Kobe wasn't ready when he entered the NBA to shoulder the burden of carrying a franchise. He didn't have to "share" anything, he had to develop into a player that could handle that responsibility and spotlight...

To the meat of your post, Kobe didn't have an extraordinary peak. He became a GOAT because of how long he was an elite, Top 10 player, which was at the very least a dozen years, and I could make the case he was a Top 10 guy for as long as 15 years. That level of consistency at that level of play for that long of time (minimum 12 years) is extraordinary and rare, that's how he became a GOAT...

He didn't become a GOAT because he had an otherworldly peak, because he just didn't. It was high, but there's a pretty long line of guys who peaked higher...

Lastly, you need to quantify the "circumstances that conspired" against him and his GOAT case, because it's already established the one you named (that he had to share the spotlight) isn't factual, that never hampered anyone else in that situation who earned inclusion. Kobe and Shaq spent 8 years together. At bare minimum, Shaq was the greater player for the first 6 of those 8 years, and unquestionably so during their championship runs...

If anything hurts Kobe when it comes to GOAT standing:

•he didn't peak as high as a number of guys

•he played in 7 Finals and doesn't have any performance that can be considered All-Time great or iconic, a number of other candidates do and a few have multiple

•he doesn't really have any hallmark, legendary front-to-back playoff runs, while a number of other candidates do and a few have multiple

•he's really the only Top 15 guy that didn't walk into the NBA as NBA-ready, this can't be overlooked in direct comparisons and its actually a testament to his work ethic that he built himself into a legend because the general rule for guys of his historical weight, those guys walk into the door as culture-changers, franchise-altering players, floor-raisers---->but you can't just compare him to guys who WERE and act like it doesn't matter
Kobe averaged 35ppg in a league where the average point s scored was 96ppg. That's extraordinary period and hasn't been matched.
 

Peruvian Connect

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Yall nikkas so smart, that y'all out here out thinking yall selves.

Case in point. @Mandizi clearly describe what we're talking about, when we call Shaq the MDE ... Most Dominant Ever. Y'all intellectuals are out here tripping yall own selves up. writing thesis papers, bringing up stats and numbers like dude stop it.
Even if you want to use physically dominant, it still ain't Shaq. nikkas been calling LeBron, LeBulldozer damn near his whole career.
 

MJ Truth

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Shaq’s longevity is overlooked. He gets some criticism for not always taking care of his body and there probably is truth to that, but I often hear people talk like Shaq didn’t have a lot of longevity.

He was already a monster as a rookie, finishing 7th in MVP voting, then 4th the next season, then 2nd. He stayed an elite player through his 13th season, when he went to Miami was 2nd in MVP voting. That’s 12 to 13 seasons as an elite player, and was still a good player after that until he left the Suns 4 years later.
The problem is most “fans” only look at Shaq from 2000 forward, as though he wasn’t a great player for 8 years beforehand.
 

Shadow King

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Shaq’s longevity is overlooked. He gets some criticism for not always taking care of his body and there probably is truth to that, but I often hear people talk like Shaq didn’t have a lot of longevity.

He was already a monster as a rookie, finishing 7th in MVP voting, then 4th the next season, then 2nd. He stayed an elite player through his 13th season, when he went to Miami was 2nd in MVP voting. That’s 12 to 13 seasons as an elite player, and was still a good player after that until he left the Suns 4 years later.
Yeah it always confused me that 13 years as a top center is poor longevity. But it's likely since people conflate prime and peak.
 
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