feelosofer
#ninergang
So we're gonna act like the Klitchskos haven't had the Heavyweight division on lock for the past decade or so? He made Lennox Lewis not not comeback.
Is Marciano the most overrated heavy weight boxer alltime?
- Thread starter BrothaZay
- Start date
So we're gonna act like the Klitchskos haven't had the Heavyweight division on lock for the past decade or so? He made Lennox Lewis not not comeback.
Saysumthinfunnymike
VOTE!!!
No, we're going to tell it how it is. There's no competition out there. Shannon fukking Briggs was fighting for one of their belts not long ago.
I'll repeat that. Shannon Briggs @ 38-years old.
feelosofer
#ninergang
I still think they could've kept up with better boxers, I mean I suppose we'll never know but they are both very good boxers.
Saysumthinfunnymike
VOTE!!!
I'm not saying they aren't talented but how can we truly gauge what they are capable of with how weak the division is?
At one time Tim Sylvia and Andrei Arlovski were running heavyweight in UFC. If someone told you now that they were great fighters they would be laughed out of the room.
I'm saying that we will probably never see them fight against other elite fighters.
It's not their fault.. it is what it is.
At one time Tim Sylvia and Andrei Arlovski were running heavyweight in UFC. If someone told you now that they were great fighters they would be laughed out of the room.
I'm saying that we will probably never see them fight against other elite fighters.
It's not their fault.. it is what it is.
Dr Dre's ProductionSkills
Hutch, yella, Mel-man, Daz, Mike Elizondo
ocky Marciano - The Unstoppable Force
31.08.05 - By James Sadler: Rocky Marciano was undoubtedly one of the squared circle's greatest champions. He first came to my attention when I was sitting next to my grandfather watching the famous film "Rocky." I remember seeing the photo of Rocky Marciano on the character "Rocky Balboa's" wall, and so I naturally asked my grandfather about him. He told me the stories of how Marciano was undefeated, a human steamroller with a granite chin, who would never stop coming forward. He often told me how he won a fight with his nose split in two, and how no man was ever the same afterwards. Since then, I became vaguely intrigued, and when I reached the more 'mature' age of eleven, I recalled my grandfather's stories and started to delve deeply into the old books to find out more. I was not disappointed.
Rocky Marciano was an unstoppable force, a true ironman of the ring. An undefeated professional fighter, Rocky is one of the greatest champions of all time.
However, this is not just based on his impressive statistics - let's take it a step further and look at Marciano in more detail.
Perhaps the thing Marciano is most noted for was his ability to knock a man flat with one punch. Rocky Marciano was an extremely hard puncher, and some old timers cling onto the belief that he hit harder than huge men such as Sonny Liston, George Foreman and Earnie Shavers. This I can understand, seeing the way Rocky reduced a several 200lb, world class athletes to quivering wrecks with his crunching fists. Jersey Joe Walcott was the most famous victim of Marciano's dynamite punch, but there were others - Of his more famous victories, Joe Louis, Rex Layne and Harry Matthews were also dispatched by one or two savage punches. The right hand that knocked out Layne sheered his teeth off at the gums. Rocky even broke Roland LaStarza's arms! LaStarza needed surgery to repair the chips and cracks on his elbows, and to repair his smashed blood vessels.
Marciano used to train on a custom made 300lb heavy bag - about three times what most heavyweight's punchbags weigh. Rocky had to work harder to move the bag around - this is most probably how he developed so much punishing power.
However, Rocky had always showed a natural ability for punching. The first thing that caught trainer Charley Goldman's eye, after Rocky knocked out an audition sparring partner, was his tremendous leverage. Even from the start, he was an extremely hard hitter, and probably a harder hitter back then at the dawn of his career than after 1952.
It was once claimed during tests in the 1960s, that Rocky's right hand punch contained as much explosive energy as an armour piercing bullet.
Marciano was also terribly strong, especially for his size. Archie Moore claimed he "was far and away the strongest man I've encountered."
Joe Louis said "it hurt to even bump into him."
One of Marciano's amateur opponents said "he was the hardest, most solid man I've ever seen."
Rocky had all over body strength, and his muscles were compact and solid. His arms and legs were short and stocky, and he was very muscular. He was never wrestled about or put on the back foot by anybody, and always shoved people about in the clinches.
There's one thing about Rocky that is quite unquestionable - he had amazing stamina. He would run all year round, keeping himself in shape. He would even run six or seven miles on Christmas morning! Before fights, he'd often up that to fifteen miles - much more than any other heavyweight did or does. So, no wonder he could fight all night long.
Rocky had a great workrate, often throwing ninety punches per round. He'd have some rounds where he'd throw one hundred and twenty shots! Experienced craftsmen and good boxers such as LaStarza, Charles and Moore, simply could not cope with Rocky's onslaught. Archie Moore - "It was like fighting an airplane propeller."
Most experts agree that Marciano was the best conditioned heavyweight of all time.
Marciano had an amazing chin. He was only floored twice in his career, and was rarely hurt. The two times he was dropped, were for a three and a two count, by two great punchers. Ring Magazine's #4 All Time Great Puncher Archie Moore floored Rocky with a perfect right hand as Marciano came in, missing a punch, with one foot off the floor, and it landed right on the chin. But Rocky was up within two seconds and back fighting. Jersey Joe Walcott, also rated by the Ring as an all time great puncher, floored Rocky with one of his classic left hooks, but was surprised to see that when he turned around, Marciano was staring straight back at him, on his feet. Rocky roared; "I'll get you, you son of a bytch!"
The 6'4" 220lbs Carmine Vingo, a good prospect with a dynamite punch, staggered Rocky a couple of times, but never managed to put him down. It was a great slugfest, and Rocky fought back hard - in the sixth round Vingo was put into a coma, courtesy of a savage left hook to the jaw.
Rocky's awkwardness was actually one of Marciano's strengths. Many found his unorthodox way of fighting very difficult to cope with - even masters of the game like Louis, Walcott, Charles and Moore all found it hard to land a clean shot on Rocky. He was just so slippery. With underrated defensive abilities, Rocky would slip the jab and get inside, weaving and ducking, throwing hard punches from all sorts of inconceivable angles. He was a very hard man to fight.
Perhaps Rocky's greatest attribute was the mental side of it. He had an amazing heart, able to cope with any situation and turn it around, never discouraged. Floored, cut and beaten up by Walcott, with his eyes stinging, Rocky fought through round ten of their first clash like a true warrior and ended up winning the title. He was determined to kick your ass. Sometimes, one gets the impression he could never be beaten.
While perhaps not one of Rocky's strengths, his defence was certainly not 'bad', as some so-called historians would like to point out. No, Marciano's defence was not bad at all, and it often made for a very difficult fight. He'd come in inch-by-inch, leaning backwards and slightly to the right (away from right leads), gloves high and chin down. The whole point of this was to make himself a smaller target. Once inside, Rocky was a real terror. He would constantly be moving his head, up and down, rolling around, side to side, backwards and forwards, and he'd come in with hard punches from all kinds of inconceivable angles, possibly the most hazardous being the left uppercut which is somehow overlooked. Many men, including great craftsmen, commented on how hard Marciano was to nail with a clean shot. If accomplished masters of the game such as Charles, Walcott, Moore, Louis and LaStarza are saying this, I think we should take their word for it.
Rocky was a destroyer, he ruined people. None of his opponents, bar Moore, were ever the same again. He beat them up, rearranged their bone structure and knocked them out. He was perhaps the most devastating and destructive champion of all time.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
One thing a lot of so-called 'experts' like to use as ammunition to try and downplay Marciano and his achievements, is his competition. However, the fighters he fought are not to be messed with...
Rocky Marciano's competition:
Up and coming prospect Carmine Vingo (6ft 4, 220lbs), a heavy hitting slugger who was involved in a Dempsey-Firpo type match up with Rocky. Was knocked out in the sixth round and sent into a coma, which left him paralysed on one side of his body and unable to continue his boxing career.
Roland LaStarza, an acomplished mover-boxer that was beating anyone and everyone, Rocky beat him twice - the first a controversial decision, the second left LaStarza in hospital with a broken arm, several blood clots and requiring surgery.
Veteran contender Lee Savold, someone who had fought Joe Louis amongst other big name heavyweights of the time. Savold's management threw in the towel before round six ended, Savold having been bashed so badly he was unable to throw punches back.
Top contender Rex Layne. Layne was a favourite over Marciano, a heavy punching slugger who reminded people of the great Jack Dempsey, who had great success in the ring, including a victory over Jersey Joe Walcott. His record going into the Marciano fight was 34-1-2 with 24 knockouts. Marciano knocked him out in six rounds, breaking his jaw and knocking out a tooth.
Joe Louis, the great champion who had came out of retirement to help pay his bills. Although considered 'over the hill' by many, Louis was still a very dangerous fighter, beating all the other fighters around at the time, and was looking to have another crack at the heavyweight title after beating Marciano. Rocky knocked him out in eight rounds and ended Joe's career.
Harry Matthews was Rocky's last fight before facing Walcott, and he took him out in style. Another good fighter, Matthews was ranked #5 in the division, and had an impressive record of 96-3-6 before facing Marciano. In this fight, Rocky completely outgunned Matthews, knocking him out brutally in the second round with two vicious left hooks.
Jersey Joe Walcott was a 38 year old veteran who had knocked down Joe Louis three times, beaten the highly regarded Ezzard Charles and was, of course, the Heavyweight Champion of the World. Walcott was not over the hill - infact far from it, he was close to his peak. He had boxed for many years in obscurity, and after getting his shot at Louis, he finally came alive. He was a dangerous boxer who didn't learn new moves - he invented them. Rocky was being outpointed over thirteen rounds, although being blinded for three of those, only to score a devastating and brutal knockout to win the title.
Ezzard Charles, another dangerous contender, fought Rocky twice and even lasted the distance with him the first time around. Charles was a highly regarded heavyweight, an ex champion who had gotten the better of Joe Louis and Jersey Joe Walcott, and was one of the only light heavyweights in history that made it big time in the top division. Although being outclassed by Charles's skills at first, Rocky swang the fight in his favour and turned the tide in order to win a unanimous decision over Charles in a brutal fifteen round fight. In the second fight, Rocky's nose was infamously split open down the middle, when Charles hit him with an elbow after missing an uppercut. Rocky fought on with the injury, seemingly not bothered about his nose, to knock Charles out with an unstoppable barrage of punches in the eighth.
Archie "The Ol' Mongoose" Moore was one of the best light heavyweights ever, and was beating all the heavyweights around - except Marciano. Moore was a veteran and a great all round fighter, a craftsman who knew all the tricks of the trade. Although old, like Walcott he was still very dangerous and considered near his best, some even think his defensive performance against Marciano was the best in history. Coming back from an early flash knockdown, Marciano came back to batter Moore throughout the seventh, eighth and ninth rounds, leaving the courageous "Ancient Archie" literally unable to stand after being counted out.
Don Cockell was the British Champion, and although thought to be fat and out of shape, he was in superb condition - he had a medical problem, which made him slightly chubby. He was thought not to be much of a problem for Marciano, although he was still a legit contender and the best in Britain. Marciano knocked him out in nine rounds, taking a while to wear off some ring rustiness suffered through inactivity. It was a brutal fight, and Cockell was being sick in his corner between rounds, as a result of the extreme punishment his body was absorbing. The referee halted the bout to prevent any serious injuries.
If you have read this, you have hopefully come to the conclusion that Rocky Marciano didn't have bad competition. Just because fighters were old it doesn't mean they don't count as great or dangerous fighters, and just because you've never heard of an opponent, it doesn't mean they should just be dismissed as bums or nobodies.
As a champion, Rocky deserves to be in the top five somewhere. He trained religiously, never gloated over beaten opponents, was never cocky and fought everyone around. Also, outside the ring he was like a champion should be, an icon of his age. He signed autographs, spent time with fans, loved his family and tried his best to be a decent man. 49-0 is his legacy, and I hope nobody ever breaks that record.
31.08.05 - By James Sadler: Rocky Marciano was undoubtedly one of the squared circle's greatest champions. He first came to my attention when I was sitting next to my grandfather watching the famous film "Rocky." I remember seeing the photo of Rocky Marciano on the character "Rocky Balboa's" wall, and so I naturally asked my grandfather about him. He told me the stories of how Marciano was undefeated, a human steamroller with a granite chin, who would never stop coming forward. He often told me how he won a fight with his nose split in two, and how no man was ever the same afterwards. Since then, I became vaguely intrigued, and when I reached the more 'mature' age of eleven, I recalled my grandfather's stories and started to delve deeply into the old books to find out more. I was not disappointed.
Rocky Marciano was an unstoppable force, a true ironman of the ring. An undefeated professional fighter, Rocky is one of the greatest champions of all time.
However, this is not just based on his impressive statistics - let's take it a step further and look at Marciano in more detail.
Perhaps the thing Marciano is most noted for was his ability to knock a man flat with one punch. Rocky Marciano was an extremely hard puncher, and some old timers cling onto the belief that he hit harder than huge men such as Sonny Liston, George Foreman and Earnie Shavers. This I can understand, seeing the way Rocky reduced a several 200lb, world class athletes to quivering wrecks with his crunching fists. Jersey Joe Walcott was the most famous victim of Marciano's dynamite punch, but there were others - Of his more famous victories, Joe Louis, Rex Layne and Harry Matthews were also dispatched by one or two savage punches. The right hand that knocked out Layne sheered his teeth off at the gums. Rocky even broke Roland LaStarza's arms! LaStarza needed surgery to repair the chips and cracks on his elbows, and to repair his smashed blood vessels.
Marciano used to train on a custom made 300lb heavy bag - about three times what most heavyweight's punchbags weigh. Rocky had to work harder to move the bag around - this is most probably how he developed so much punishing power.
However, Rocky had always showed a natural ability for punching. The first thing that caught trainer Charley Goldman's eye, after Rocky knocked out an audition sparring partner, was his tremendous leverage. Even from the start, he was an extremely hard hitter, and probably a harder hitter back then at the dawn of his career than after 1952.
It was once claimed during tests in the 1960s, that Rocky's right hand punch contained as much explosive energy as an armour piercing bullet.
Marciano was also terribly strong, especially for his size. Archie Moore claimed he "was far and away the strongest man I've encountered."
Joe Louis said "it hurt to even bump into him."
One of Marciano's amateur opponents said "he was the hardest, most solid man I've ever seen."
Rocky had all over body strength, and his muscles were compact and solid. His arms and legs were short and stocky, and he was very muscular. He was never wrestled about or put on the back foot by anybody, and always shoved people about in the clinches.
There's one thing about Rocky that is quite unquestionable - he had amazing stamina. He would run all year round, keeping himself in shape. He would even run six or seven miles on Christmas morning! Before fights, he'd often up that to fifteen miles - much more than any other heavyweight did or does. So, no wonder he could fight all night long.
Rocky had a great workrate, often throwing ninety punches per round. He'd have some rounds where he'd throw one hundred and twenty shots! Experienced craftsmen and good boxers such as LaStarza, Charles and Moore, simply could not cope with Rocky's onslaught. Archie Moore - "It was like fighting an airplane propeller."
Most experts agree that Marciano was the best conditioned heavyweight of all time.
Marciano had an amazing chin. He was only floored twice in his career, and was rarely hurt. The two times he was dropped, were for a three and a two count, by two great punchers. Ring Magazine's #4 All Time Great Puncher Archie Moore floored Rocky with a perfect right hand as Marciano came in, missing a punch, with one foot off the floor, and it landed right on the chin. But Rocky was up within two seconds and back fighting. Jersey Joe Walcott, also rated by the Ring as an all time great puncher, floored Rocky with one of his classic left hooks, but was surprised to see that when he turned around, Marciano was staring straight back at him, on his feet. Rocky roared; "I'll get you, you son of a bytch!"
The 6'4" 220lbs Carmine Vingo, a good prospect with a dynamite punch, staggered Rocky a couple of times, but never managed to put him down. It was a great slugfest, and Rocky fought back hard - in the sixth round Vingo was put into a coma, courtesy of a savage left hook to the jaw.
Rocky's awkwardness was actually one of Marciano's strengths. Many found his unorthodox way of fighting very difficult to cope with - even masters of the game like Louis, Walcott, Charles and Moore all found it hard to land a clean shot on Rocky. He was just so slippery. With underrated defensive abilities, Rocky would slip the jab and get inside, weaving and ducking, throwing hard punches from all sorts of inconceivable angles. He was a very hard man to fight.
Perhaps Rocky's greatest attribute was the mental side of it. He had an amazing heart, able to cope with any situation and turn it around, never discouraged. Floored, cut and beaten up by Walcott, with his eyes stinging, Rocky fought through round ten of their first clash like a true warrior and ended up winning the title. He was determined to kick your ass. Sometimes, one gets the impression he could never be beaten.
While perhaps not one of Rocky's strengths, his defence was certainly not 'bad', as some so-called historians would like to point out. No, Marciano's defence was not bad at all, and it often made for a very difficult fight. He'd come in inch-by-inch, leaning backwards and slightly to the right (away from right leads), gloves high and chin down. The whole point of this was to make himself a smaller target. Once inside, Rocky was a real terror. He would constantly be moving his head, up and down, rolling around, side to side, backwards and forwards, and he'd come in with hard punches from all kinds of inconceivable angles, possibly the most hazardous being the left uppercut which is somehow overlooked. Many men, including great craftsmen, commented on how hard Marciano was to nail with a clean shot. If accomplished masters of the game such as Charles, Walcott, Moore, Louis and LaStarza are saying this, I think we should take their word for it.
Rocky was a destroyer, he ruined people. None of his opponents, bar Moore, were ever the same again. He beat them up, rearranged their bone structure and knocked them out. He was perhaps the most devastating and destructive champion of all time.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
One thing a lot of so-called 'experts' like to use as ammunition to try and downplay Marciano and his achievements, is his competition. However, the fighters he fought are not to be messed with...
Rocky Marciano's competition:
Up and coming prospect Carmine Vingo (6ft 4, 220lbs), a heavy hitting slugger who was involved in a Dempsey-Firpo type match up with Rocky. Was knocked out in the sixth round and sent into a coma, which left him paralysed on one side of his body and unable to continue his boxing career.
Roland LaStarza, an acomplished mover-boxer that was beating anyone and everyone, Rocky beat him twice - the first a controversial decision, the second left LaStarza in hospital with a broken arm, several blood clots and requiring surgery.
Veteran contender Lee Savold, someone who had fought Joe Louis amongst other big name heavyweights of the time. Savold's management threw in the towel before round six ended, Savold having been bashed so badly he was unable to throw punches back.
Top contender Rex Layne. Layne was a favourite over Marciano, a heavy punching slugger who reminded people of the great Jack Dempsey, who had great success in the ring, including a victory over Jersey Joe Walcott. His record going into the Marciano fight was 34-1-2 with 24 knockouts. Marciano knocked him out in six rounds, breaking his jaw and knocking out a tooth.
Joe Louis, the great champion who had came out of retirement to help pay his bills. Although considered 'over the hill' by many, Louis was still a very dangerous fighter, beating all the other fighters around at the time, and was looking to have another crack at the heavyweight title after beating Marciano. Rocky knocked him out in eight rounds and ended Joe's career.
Harry Matthews was Rocky's last fight before facing Walcott, and he took him out in style. Another good fighter, Matthews was ranked #5 in the division, and had an impressive record of 96-3-6 before facing Marciano. In this fight, Rocky completely outgunned Matthews, knocking him out brutally in the second round with two vicious left hooks.
Jersey Joe Walcott was a 38 year old veteran who had knocked down Joe Louis three times, beaten the highly regarded Ezzard Charles and was, of course, the Heavyweight Champion of the World. Walcott was not over the hill - infact far from it, he was close to his peak. He had boxed for many years in obscurity, and after getting his shot at Louis, he finally came alive. He was a dangerous boxer who didn't learn new moves - he invented them. Rocky was being outpointed over thirteen rounds, although being blinded for three of those, only to score a devastating and brutal knockout to win the title.
Ezzard Charles, another dangerous contender, fought Rocky twice and even lasted the distance with him the first time around. Charles was a highly regarded heavyweight, an ex champion who had gotten the better of Joe Louis and Jersey Joe Walcott, and was one of the only light heavyweights in history that made it big time in the top division. Although being outclassed by Charles's skills at first, Rocky swang the fight in his favour and turned the tide in order to win a unanimous decision over Charles in a brutal fifteen round fight. In the second fight, Rocky's nose was infamously split open down the middle, when Charles hit him with an elbow after missing an uppercut. Rocky fought on with the injury, seemingly not bothered about his nose, to knock Charles out with an unstoppable barrage of punches in the eighth.
Archie "The Ol' Mongoose" Moore was one of the best light heavyweights ever, and was beating all the heavyweights around - except Marciano. Moore was a veteran and a great all round fighter, a craftsman who knew all the tricks of the trade. Although old, like Walcott he was still very dangerous and considered near his best, some even think his defensive performance against Marciano was the best in history. Coming back from an early flash knockdown, Marciano came back to batter Moore throughout the seventh, eighth and ninth rounds, leaving the courageous "Ancient Archie" literally unable to stand after being counted out.
Don Cockell was the British Champion, and although thought to be fat and out of shape, he was in superb condition - he had a medical problem, which made him slightly chubby. He was thought not to be much of a problem for Marciano, although he was still a legit contender and the best in Britain. Marciano knocked him out in nine rounds, taking a while to wear off some ring rustiness suffered through inactivity. It was a brutal fight, and Cockell was being sick in his corner between rounds, as a result of the extreme punishment his body was absorbing. The referee halted the bout to prevent any serious injuries.
If you have read this, you have hopefully come to the conclusion that Rocky Marciano didn't have bad competition. Just because fighters were old it doesn't mean they don't count as great or dangerous fighters, and just because you've never heard of an opponent, it doesn't mean they should just be dismissed as bums or nobodies.
As a champion, Rocky deserves to be in the top five somewhere. He trained religiously, never gloated over beaten opponents, was never cocky and fought everyone around. Also, outside the ring he was like a champion should be, an icon of his age. He signed autographs, spent time with fans, loved his family and tried his best to be a decent man. 49-0 is his legacy, and I hope nobody ever breaks that record.
Dr Dre's ProductionSkills
Hutch, yella, Mel-man, Daz, Mike Elizondo
Marciano wouldve made tyson his bit1ch....
lol at some of you here thinking a prime tyson who what was 18-21 could hold up against marcino in his prime...
cause we all know tyson after douglas wouldve been sent to hell like holyfield did
but on here rock prob has no punching power, mike wouldve tapped that chin etc.... ducktales...
funny thing is if somebody would ask tyson about marciano im sure he wouldnt be dismissive as some ppl here are based on the color of their skin or year they fought... after all tyson im sure himself studied the fukk out of rock....
190 soaking wet KO'in bigger guys...
lol at some of you here thinking a prime tyson who what was 18-21 could hold up against marcino in his prime...
cause we all know tyson after douglas wouldve been sent to hell like holyfield did
but on here rock prob has no punching power, mike wouldve tapped that chin etc.... ducktales...
funny thing is if somebody would ask tyson about marciano im sure he wouldnt be dismissive as some ppl here are based on the color of their skin or year they fought... after all tyson im sure himself studied the fukk out of rock....
190 soaking wet KO'in bigger guys...
Rocky is the wilt chamberlin of boxing. He accomplished alot of impressive feats against subpar opponents. Would he be a good boxer today or in the golden era? yeah probably just like wilt would be a good ball player today. but you wouldn't see any 100 point games from them.
Dr Dre's ProductionSkills
Hutch, yella, Mel-man, Daz, Mike Elizondo
Rocky is the wilt chamberlin of boxing. He accomplished alot of impressive feats against subpar opponents. Would he be a good boxer today or in the golden era? yeah probably just like wilt would be a good ball player today. but you wouldn't see any 100 point games from them.
you prob could say that about 75% of the baseball hof and everyother hof player...
that dont make them overrated
again... not sure if tyson was doing what rock was doing shearing off peoples teeth or breaking blood vessels in ppls arms but that shi1t was happening.. from this supposed overrated white boy....
guy had power, guy had a chin, guy had amazing stamina.... not sure hwo that makes him overrated when his contemporaries are tell you he is the strongest guy they have fought...
The Fukin Prophecy
RIP Champ
I dont entirely disagree...
Vitali is legit to me, it's hard to hate on a dude whose only losses came from freakish injuries in fights he was winning...He's got the size, strength, good jab, solid chin and nasty overhand right...He's also quite slick for a man his size...I can confidently say he could of been a serious contender in any era...
Wladimir on the other hand is actually more talented, dude has one of the best jabs in the history of the division...Unlike his brother though he's a fukkin stiff one dimensional robot, soft as baby shyt and has a glass jaw...He's gotten away with it because he hasn't fought anyone with the speed, power and ability to get inside on him...That bytchass nikka Haye was easily his best opponent but that fool was trying to land a haymaker from the outside all fight long...I cannot see Wladimir lasting long against Inside fighters like a prime Frazier and Tyson would have been able to get inside and test that glass jaw...
for those saying its not marciano, have yall ever looked at his opponents' records?
Rocky Marciano - Boxer
some records after his 15th fight
23-13-3
9-9-0
60-49-9
18-10-0
22-20-5 (26th fight)
63-57-10 (29th fight)
8-8-1 (31st)
3-13-3 (32nd)
13-15-1 (33rd)
11-14-2 (34th)
24-14-8 (39th of 49 fights)
Rocky Marciano - Boxer
some records after his 15th fight
23-13-3
9-9-0
60-49-9
18-10-0
22-20-5 (26th fight)
63-57-10 (29th fight)
8-8-1 (31st)
3-13-3 (32nd)
13-15-1 (33rd)
11-14-2 (34th)
24-14-8 (39th of 49 fights)
threattonature
Veteran
Part of the problem with heavyweight boxing is that it's hard to truly appreciate the division until the champ is away. For instance with Ali, he really wouldn't go down as the legend he does if he never had his exile and Frazier was allowed to build his name up.
Fighter's get looked at as great by beating other names. Foreman became a name after beating Frazier. Throw Norton in that mix as well for becoming a name after his wars with other names.
Anytime a champion is dominant it prevents anybody else from making a name for themselves. I actually agree with Tyson saying that him going to jail allowed a lot of names be made.
Tyson was a different story since losing to Douglas allowed Holyfield to get a name before he went to jail. But basically a dominant boxer that cleans out a division doesn't leave room for anybody else to become a big name which then leads everybody to say that the boxer had no competition.
Hell just looking at a list of people Roy Jones fought who were all nobodies. A bunch went on to win titles in other divisions. But he's considered to have no competition because he dominated the division and gave no one else a chance to build up their name.
Fighter's get looked at as great by beating other names. Foreman became a name after beating Frazier. Throw Norton in that mix as well for becoming a name after his wars with other names.
Anytime a champion is dominant it prevents anybody else from making a name for themselves. I actually agree with Tyson saying that him going to jail allowed a lot of names be made.
Tyson was a different story since losing to Douglas allowed Holyfield to get a name before he went to jail. But basically a dominant boxer that cleans out a division doesn't leave room for anybody else to become a big name which then leads everybody to say that the boxer had no competition.
Hell just looking at a list of people Roy Jones fought who were all nobodies. A bunch went on to win titles in other divisions. But he's considered to have no competition because he dominated the division and gave no one else a chance to build up their name.
mastermind
Rest In Power Kobe
Rocky is the wilt chamberlin of boxing. He accomplished alot of impressive feats against subpar opponents. Would he be a good boxer today or in the golden era? yeah probably just like wilt would be a good ball player today. but you wouldn't see any 100 point games from them.
FOH with degrading Wilt Chamberlain like that. He dominated HOFers when e was out his prime. I don't give a fukk what your view is on Rocky Marciano just don't denigrate Wilt Chamberlain.
Tyson is flat out overrated. Hes a top 10, maybe top 15 Heavyweight. Prime for Prime: Ali, Holmes,Lewis, Liston, Foreman would have fukked Mike up. Tyson was a great talent and its a shame that it was wasted because he was one of the most exciting HWs of all time. Mike doesnt have a great enough resume to be up there with the top 5 ATGs.
Wasnt Tysons camp ducking old man Foreman
Rocky Marciano was overrated as hell too.
Wasnt Tysons camp ducking old man Foreman
Rocky Marciano was overrated as hell too.
stop it talking about any loses tyson had post jail sentence. YOu and I both know that aint the real IRON MIKE tyson.
shoot the real iron mike died when robin started acting up and Cus D'Amato passed away. he was never the same boxer.
he lost to hollyfield because he was already washed up. he lost to lewis cause he was already washed up. he lost to douglas cause he came into the fight untrained and didnt care. and he still KO douglas until the extended shady count.
never bring up those fights. if you want to talk about a good fight he had in his prime it would be the razor ruddikk fights.
foreman would've been KO'd, lets be real foreman didnt have any defense. sure he hit hard. doesnt matter. tyson use to dodge and block punches back in the day.Tyson is flat out overrated. Hes a top 10, maybe top 15 Heavyweight. Prime for Prime: Ali, Holmes,Lewis, Liston, Foreman would have fukked Mike up. Tyson was a great talent and its a shame that it was wasted because he was one of the most exciting HWs of all time. Mike doesnt have a great enough resume to be up there with the top 5 ATGs.
Wasnt Tysons camp ducking old man Foreman
Rocky Marciano was overrated as hell too.
and talking about his resume. is it his fault he made very good fighters look like chumps? if you say it is. then Jordan is overrated as well. who did he beat in their prime? not the greats in their(bird, magic(wasnt prime lakers, and they were hurt), detroit(nope, he lost to them in their prime). but yet we call him the GOAT. how so? he played and beat everyone in a watered down time in the nba. sure there were other stars but not playing his position. but yet we call him the GOAT.
