Let's be real about gaming this gen.

The Devil's Advocate

Call me Dad
Joined
Jun 1, 2012
Messages
35,444
Reputation
7,644
Daps
98,332
Reppin
Better to reign in Hell than serve in Heaven
Whole thread is full of boomer babble.

With so many emerging sub genres like battle royales, extraction games, survival games, and then you got the whole VR and AR worlds, its hard to say innovation is lacking these days in gaming.
This sentiment is really just "This is how I feel about games right now..." and often times it's subjective as how can one say for example Battle Royale games haven't redefined gaming?

Yes, games aren't going to redefine genres the way a 3D game did coming from a 2D era back then a la Mario 64 or FFVII. Nowadays, games just freshen up experiences and to me, games like God of War 2018 were one example of a game that completely rebooted the series in a new way.

Like it or not, the original GOW games got stale after the 3rd one. I remember playing Ascension and being a little bored of it because it was the same thing and got tiring. Play something else that you wouldn't normally play.

If you're looking forward to AAA titles only, they're typically going to be more of the same in a way.
All these games been out for years.. They just became more popular. In fact, the first ones came out in 2013, almost 10 years ago

"Yes, games aren't going to redefine genres the way a 3D game did coming from a 2D era back then a la Mario 64 or FFVII. Nowadays, games just freshen up experiences and to me, games like God of War 2018 were one example of a game that completely rebooted the series in a new way."


Well that's the OP's point
 

Wild self

The Black Man will prosper!
Supporter
Joined
Jun 20, 2012
Messages
79,273
Reputation
10,890
Daps
213,056
So I actually thought about this a bit more and another problem that I have is the ever widening gap between AAA developers and AA developers. Nowadays it seems like there isn't much of a middle ground so to speak. You got Activision/Blizzard, Ubisoft, R* and Nintendo and Sony studios, etc. making things on the major scale, but then there's a big drop to the next level. A lot of the lower studios either have 1 or 2 games or were grandfathered in from previous generations. And that's not to mention smaller studios who kept getting swallowed up by the bigger studios.

So ignoring what we have now in the PS4/XBX era, go back to the Xbox/GameCube era and there was just MORE games. Games games games, and that's what I loved. Splinter Cell, Scarface, Punisher, Prince of Persia, Manhunt, Bully, Hulk Ultimate Destruction, etc. All different games available for all systems, from different studios and devs. Yes, Persia and Splinter Cell were Ubisoft, but where are they now, dead. My point is that before the HD era, games came out and there was just SO MUCH available to us. And that's not counting the bigger franchises and exclusives we had back then, nor the exclusives each system had as well. If you wanna say we were spoiled, fine, but that's the best way for things to be.

Now move to the 360 era and things were more apparent when you looked at the gap between AAA games and those on the next rung down. You have Assassin's Creed (Ubisoft), COD, GTA(R*), and the plethora of exclusives like Halo, GoW, GoW, Ratchet, Uncharted, Mario, Zelda etc. at that top/higher tier. But you also had games and series like Saints Row, Left 4 Dead, Sleeping Dogs, Prototype, inFAMOUS, Spider-Man games, Batman Arkham games, Borderlands etc etc. Again, we had games on games on games. Remember when it was odd that Prototype and inFAMOUS were made and released at the same time? Completely different games but still funny to think about when it happened. Now fast forward and both franchises are dead.

That moves me to the PS4/ONE era. The generation that I questioned from the very beginning. And you can see it in my first post, what were we getting with this new console generation? Because if it was just graphics, then we were going backwards. And then things got weird. We stopped getting as many new games. We started getting more remasters. Why are we re-doing the Uncharted series? They were JUST made, what the fukk? Remaster, remaster, remaster! All for the pretty graphics! I could understand taking games from systems that are defunct, from games that are at least 2 gens old. But remastering a game that came out 2 to 3 years ago is just greedy. And sadly a lot of people lapped it up that's why it's a cornerstone of what the industry is doing today. But I'm talking about games, right?

So yes, we still got games on the PS4/ONE systems, but the problem we ran into is that the industry had shot itself in the foot a bit. Microsoft made some bad choices early on and people didn't forgive them moving forward. But Sony did something right and that was their exclusives. The problem we ran into was that it was just exclusives. The big Sony exclusives are mostly good to great but we ran into the fact that there were less and less viable non-exclusive triple A and double A level games being made. The dev time got crunched and the budgets got tighter. So for example, on the PS/360 you had Mass Effect. 3 games that I'm told are amazing up until the last 20 minutes of the last game. Now fast forward to the PS4/One, you had Andromeda which everyone says was an abortion! Assassin's Creed was a big franchise on the 360, then starting with the first game of the new gen, Unity shyt the bed and hard. Shot the franchise in the foot and it limps on today. Square was a great studio that had set themselves up for failure by setting their goals too high with Hitman and Tomb Raider. They then cut ties and sold off their non Japanese properties. Things just continued to get weirder across the board.

We still got games but the widening gap was more and more apparent each year. Yeah we could get Shadow of Mordor, but the sequel pissed people off by making it unbeatable or something. Like you had to put an inhuman amount of time into the game to get the ending. Or you could just pay them for the time saver and get the ending. I'm not 100% sure on that, please correct me because I know I'm not all the way on point with that.

Finally I wanna touch on the games as a service problem that's a major fukk you to players. Business 101 says it's better to get the consumer to keep giving you money repeatedly with no end in sight. That's true. That's what Rockstar has done with GTA. They made a great game then released it (PS3), re-released it (PS4), then re-re-released it (PS5). All to keep getting that billion dollar shark card money. We all know about microtransactions, no need for me to elaborate. But even the biggest studios are guilty of it these days.

But go back with me. To Red Dead Redemption. Amazing game. Game of the Year. Game of a generation type deal. But look at what you got. The base game, online multiplayer and the upgrades that came. And then...SINGLE PLAYER STANDALONE DLC! HOLY SH!T!!! And it was amazing. Undead Nightmare was everything you wanted in a dlc. R* did it again. Same with GTA 4, a dreadful game that R* poured everything they had into. Multiple standalone dlc's came out for that game and people were happy.

Fast forward, no dlc for Red Dead 2. No dlc for GTA 5. Why? You literally have all the components, why not give the people what they want. Why does everything GTA have to be in the freaking online portion? Even though you're putting actual stories with voice acting and cutscenes. Why can't any of that be the single player dlc?

Because you can only charge the customer ONE time. 70 for the base game and 30 for the hypothetical single player dlc is only $100. But GTAO with countless shark cards is infinitely more money than that. One of the biggest studios/developers has given us the finger and said let's ride the wave. And sadly it's worked for them....for OVER A DECADE!!!

And that gap between Triple A and the next level is just too wide. And then the gap between lower level Double A games and the games under that is wide too. There are games that I wish were more polished. Take Vampyr for instance. It's an ok game. But if it had just a bit more budget, it would have been a lot better. The graphics aren't gonna blow you away. The character design is right out of the 360 era, but what they had was a great base but it lacked polish. And it hurts because I wish we had more games on the level of say, a Hulk Ultimate Destruction. Games that won't blow you away but they are fun a fukk to play. I wish we had more games with more variety in setting. Steampunk is over done, modern day is the standard and open world fantasy is more often chosen over a more supernatural setting. Whether it be historical or modern. I wish we had more werewolf and vampire games that were good. Werewolf Apocalypse looked alright until you played it and it wasn't polished either. Again it's a symptom of the divide in quality based on budgets.

Gaming used to be fun first and foremost. Now it's big business first and the fun can be patched in later.

:whew:

Exactly what I was thinking. The OG X Box/PS2/GC gen was loaded with great 3D games.

PS3, was when 3rd party companies shutting down due to the recession and the innovation factor outside Nintendo never came back.
 

Gritsngravy

Superstar
Joined
Mar 11, 2022
Messages
8,018
Reputation
567
Daps
16,150
It used to be every generation.. Everything I named came from a different gen. It stopped in the last two. I don't remember much game changing from the xbone/ps4 era.. And nothing so far from ps5 (psvr2 on the way) besides the controller.. Which isn't exactly game changing just yet

And who said a gimmick? Nothing I said was a gimmick. You'd be upset if any controller didn't rumble right now. Or any open world game that didn't take numerous elements from GTA 3.. Good/Great games should be the standard. Gaming altering games should at least pop up once a year if you really pushing the envelope and not just doing sequels and retreads

Horizon 2 and GOW 2... Amazing games. What did they bring to the table that changed anything in gaming?
That camera shyt was a gimmick, wii was a gimmick, what was game changing in the 360 ps3 era ,Fast loading could be considered game changing
but my point is what else could possibly push gaming forward except better graphics and bigger worlds, you consider gta 3 game changing but that’s only because the system was powerful enough to allow that to happen, is Elden ring not game changing in the same sense gta 3 is
The only thing that’s altering the industry is if somebody puts out a raw ass engine which is a long process
 

Gritsngravy

Superstar
Joined
Mar 11, 2022
Messages
8,018
Reputation
567
Daps
16,150
Well then you have say....cyberpunk come out, which was a (new)AAA dev trying to create an rpg that was a step ahead of the fallouts of yester year. And in my opinion, it accomplished that in spades.

The only problem was...alot of erm..chuds...wanted to play it too. But to them it didnt matter who was making it and what their pedigree was, to most it looked like a GTA mext step. Which it wasnt. And when those people realized it wasnt, on top of a buggy launch. They RAILED it. As we all know.

This game was far more interesting, ambitious, and better written than say...any ubisoft game. But CDPROJEKT...one of the few devs trying to push things, got nearly black labeled. Because of bandwagoning and misinterpreation.

If you want your medium to keep being ambitious...you dont target fukking CDPROJEKT RED of all devs to go on a campaign against.

Reserve that for ubisoft, activision, EA, 2K
etc.

Then you wonder why no devs will try anything. Stupid fukks.

Not sure how much longer i can deal with sharing a hobby with kids that werent even born when half life 2 came out lol
They shouldn’t be bullied to release a unfinished game that’s on them
 

Gritsngravy

Superstar
Joined
Mar 11, 2022
Messages
8,018
Reputation
567
Daps
16,150
They wont.

They shouldnt even be excited for starfield because bethesda has been the definition of dumbing down, lazy development, and stripping their games of content. Fallout 4 was bad, and so was fallout 76, hell skyrim wasnt as good or had nearly as good quests as oblivion or morrowind. But only a few people seem to love gaming enough to notice that lol

So then bethesda thinks skyrim is their best shyt. And thinks procedural quests are the way to keep going. Because gamers praised it. Does this sound like a medium thats going to move forward?

We dont even know that bethesda has been on a downturn. Yet we still want starfield? We railed against CDPROJEkT when i'd bet my bank account CP2077 will be better than starfield?

If you took a time traveler to go visit 2004 me, while i was amazed with half life 2. And that time traveler said "you want me to show you how far weve come in 2022?" I'd look at half life 2 and say "my god...i can only imagine, show me! Please!" He shows me elden ring...

I proceed to kill myself.


Yeah i should retire lmao
Fallout 4 is a great game
Skyrim wasn’t good?
Get off cdprojekt dikk, Bethesda been holding the industry down for years and gets shytted on for they buggy games, cdprojekt isn’t above reproach because they released an aight game in the Witcher 3
 

Gizmo_Duck

blathering blatherskite!
Joined
Aug 15, 2018
Messages
72,116
Reputation
5,359
Daps
152,734
Reppin
Duckburg, NY
nanite and lumens of UE5 is already a game changer.

If you read about what Haven studios is doing (and what they’ve done with Google) you’ll know theres a lot of stuff they’re doing with cloud and AI. They are creating a automated process to develop blueprints for actual working games and designs using the same AI you see in the arcadium art thread. They are applying that to the entire process of making AAA games. Which will significantly cut down development time and get rid of scope creep. Less trial and error when designing big games.

Thats why Sony bought them. It wasn’t just for another multiplayer game it was their expertise in cloud and AI



The SSD’s and Kraken technology. VR and AR. Etc

Theres a lot of stuff going on behind the scenes but like i said, ya’ll are just impatient and expect ground breaking stuff too soon. Let devs develop games on actual next gen engines before you decide to commit gaming seppuku over cross-gen.

Technology is always evolving and every big platform holder is investing billions of dollars into gaming right now. We’ll see by mid gen some fruits of all this starting to bare. I feel like even the games and stuff being given as “game changers” is very surface level. Things like smarter enemy design and not squeezing through cracks isn’t a technology problem its a design problem.
 
Last edited:

The Devil's Advocate

Call me Dad
Joined
Jun 1, 2012
Messages
35,444
Reputation
7,644
Daps
98,332
Reppin
Better to reign in Hell than serve in Heaven
That camera shyt was a gimmick, wii was a gimmick, what was game changing in the 360 ps3 era ,Fast loading could be considered game changing
but my point is what else could possibly push gaming forward except better graphics and bigger worlds, you consider gta 3 game changing but that’s only because the system was powerful enough to allow that to happen, is Elden ring not game changing in the same sense gta 3 is
The only thing that’s altering the industry is if somebody puts out a raw ass engine which is a long process
Look at the post above this one. And if you look at my very first post in this thread, I said AI improving would be the innovation.

That's what I'm talking about. Something that changes the way we play. Wii and Kinect (360) have lead us to VR gaming, which is the other thing that I said is innovation (def: a new method, idea, product, etc.)

These games coming out now are not new methods or ideas. They are literally the same methods to obtain the same ideas, over and over again. Bigger, stronger, faster is not a NEW idea. AI learning that you like to run shotgun hitch routes to the right on 3 and 4, that's some innovation. If cloud powered gaming takes off, that's some innovation.

I get it. It's hard to constantly innovate, and expensive, and a huge risk. But we in a period of stagnation.
 

Wild self

The Black Man will prosper!
Supporter
Joined
Jun 20, 2012
Messages
79,273
Reputation
10,890
Daps
213,056
Look at the post above this one. And if you look at my very first post in this thread, I said AI improving would be the innovation.

That's what I'm talking about. Something that changes the way we play. Wii and Kinect (360) have lead us to VR gaming, which is the other thing that I said is innovation (def: a new method, idea, product, etc.)

These games coming out now are not new methods or ideas. They are literally the same methods to obtain the same ideas, over and over again. Bigger, stronger, faster is not a NEW idea. AI learning that you like to run shotgun hitch routes to the right on 3 and 4, that's some innovation. If cloud powered gaming takes off, that's some innovation.

I get it. It's hard to constantly innovate, and expensive, and a huge risk. But we in a period of stagnation.

Blame Sony for that. They want to triple down on graphics and not much else. The PS6 will be the same thing.

I said that time and time again that Sony is stagnating gaming and refusing to make innovative hardware.
 

Gizmo_Duck

blathering blatherskite!
Joined
Aug 15, 2018
Messages
72,116
Reputation
5,359
Daps
152,734
Reppin
Duckburg, NY
Blame Sony for that. They want to triple down on graphics and not much else. The PS6 will be the same thing.

I said that time and time again that Sony is stagnating gaming and refusing to make innovative hardware.

Sony is literally launching a state of the art VR headset in less than two months. :dahell:

If Sonys not being innovative who is? They’re the only ones that significantly changed their console and hardware accessories this generation
 

feelosofer

#ninergang
Joined
May 17, 2012
Messages
46,917
Reputation
6,426
Daps
129,838
Reppin
Brick City, NJ
I think the cost of making games has made studios risk averse. I think it will get better as the tech becomes more widely available and it may take another 2 or 3 years before we see more high level niche games to go along with your staple military and zombie shooters.
 

Gritsngravy

Superstar
Joined
Mar 11, 2022
Messages
8,018
Reputation
567
Daps
16,150
Blame Sony for that. They want to triple down on graphics and not much else. The PS6 will be the same thing.

I said that time and time again that Sony is stagnating gaming and refusing to make innovative hardware.
Sony puts out new ip’s you can’t say they stagnating the industry
 

Fatboi1

Veteran
Supporter
Joined
May 6, 2012
Messages
60,131
Reputation
7,898
Daps
110,124
You laugh but this is textbook "innovation". If true as some dissenters would have you believe that Sony is "all about graphics", Sony would've never ventured on with VR since that's typically contingent upon strictly gameplay innovation. Playing Astrobot in VR was definitely a game changer in that I wished NIntendo would go that route for some of their games but then again you guys would've been having convulsions if Microsoft was launching a VR headset.

Sony could come out with a brand new IP that literally is filled to the brim with player agency like Elden Ring, exploration and physics based gameplay with tools and no single path like BOTW with super tight mechanics, while having beautiful industry crushing graphics and a well presented story with high production values and you CLOWNS would still say "Mann... this game is too overwhelming..."
 
Last edited:

Gritsngravy

Superstar
Joined
Mar 11, 2022
Messages
8,018
Reputation
567
Daps
16,150
Look at the post above this one. And if you look at my very first post in this thread, I said AI improving would be the innovation.

That's what I'm talking about. Something that changes the way we play. Wii and Kinect (360) have lead us to VR gaming, which is the other thing that I said is innovation (def: a new method, idea, product, etc.)

These games coming out now are not new methods or ideas. They are literally the same methods to obtain the same ideas, over and over again. Bigger, stronger, faster is not a NEW idea. AI learning that you like to run shotgun hitch routes to the right on 3 and 4, that's some innovation. If cloud powered gaming takes off, that's some innovation.

I get it. It's hard to constantly innovate, and expensive, and a huge risk. But we in a period of stagnation.
In my opinion new ip’s are new ideas, and if we in a period of stagnation then it didn’t start last gen, stagnation been here since whenever the first Xbox came out
 
Top