Why "Self Publishing" is bad for consoles

[Rice N Beans]

 

[Liquid]

Self publishing does not mean that Sony and Microsoft are gonna open the floodgates to anyone like Android, iOS, and Ouya They are still going to make sure that the games aren't total crap.

It doesn't matter that there are thousands of garbage apps on the market, the best ones are the ones that will float to the top anyway.

The reason there is a problem on Android is because there are absolutely no checks and the system is open by default. Neither the PS4 or XBOX One are...thus will not be having this issue.

 

[MeachTheMonster]

It doesn't matter that there are thousands of garbage apps on the market, the best ones are the ones that will float to the top anyway.

The reason there is a problem on Android is because there are absolutely no checks and the system is open by default. Neither the PS4 or XBOX One are...thus will not be having this issue.

That is just untrue. The "top" is filled with trash games

 

[MeachTheMonster]

I personally would argue that discoverability is better on Steam than it is on PSN or XBLA. That said, discoverability on Steam can certainly still improve. I also think that you can Hex's point of using alternative methods is legit. You shouldn't be being burned and blaming the storefront. There are more than enough resources for you to do your own research and get burned minimally.

It's like y'all just want to ignore what I'm saying. I know you can research. I don't want to have to research on my console. For example. If I want to download a game for my son. He likes cars/racing. So I search for racing games. I don't want to have to research 50 shytty racing games to find the one good one.

The iTunes/Steam model is PERFECT for the PS4 and XBOX One

Why?

 

[MeachTheMonster]

I swear this place is retarded. Bring up a real issue that effects all of us, and everybody pretends it doesn't exist and I'm just making stuff up.

http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/6.841332-Jimquisition-Steam-Needs-Quality-Control?page=1

It is a real issue. And I hope Xbox finds a way to avoid it

 

[satam55]

It doesn't matter that there are thousands of garbage apps on the market, the best ones are the ones that will float to the top anyway.

The reason there is a problem on Android is because there are absolutely no checks and the system is open by default. Neither the PS4 or XBOX One are...thus will not be having this issue.

Just because Android is an Open Source OS, doesn't mean your app will end up in the Google Play Store. There are apps you have to side load or get from a 3rd-party app store.

 

[Kodie]

I swear this place is retarded. Bring up a real issue that effects all of us, and everybody pretends it doesn't exist and I'm just making stuff up.

http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/6.841332-Jimquisition-Steam-Needs-Quality-Control?page=1

It is a real issue. And I hope Xbox finds a way to avoid it

That video from Jim was very divisive. I personally didn't agree with the full sentiment. Here's a response I gave him:

Sure, I'm not saying bad products don't exist elsewhere. But here's the thing - when a store gets a bad game, Steam invariably gets that same bad game. And on top of THAT, Steam's allowing a whole bunch of OTHER bad games that stores don't have. Ergo, the amount of poor quality product on Steam is going to be worse than GameStop or Walmart.

There are simply more checks and balances in place with store-bought games. Now obviously they don't catch all the shyt. A lot of shyt still makes it out there - but imagine how much worse it'd be if literally anybody could put a game on a GameStop shelf.

And I think it's in Valve's interest, moreso than the customer, to sort that out. Because turning your store into a risky minefield simply isn't a good idea.

And no other store has the amount of great games that Steam has. What other stores are currently carrying Gunpoint, The Swapper, Rogue Legacy, The Banner Saga, Samurai Gun and Nidhogg? I'll take that good with the bad of Steam also releasing all the games you listed in your video that I would have never heard of or seen if it wasn't for your video.

It's like y'all just want to ignore what I'm saying. I know you can research. I don't want to have to research on my console. For example. If I want to download a game for my son. He likes cars/racing. So I search for racing games. I don't want to have to research 50 shytty racing games to find the one good one.

I'm not ignoring anything. I'm not even saying you don't know that you can do research. I'm just saying that you should be being burned minimally. That is a consumer's responsibility and it's not limited to self-publishing or video games at all. Look for a shooter for 360 on gamestop and there will be a bunch of trash titles. Look for a TV and you'll be presented with lots of shytty options. Again, I think discoverability can improve and all of these storefronts are worthy of criticism but I think that allowing self-publishing does more good than harm.

 

[MeachTheMonster]

That video from Jim was very divisive. I personally didn't agree with the full sentiment. Here's a response I gave him:

That video from Jim was very divisive. I personally didn't agree with the full sentiment. Here's a response I gave him:

That's fine. And that's what I said in the op. PC and iphone gamers are more forgiving of this type of system. But I feel console gamers will not be.

Furthermore those games you listed would still exist and probably be even more successful without all the trash in the store.

 

[Liquid]

Just because Android is an Open Source OS, doesn't mean your app will end up in the Google Play Store. There are apps you have to side load or get from a 3rd-party app store.

The majority appear with no problem...you know this.

I swear this place is retarded. Bring up a real issue that effects all of us, and everybody pretends it doesn't exist and I'm just making stuff up.

http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/6.841332-Jimquisition-Steam-Needs-Quality-Control?page=1

It is a real issue. And I hope Xbox finds a way to avoid it

It doesn't need quality control...steam is doing just fine.

Ask gamestop and any other retail company, if you can have an unlimited shelf space, would you? Why would steam or any other retailer turn away a potential customer? What if only 100 people wanted to buy a game titled "This shyt Right Here" and went to steam to look for it, but its not on there. That is 100 potential customers you will lose just because said demand or quality in your eyes is not up to the standard of the store owner. This is different, you don't have to worry about a physical location...why throw away money unecessarily?

Correct me if I am wrong, but didn't gamestop carry Duke Nukem Forever? Doesn't that qualify as shovelware? You get far up into your ridiculous ideas and the thoughts of a few that you back yourself into a corner time and time again.

Steam is a store owned by Valve and Valve likes to make money. It doesn't matter if only a small fraction of the users want same game, they shouldn't NOT have it on there because Meach is too lazy or can't be bothered to skip it in the "T" alphabetical list or whatever category the game falls into. Scrolling over a game takes what...2 seconds on steam? If it does happen to catch your eye...you go to the store page to see a video or images, interested? It's no different than going to Walmart and looking through the shovelware list of budget PC titles they sell bundled together for $10.

The only thing steam needs to worry about is malicious programs, that is the only thing they need to focus on. Everything else should be fair game.

 

[Liquid]

I also think you are worrying much about nothing tbh. I have said it time and time again, the PC library dwarfs console libraries due to sheer longevity. You are not going to have nearly the amount of options you have on the xbox marketplace as you find on steam.

You have nothing to worry about.

 

[Kodie]

That's fine. And that's what I said in the op. PC and iphone gamers are more forgiving of this type of system. But I feel console gamers will not be.

Furthermore those games you listed would still exist and probably be even more successful without all the trash in the store.

Well all of the games would certainly exist but whether non-IGF finalists would be in the Steam store is relatively arguable. Maybe, I should pick a list of more divisive gems but I think the point is, Steam has games that no other storefront has and those games are good, bad and anywhere in between. Also the bad games that Jim mentions, I would never have even heard of those if it wasn't for people tlaking about how bad they are.

 

[MeachTheMonster]

The majority appear with no problem...you know this.

It doesn't need quality control...steam is doing just fine.

Ask gamestop and any other retail company, if you can have an unlimited shelf space, would you? Why would steam or any other retailer turn away a potential customer? What if only 100 people wanted to buy a game titled "This shyt Right Here" and went to steam to look for it, but its not on there. That is 100 potential customers you will lose just because said demand or quality in your eyes is not up to the standard of the store owner. This is different, you don't have to worry about a physical location...why throw away money unecessarily?

If your store becomes known for having shytty products then people will just stop shopping there. I'd much rather the console game stores be more like Costco and less like Wal-Mart

Correct me if I am wrong, but didn't gamestop carry Duke Nukem Forever? Doesn't that qualify as shovelware? You get far up into your ridiculous ideas and the thoughts of a few that you back yourself into a corner time and time again.

Obviously no method will remove all shovelware, but the current policies of iTunes/steam actually encourage shovelware. Devs have more insentive to make cheap gimmicky games and try to push them to the top of the list, then they do to make quality games that rise to the top on their own.

Steam is a store owned by Valve and Valve likes to make money. It doesn't matter if only a small fraction of the users want same game, they shouldn't NOT have it on there because Meach is too lazy or can't be bothered to skip it in the "T" alphabetical list or whatever category the game falls into. Scrolling over a game takes what...2 seconds on steam? If it does happen to catch your eye...you go to the store page to see a video or images, interested? It's no different than going to Walmart and looking through the shovelware list of budget PC titles they sell bundled together for $10.

I do not enjoy either. I don't want to sift through shovelware. If there are any good games in the Walmart shovelware bin I will always miss them.

The only thing steam needs to worry about is malicious programs, that is the only thing they need to focus on. Everything else should be fair game.

I really don't care what steam needs to worry about. This thread is about the consoles hopefully NOT following the steam/iTunes model.[/quote][/quote]

 

[MeachTheMonster]

Well all of the games would certainly exist but whether non-IGF finalists would be in the Steam store is relatively arguable. Maybe, I should pick a list of more divisive gems but I think the point is, Steam has games that no other storefront has and those games are good, bad and anywhere in between. Also the bad games that Jim mentions, I would never have even heard of those if it wasn't for people tlaking about how bad they are.

All platforms have games that are unavailable on other platforms. You don't need unchecked "self publishing" to achieve this.

 

[Liquid]

If your store becomes known for having shytty products then people will just stop shopping there. I'd much rather the console game stores be more like Costco and less like Wal-Mart


Obviously no method will remove all shovelware, but the current policies of iTunes/steam actually encourage shovelware. Devs have more insentive to make cheap gimmicky games and try to push them to the top of the list, then they do to make quality games that rise to the top on their own.


I do not enjoy either. I don't want to sift through shovelware. If there are any good games in the Walmart shovelware bin I will always miss them.


I really don't care what steam needs to worry about. This thread is about the consoles hopefully NOT following the steam/iTunes model.

show me the evidence when it comes to gaming...you shot yourself in the foot again.

GameStop, which is a shytty company doesn't even provide images to some of their used games and they are still up and running after all these years. I didn't even read the rest of your shyt

You would think with all the nonsense you are throwing that Valve would be scrambling to make sure less games are on their service...if that makes sense.

 

[Kodie]

but the current policies of iTunes/steam actually encourage shovelware. Devs have more insentive to make cheap gimmicky games and try to push them to the top of the list, then they do to make quality games that rise to the top on their own.

I agree that I really don't want to see a bunch of stuff like Dungeon Keeper and blatant clones. I don't know how you solve that problem without some sort of barrier to entry but I do think that is something Valve is trying to solve with the plan for eventual user-curated storefronts.

Speaking of barrier to entry, all of the other platforms we're talking about have that. XBO has the ID@ program, PS4 has the cost of dev kits (Sony is only lending them out for free to good, established devs) and Steam has greenlight. And for all three of these, there's still a final non-automated approval from the platform holder.