Verzuz Present: SWV vs Xscape | 5/8 8PM ET

[dora_da_destroyer]

naw

SWV was new york all day, all the way.

they only did songs with new york & north jersey rappers too, outside of the "men in black" hook.





this is why total has no business in the ring with these groups.

this list is just as big as your list of actual total songs.
and aside from "loungin", theyre not even credited for these hooks. most people dont know thats them on there, and they couldve pulled any random chick off the bus stop to do those hooks.

Their songs with e-40 and snoop say different

 

[Budda]

Da Brat was not the biggest Atlanta rap star for few years. Sure, people thought she was from Atlanta, but clearly she wasn't.



Nobody thought Kast was from Cali.


Kast had more cultural impact than So So Def.



And this statement contradicts our whole post.

No way

 

[Budda]

Jermaine Dupri didn't step up though. He put out groups that you had no idea were from Atlanta unless you read interviews or press releases. Atlanta wasn't represented in the mainstream until this:

JD even took the name of his Atlanta anthem and concept from that Interlude. That album introduced the world to every aspect of Atlanta. NOBODY did that on a mainstream level BEFORE Kast. They even had videos shot in Atlanta. Puff came here to direct one of their first videos. Fab Five Freddy brought Yo MtV Raps to the Dungeon to discuss Atlanta with Kast.



Has nothing to do with who I like more. I'm a JD fan as well. Its revision to say he put Atlanta on the map though.

Jds movement was more pivotal to Atl music than OutKast was in the 90’s I would say.

 

[JustCKing]

i never said he produced anything. ITS NOT ABOUT THAT.

the fact is, he was always with them, and they were the movement.

youre too caught up in "who did what", which is not what that argument was about. we were simply telling you that we knew him, and why we knew him.

and @Won Won is just a dikkhead. jumping in out of nowhere, looking stupid as usual. and not that it matters, but youre also bringing up the song "Creep" which wasnt even out in the same era that we're speaking on. please go somewhere. we dont need you trolls ruining this thread. we made it 95 pages without yall.

Breh, Jermaine was not that sympatico with TLC that he was synonymous with the group. He wasn't always with them. He had a small cameo in a video. There was literally nothing special about it or some great story behind it. Some of you are making it like, this was JD introducing the world to TLC, when in reality, NOBODY cared that JD was even in TLC video because he wasn't even really known then. Who really saw the "Baby Baby Baby" video and saw JD and was like "they got JD in a video".

 

[spliz]

Missy Elliott RAPS on the song. Nobody cares whether you think she's a rapper or not. She's not from NY or NJ as you claimed SWV exclusively worked with rappers from those places. And the fact that you're saying "she probably wrote the song she appeared" proves you shouldn't even be having this conversation. Everybody knows she wrote the song. It was a single and video.

She wasn't credited on "Men In Black". It doesn't matter why. The point remains, she wasn't credited.

Who cares what the label had them doing. They had rappers on that album that weren't from NY and NJ when you claimed they only worked with rappers from NY and NJ. How is it a bad example, when it's actually what happened: they worked with rappers who weren't from NY and NJ.

Yup. This is all facts.

 

[JustCKing]

Jds movement was more pivotal to Atl music than OutKast was in the 90’s I would say.

What did JD do in the '90's that was more pivotal to ATL music? What movement did he even have because all I've seen is this:

1) Kriss Kross who were huge as a kid rap group, but did nothing on terms of people looking at them and recognizing that Atlanta was AT LEAST on the come up

2) JD appearing in TLC's video and people lying that they knew who he was (from the few clips he was in) and saying they associated that with Atlanta when nothing ties him to Atlanta

3) So So Def, which launched Xscape as its first act, which again I ask, What did they do to push Atlanta to the forefront?

 

[Flight]

Glad SWV got their flowers while they could smell em. True legends and my favorite r&b group of the 90s.

 

[theflyest]

Coko's stank attitude won

I’m sure there are plenty of classics made this way. Johnny Gill HATED the song ‘Boyz to Men” and its one of new editions beloved songs

 

[Budda]

What did JD do in the '90's that was more pivotal to ATL music? What movement did he even have because all I've seen is this:

1) Kriss Kross who were huge as a kid rap group, but did nothing on terms of people looking at them and recognizing that Atlanta was AT LEAST on the come up

2) JD appearing in TLC's video and people lying that they knew who he was (from the few clips he was in) and saying they associated that with Atlanta when nothing ties him to Atlanta

3) So So Def, which launched Xscape as its first act, which again I ask, What did they do to push Atlanta to the forefront?

So So Def alone...

Usher TLC Da Brat Xscape Jagged Edge Kriss Kross and Jermaine Dupri himself all made waves to push Atlanta to the forefront as one of the truly major cities for 90’s black music, it was So So Def and LaFace who Outkast Goodie Mob and Usher TLC we’re signed to who did this, in many ways the two were linked to each other to the point you could be ignorant to think someone like Usher was actually signed to So So Def.

OutKast in the 90’s was just a single group, JD already had Kriss Kross come through and smash the buildings before OutKast had a hit, by the time OutKast blew proper he was still making waves with Usher, Jagged Edge and even Lil Bow Wow.

I guess if we’re solely talking rap we can make arguments but even then ATL only took the rap scene in the last 15 years with the likes of Gucci Jeezy Lil Jon and co, OutKast in many ways were outliers.

 

[Wacky D]

Kriss Kross is absolutely the reason JD got known but it went hand in hand. The magazines like Word Up stayed talking about JD. Matter fact he’d be in the pics all with them like he was the third member

THIS

i dont know why this isnt registering with @JustCKing.

See this is the history rewrite because ya'll know full well JD was NEVER the face of ATL. JD has spent his a lot of his career being underrated because he stood in the shadows of other ATL artists even some of the artists he helped put on. Nobody ever looked at Jermaine Dupri as the face of Atlanta the way they look at OutKast, Lil' Jon, Usher, T.I., Jeezy or even a Gucci Mane.

Yes, the story of how Kriss Kross being discovered was something that was widely talked about, but it wasn't BECAUSE of JD, it was because THEY WERE DISCOVERED AT A MALL. The fact that you don't even note that it was Greenbriar Mall further pushes my point home. In 1992, who really cared that it was JD or a Greenbriar Mall. Kriss Kross was the reason JD became known. Yes, he produced the group, but JD wasn't the household name, Kriss Kross was. JD wasn't guesting on A Different World, Kriss Kross was. JD wasn't in the video for Michael Jackson's "Jam", Kriss Kross was.

And while we're at it, with all this talk about JD putting Atlanta, he wasn't even the biggest producer in the city at that point. Ya'll completely overlook Dallas Austin when he produced the bulk of TLC's debut. While Boyz II Men definitely isn't Atlanta, Dallas helmed their debut as well. Dallas Austin also produced Another Bad Creation, which as mentioned is an Atlanta group. They blew before Kriss Kross came out. I'm not saying Dallas Austin put Atlanta on either, but if you're gonna say Jermaine Dupri, you might as well throw Dallas in there too.

Point of it all, is that I'm willing to bet most of you NEVER associated Jermaine Dupri with Atlanta until '94/'95 ish, which by then Kast had taken off and they were unmistakably ATL. You didn't have to read a press release, interview, or research where they were from. Their videos were shot in Atlanta. Their slang was Atlanta. They wore the Braves jerseys and caps. If you'd never set foot in Atlanta, one listen to Southernplayalistic gave you a tour of the different hoods and night spots in Atlanta and the whole culture and feel of the city.

JD isnt underrated because of atlanta artists bro.

nobody outside of atlanta knows what a greenbriar mall is, nor do we care.

JD was indeed on that different world episode. he was the DJ at the end of the show. THATS THE POINT. he was a fixture in everything and he talked on most of the records. he wasnt just some lowly producer playing the background. it was obvious that he was the man. then add the fact that he wasnt much older and certainly wasnt much more taller than them, made everybody take notice to who this guy was. then by the end of 93, he had his own label.

"yo dallas man. flip the track". outside of that quick chit on iesha, we never saw dallas austin. he was basically what youre trying to paint JD as.

as for the last part, i see where youre going. you want outkast to be seen as the guys who put atlanta on the map. i shouldve known.

 

[Lucky_Lefty]

JD brought da brat out during that time, and she was bigger than outkast. we thought da brat was from atlanta back then.

You nikkas must’ve been dumb and deaf af cause all over that first album, if she wasn’t rapping about how she was from the Chi or west side , she was rapping out the zip code. Nobody EVER thought Brat was from the A

Now back from the 6-o-6-4-4 full of indo
Untypical is that bad ass ho
B to the R to the A to the T
Ain't no bytch is this industry that can see me
The city of C-H-I is where I'm from

 

[JustCKing]

So So Def alone...

Usher TLC Da Brat Xscape Jagged Edge Kriss across and Jermaine Dupri himself all made waves to push Atlanta to the forefront as one of the truly major cities for 90’s black music, it was So So Def and LaFace who Outkast Goodie Mob and Usher TLC we’re signed to who did this, in many ways the two were linked to each other to the point you could be ignorant to think someone like Usher was actually signed to So So Def.

OutKast in the 90’s was just a single group, JD already had Kriss Kross come through and smash the buildings before OutKast had a hit, by the time OutKast blew proper he was still making waves with Usher, Jagged Edge and even Lil Bow Wow.

I guess if we’re solely talking rap we can make arguments but even then ATL only took the rap scene in the last 15 years with the likes of Gucci Jeezy Lil Jon and co, OutKast in many ways were outliers.

Usher and TLC were not So So Def artists. Jagged Edge wasn't really a big deal in the 90's. They didn't take off until the '00's.

Your timeline is off because Kast two platinum albums by the time Jagged Edge dropped their debut in the 90's.

Outkast was just one act, but you want to talk about movements, let's talk:

1) OutKast went platinum, which opened doors for Dungeon Family as a whole, which included Goodie Mob and Organized Noize

2) Organized Noize, after producing Kast's first album, went on to do "Waterfalls" for TLC, which is possibly their biggest song. This was the biggest single off their best selling album which greatly helped catapult them to one of the biggest female groups in music ever.

3) Goodie Mob came out in 1995 and went gold

4) Kast dropped their sophomore in 1996, which quickly went platinum scoring them more gold singles and a #1 rap single. The same year, Organized Noize produced a #1 single for En Vogue, which was one of their biggest singles. Organized Noize is also brought in that same year to produce what would be Curtis Mayfield's last album.

5) Kast and Goodie both drop albums in 1998. Goodie goes gold again and Aquemini is Kast's biggest album both commercially and critically in the 90's. It went 2X platinum despite none of the singles being bigger than the singles from their previous albums.

6) Goodie Mob drops another gold album in 1999. Cee Lo Green appears on Carlos Santanna's album from that same year for which he receives a Grammy. Big Boi appears on albums from Slick Rick, Missy Elliott, and Young Bloodz. Kast produces and appears on songs for Tash, Mystikal, and Eightball & MJG.

By the time Jagged Edge and Bow Wow really blew, Kast was easily bigger than both.

Kast in the 90's were bigger than anyone signed to So So Def. Organized Noize in the 90's were rivaling JD as producers.

 

[Wacky D]

So So Def alone...

Usher TLC Da Brat Xscape Jagged Edge Kriss across and Jermaine Dupri himself all made waves to push Atlanta to the forefront as one of the truly major cities for 90’s black music, it was So So Def and LaFace who Outkast Goodie Mob and Usher TLC we’re signed to who did this, in many ways the two were linked to each other to the point you could be ignorant to think someone like Usher was actually signed to So So Def.

OutKast in the 90’s was just a single group, JD already had Kriss Kross come through and smash the buildings before OutKast had a hit, by the time OutKast blew proper he was still making waves with Usher, Jagged Edge and even Lil Bow Wow.

I guess if we’re solely talking rap we can make arguments but even then ATL only took the rap scene in the last 15 years with the likes of Gucci Jeezy Lil Jon and co, OutKast in many ways were outliers.

THIS

THIS

You nikkas must’ve been dumb and deaf af cause all over that first album, if she wasn’t rapping about how she was from the Chi, she was rapping out the zip code. Nobody EVER thought Brat was from the A

what type of stupid logic is this??

nobody outside of chicago, knows that zipcode.
in fact, people thought it was an atlanta zipcode.

she wasnt rapping about chicago until the 2nd run. if she rapped about it on the 1st album, it was an album cut. nothing on the radio/video for the general public.

even peers in the industry. that video of dr dre introducing a brat video on MTV and citing her as being from atlanta, is prolly still on youtube. and that was late '96.

 

[Big Boss]

I think he only wrote for Mary on one album. I might be wrong tho. Either way they both of the biggest R&B stars of the past 30 years as far as the black community goes. It would only make sense

yea its on off the share my world album

 

[Wacky D]

Usher and TLC were not So So Def artists. Jagged Edge wasn't really a big deal in the 90's. They didn't take off until the '00's.

Your timeline is off because Kast two platinum albums by the time Jagged Edge dropped their debut in the 90's.

Outkast was just one act, but you want to talk about movements, let's talk:

Kast in the 90's were bigger than anyone signed to So So Def. Organized Noize in the 90's were rivaling JD as producers.

you wasted your time doing alot of struggle-posting. i just quoted this part.

outkast was not a big as da brat or xscape. those artists left a serious mark on the culture.
i'll take jagged edge out of this, cuz they were more of a 2000s thing.

youre gonna take this as hating, but outkast, organized noize, etc didnt have a movement. they werent culturally relevant like that. kast had their fans and did their numbers, but they were never a big thing with the people. they were a group that you either listened to or you didnt. and if you didnt listen to them, you just turned the channel and forgot about them when their video came on. you didnt even bother to hate on it. they werent polarizing at all.

best argument you can make is outkast doing huge numbers in the 2000s with stankonia & SB/TLB selling 4 & 5 mil but youre driving off the road and moreso into the crossover realm with that.
and even still, lil bow wow was a bigger phenomenon. and i'd rather be jagged edge culturally.

i'd prefer to just leave it at that, cuz youre turning this into an outkast thread. and then youre gonna point the finger at me and pretend that you werent the one who started this argument long before i chimed in 2 pages after the fact.