Don't forget the Mormon magic draws either.
If African Americans were allowed to keep their original African culture..
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Don't forget the Mormon magic draws either.
IllmaticDelta
Veteran
But yeah I think this thread personally was built on a faulty premise he only pointed out AA not west indians, or any other group. It comes off as ostracizing in a bit to AA for something out of their control and those groups have their impact here which most isn't negative. Not to mention that africa was stripped of a lot of it's culture as well. And people flee their to live in the states, europe, canada, etc. But I learned some new things in this thread which is always a plus.
Islam and black hebrew type groups are not and have never been popular in the caribbean
What does that have to do with what I typed popularity wasn't even the discussion. You can argue that the nationalist isrealite and islamic groups are not popular in america seeing how most AAs don't follow them. Popularity wasn't even in the discussion origin and history was the entire discussion. And not to mention they're are isrealite and islamic groups right now in the Carribean .
And the prior names I listed are west indians.
Rabbie Wentworth Arthur Matthew was from the carribean. So was Arnold Josiah Ford who worked with Garvey.
He's from Barbados
He's From St Kitts
IllmaticDelta
Veteran
The roots of Christianity was planted in Kongo and Angola as far back as the 1480's, which was even before Columbus stumble bummed his ass into the New World. Most slaves were not even shipped to the Americas until between the years 1600 and 1790, so many of the people of Kongo and Angola were already Christian when they go the Americas.
African Christianity in Kongo | Essay | Heilbrunn Timeline of Art History | The Metropolitan Museum of Art
Fwiw, most slave owners during the majority of the period of slavery did not care that the slaves were not Christian. In fact many slave owners provided their Muslim slaves with Korans. Most of this conversion junk did not happen until the "Second Great Awakening", which was in the 1800's. Many abolitionists pushed it on the slaves during that period.
Religious Transformation and the Second Great Awakening [ushistory.org]
From the 1600's and into the 1800's there are multiple examples of the slave owners not caring what religions their slaves had, including Islam. Many slave owners actually provided their slaves with Korans and some of those Korans have been donated to major universities throughout this Country. The Muslims seem to be the slaves that were forcibly converted by force to Christianity by the English, Portuguese and Spanish in the Americas and that was probably due to the Muslims constantly leading slave revolts.
all facts
yes, but you feel a way about OP not mentioning west indians when all these movements come from the USWhat does that have to do with what I typed popularity wasn't even the discussion. You can argue that the nationalist isrealite and islamic groups are not popular in america seeing how most AAs don't follow them. Popularity wasn't even in the discussion origin and history was the entire discussion. And not to mention they're are isrealite and islamic groups right now in the Carribean .
And the prior names I listed are west indians.
Rabbie Wentworth Arthur Matthew was from the carribean. So was Arnold Josiah Ford who worked with Garvey.
He's from Barbados
He's From St Kitts
and im sure if any came from the caribbean it would be because of AAs anyway
So wait you moving the goal post now. First you said it wasn't any west indians and I don't get your point or intentions.So you think it's right to signle out AAs for something outside of their control? Especially something that applies to all of the diaspora. And I listed organizations started in the carribeans I know you think west indians weren't apart of black movements but I assure they were and they have tons of history.yes, but you feel a way about OP not mentioning west indians when all these movements come from the US
and im sure if any came from the caribbean it would be because of AAs anyway
IllmaticDelta
Veteran
NOI/black hebrews isn't something that applies across the diaspora tho. im pretty sure all the movements you talked about were organized in the US breh.
Jean Jacket
NOPE
The roots of Christianity was planted in Kongo and Angola as far back as the 1480's, which was even before Columbus stumble bummed his ass into the New World. Most slaves were not even shipped to the Americas until between the years 1600 and 1790, so many of the people of Kongo and Angola were already Christian when they go the Americas.
African Christianity in Kongo | Essay | Heilbrunn Timeline of Art History | The Metropolitan Museum of Art
Fwiw, most slave owners during the majority of the period of slavery did not care that the slaves were not Christian. In fact many slave owners provided their Muslim slaves with Korans. Most of this conversion junk did not happen until the "Second Great Awakening", which was in the 1800's. Many abolitionists pushed it on the slaves during that period.
Religious Transformation and the Second Great Awakening [ushistory.org]
From the 1600's and into the 1800's there are multiple examples of the slave owners not caring what religions their slaves had, including Islam. Many slave owners actually provided their slaves with Korans and some of those Korans have been donated to major universities throughout this Country. The Muslims seem to be the slaves that were forcibly converted by force to Christianity by the English, Portuguese and Spanish in the Americas and that was probably due to the Muslims constantly leading slave revolts.
Thanks...your latter references are supportive of my statement that slaves were forced into western religion to break them.
No slave owner wants to liberate the mind and soul of a slave...especially during American slavery. It was a control.
I don't need a reference from a museum or western publication to reinforce the fact that Africans were made docile and mentally and spiritually broken.
Mansa Musa was muslim traditionalist and the Mali Empire flourished and triumphed under his rule even during The Crusades. So abrahamic religion alone isn't foreign to successful African societies. It matters who controls the narrative.
African people are not like white people, they had to make us more like them so we lost the will to fight and hate our past ways.
It still goes on today.
Alright breh you moving the goal post and playing games and I don't know why.
The thread is named
If African Americans were allowed to keep their original African culture
This header applies to most of the diaspora. Africa was stripped of some of it's culture as well the in the diaspora. The Arabized nations are simple proof of that. And those weren't the only groups listed first you were arguing popularity now you switched it to just the nation/isrealites even though it listed more and he put "etc" to incorporate more organizations.
The first pan-africanist meetings were in the carribeans.
The thread is named
If African Americans were allowed to keep their original African culture
This header applies to most of the diaspora. Africa was stripped of some of it's culture as well the in the diaspora. The Arabized nations are simple proof of that. And those weren't the only groups listed first you were arguing popularity now you switched it to just the nation/isrealites even though it listed more and he put "etc" to incorporate more organizations.
The first pan-africanist meetings were in the carribeans.
the full question op asked: If African Americans were allowed to keep their original African culture, Would groups like Nation Of Islam, Hebrew Israelites, 5 percenters, etc etc exist?
are those not African American organizations
? that other groups of afrodescendants were stripped of their african culture has nothing to do with the question he asking
Grano-Grano
The Bando
the full question op asked: If African Americans were allowed to keep their original African culture, Would groups like Nation Of Islam, Hebrew Israelites, 5 percenters, etc etc exist?
are those not African American organizations
And I asked why did he single out AAs? You flipped your position like 5 times now.You nikkas play games I swear. I hate a nikka that can't admit when the wrong.
Tell me what etc etc incorpates as well why are you stuck on the Nation and isrealite when he listed more as well.