TI really was King of the South

[North of Death]

1) Ghetto Mafia was still a local group. A lot of people outside of GA don't know their music.

2) That wasn't credit

3) Gladly keep it.

4) We're not in agreement. You tried to credit T.I. with popularizing a term when he did far more than that. Jeezy doesn't have a lane without T.I. It wasn't a sub-genre until T.I. dropped Trap Muzik. You're saying he simply popularized a term. I'm saying he made an entire sub-genre mainstream. Big difference. And while we're at it, one of the producers who saw trap evolve from the beginning to what it is now and even worked with both Jeezy and T.I. had this to say in regard to Trap:

I have to throw T.I. because of the way he diversified the trap and took it to a whole different level.

A couple of months ago, T.I. took credit as the originator of trap music. Do you agree with him?

I mean, he took trap universally. Like, you have to understand: When things hit the scene, it comes from somewhere, just like crunk. Did Lil' Jon create crunk?

^^^ Drumma Boy's statements in regard to Trap. Drumma Boy Talks Working With 'Empire' Star Yazz & Why He's One of the 'Originators of Trap'

5) How Jeezy blew up is important because the Jeezy that dropped Trap or Die doesn't sound like the Jeezy pre-Trap or Die. He changed his style after T.I. came out with Trap Muzik.

Spot on bout Jeezy..he wasn't talking about Trap on Streetz is Watching Tape

 

[I AM WE ARE]

for the life of me i don't see how people just continue to shyt on juve

can't take nothin from lil jon but you can't put him in this discussion just cause he's similar to dj khaled

but to say p didn't put people on you had foxy brown,jay z on no limit records hov was on the ha remix with juve

when artists came down south they came to n.o./texas first no diss to atl but its true

but neck ov da woods

but everybody knows t.i. ran with the title cause nobody was claiming it, other rappers was saying they don't care about who king just gimmie my respect,tip the only one who wanted that title and as far as that tip v luda battle luda destroyed dude

 

[JustCKing]

for the life of me i don't see how people just continue to shyt on juve

can't take nothin from lil jon but you can't put him in this discussion just cause he's similar to dj khaled

but to say p didn't put people on you had foxy brown,jay z on no limit records hov was on the ha remix with juve

when artists came down south they came to n.o./texas first no diss to atl but its true

but neck ov da woods

but everybody knows t.i. ran with the title cause nobody was claiming it, other rappers was saying they don't care about who king just gimmie my respect,tip the only one who wanted that title and as far as that tip v luda battle luda destroyed dude

Lil Jon was far different from DJ Khaled. Dude dominated. Artists from all over were maling crunk records. I'm not talking about him featuring people on his albums. Artists were making crunk songs that were for their albums because it was THE sound at the time. It's the same way artists that aren't even from The South are rapping over trap beats.

Master P didn't put Foxy Brown or Jay Z on. These people were already huge before being featured on No Limit releases. Jay's feature on the "Ha" remix isn't even liked. Some say he ruined the song.That whole thing about artists coming to N.O. or Texas first isn't true. Artists iutside of The South were coming to Patchwerk in ATL to record. Birthday Bash, Freaknik, and the clubs in Atlanta also attracted outsiders. Biggie, Mase, and a lot of other East Coast rappers have talked about it.

How are you going to be a N.O. rap fanatic and not know Mystikal dubbed himself "Black Prince of The South". T.I. simply upped the ante by dubning himself king. And yes, when he was coming up, him calling himself king was a huge deal because there's interviews with Bun and Face where they discuss T.I. calling himself "King of the South".

 

[JustCKing]

For the record, no one is disrespecting Juve. Nobody's saying he was wack or didn't make an impact because he did. What's being said here is that he nor P is DIRECTLY responsible for the influx of Southern artists who blew up from 2003 forward. Neither are responsible for a sub-genre becoming mainstream either. That is all being said.

 

[North]

Young Buck ? Luda ? Jeezy? Juvie?

You know you tweaking with those and you just saying that shyt just to say it

bro juvie was a inspiration to t.i. and most def one of the greatest south rappers ever


i really loved t.i. from trap musik up to king but hot boys paved the way for most or all southern artist in the 2000's

 

[Taadow]

For the record, no one is disrespecting Juve. Nobody's saying he was wack or didn't make an impact because he did. What's being said here is that he nor P is DIRECTLY responsible for the influx of Southern artists who blew up from 2003 forward. Neither are responsible for a sub-genre becoming mainstream either. That is all being said.

T.I. ain't either.

 

[Marc Spector]

This is just bias because neither Master P or Juve took a sub genre mainstream. That whole trap sound didn't have a label or context until T.I. dropped that album.

Master P didn't legitimize The South and neither did Juve in terms of trend setting. You're better off citing Lil Jon in that regard because when P and Juve were hot, it was only the N.O. that was getting shine. Meanwhile, when Lil Jon took off everybody from Nas to E-40 to Snoop to Ice Cube was out here making crunk records. Then you had areas in The South blowing up all over. After crunk took off in ATL, T.I. had trap music getting mainstream attention. At the same time David Banner was putting Mississippi on the map. Flip was blowing up. Then in '05, Houston had a wave of artists that took off. Jeezy came in and revolutionized what T.I. did two years earlier. Memphis had a big year too specifically with "Stay Fly". '06 was the Snap craze. Wayne was taking off. This wasn't happening during P and Juve's respective runs where artists from all over the South was all you heard.

I agree with everything you said...., especially about Lil Jon being the dominant force of the South in the early 2000s...except TI didnt really set the culture/tone for trap music. Jeezy did.

With TI, it was apparent that he was striving to be a REAL rapper and not just a street guy turned rapper. "Trap Muzik" featured at the time, diverse production and song topics which was all indications that TI wasn't trying to be boxed in.

Jeezy however with his slow delivery, adlibs, strong grassroots movement, connection to BMF, sticking with a main producer (shawty redd) and not a lot of deviation in his subject matter......The streets and by proxy the d-boys/trappers LOVED Jeezy in a way that they never loved TIP and thats why I feel it was Jeezy who really brought the trap scene into prominence (at least as we know it).

TL; DR version: TI may have a given a name to it, but jeezy gave a FEEL to it, if that makes any sense.

In some ways I feel that TIs popularity and aspirations hurt him because the streets typically aren't receptive to experimentation/progression in music. Hence why Gucci pre long term prison bid essentially made the same fukkin music over and over again and was still popular. I feel that TIP doesnt have the same loyal fan base as Jeezy which is a shame because I feel that TIP made more quality music at his peak than Jeezy did.

 

[Taadow]

The South is legitimized. Regardless of how some people view The South, artists from every region are making records that sound like The South. That didn't happen under No Limit or CMR.

This is wrong.

No Limit was still self-contained. No Limit was not directly responsible for any artist's success that wasn't from New Orleans. He wasn't responsible for getting them airplay.

Young Bleed & C-Loc ain't from New Orleans
Mean Green ain't from New Orleans
Most of the folks on the West Coast Bad Boyz tapes aint' from New Orleans

Both No Limit and CMR made a particular brand of music. It wasn't the phenomenon that crunk became. Neither label had a whole industry making bouncy records. You had Nas & The Bravehearts ("Quick To Backdown"), E-40 ("Rep Yo City"), Too $hort ("Shake That Monkey") and more making crunk records. R&B artists were making crunk records.

The industry was fuccin' wit' No Limit the long way. Every artist you named here was on one of more No Limit tracks.
Montell Jordan had one of his biggest hits fuccin' wit' P and Silkk.
Destiny's Child blew up from sampling a TRU song and getting P on the remix. So what are you saying??

 

[Taadow]

With TI, it was apparent that he was striving to be a REAL rapper and not just a street guy turned rapper. "Trap Muzik" featured at the time, diverse production and song topics which was all indications that TI wasn't trying to be boxed in.

This is what I was getting at earlier.

When T.I. reached stardom he threw away that little-ass beanie he never had on his head straight, put on smedium
suits, and went campaigning to be The #1 OT Southern Rap Feature/Justin Timberlake's Cousin.

 

[North of Death]

This is what I was getting at earlier.

When T.I. reached stardom he threw away that little-ass beanie he never had on his head straight, put on smedium
suits, and went campaigning to be The #1 OT Southern Rap Feature/Justin Timberlake's Cousin.

Yet still No Trap Muzik = No Trap genre

 

[Taadow]

Yet still No Trap Muzik = No Trap genre

This is not true, though.

 

[jadillac]

TI never really fell off in terms of success.

He just sort of stopped making music as much.

Maybe drugs?

 

[JustCKing]

This is wrong.

Explain.

Young Bleed & C-Loc ain't from New Orleans
Mean Green ain't from New Orleans
Most of the folks on the West Coast Bad Boyz tapes aint' from New Orleans

Young Bleed is from Baton Rouge if I'm not mistaken. No it's not New Orleans, but still Louisiana.

C-Loc wasn't on No Limit. Young Bleed is the only artist from that label that got promo and a push as No Limit artist.

Mean Green was a DJ and I think he's from Louisiana.

Who from the West Coast Bad Boyz blew up on the strength of being on those tapes?

The industry was fuccin' wit' No Limit the long way. Every artist you named here was on one of more No Limit tracks.
Montell Jordan had one of his biggest hits fuccin' wit' P and Silkk.
Destiny's Child blew up from sampling a TRU song and getting P on the remix. So what are you saying??

I never said that the industry wasn't working with No Limit, but it was a long way from No Limit dominating the industry or being sought after the way Lil' Jon was. You can't tell me that No Limit did anything on the level of Usher's "Yeah" featuring Ludacris and Lil' Jon (produced by Lil' Jon). Then there was Ciara's "Goodies" and Petey Pablo's "Freak A Leak".

I know all of those artists were featured on albums from No Limit artists. That's not the same as them having "soldier" songs as singles promoting their own projects like they were with crunk.

Destiny's Child didn't blow up from sampling a TRU song. They blew up off a remix of one of their own songs that featured and was produced by Wyclef. That was their biggest song. And you still can't compare "Let's Ride" to any of the R&B records that Lil' Jon produced. They even dubbed the songs "Crunk N B". "Yeah" is Usher's biggest song from his biggest album. "Goodies" is Ciara's biggest song and it broke her as an artist.

 

[JustCKing]

T.I. ain't either.

Never said that he was. He is responsible for Trap though.

 

[JustCKing]

This is not true, though.

It is true. That brand of music was not poppin' on a mainstream level until T.I. Nobody was referring to it was trap anything before T.I. came along. I'm not talking about references to trap or simply using the word. I'm talking about someone actually expounding on the lifestyle and dubbing the content and the music as "trap".