How is kobe not top 5 alltime when there arent 5 players with a better resume?

[Mic-Nificent]

LOL@went on. Where was all of these accolades when he was with Shaq? He was a sidekick. An unknown. He rode Shaq's coattails to titles. When Jordan went down, it was Shaq's turn to run the league and Bryant flourished under that train.

At the time he was in MVP consideration and making all NBA teams and all NBA defensive teams.

Also at the time you had Shaq himself and a bunch of other people saying he'd be an average 2 guard without Shaq.

The shyt yall are saying doesn't even make sense. Kobe's talent as an individual player has jack shyt to do with Shaq.

 

[Street Knowledge]

Oh and Dream is better then shaq. His 94 and 95 playoff runs are better then anythig shaq ever did. Imagine if he had Kobe or wade on the rockets?

 

[R=G]

I already said earlier in the thread I'd take Hakeem over Shaq because of how great Hakeem was defensively.

Shaq was one of the most dominant offensive players the league has ever seen, there's NO questioning that, but he wasn't a great defensive player.

With Hakeem you'd get a dominant offensive and defense player and you can keep him on the floor late in games since he was a halfway decent free throw shooter.

Wow...

Oh and Dream is better then shaq. His 94 and 95 playoff runs are better then anythig shaq ever did. Imagine if he had Kobe or wade on the rockets?

And Shaq in 2001 DESTROYS any Hakeem playoff run..what the hell are you talking about?

The shyt yall are saying doesn't even make sense. Kobe's talent as an individual player has jack shyt to do with Shaq.

Has alot to do with it. He made him credible. He rode Shaq to 3 titles and then everyone wanted to make it seem like he did MORE than Shaq to win those titles after he got another two with Gasol to help him. That's why Kobe ends up coming off as overrated. Alot of the shyt he did during the Shaq run was only possible because Shaq drew endless guaranteed double teams every single time he got his hands on the ball.

 

[Street Knowledge]

LOL@went on. Where was all of these accolades when he was with Shaq? He was a sidekick. An unknown. He rode Shaq's coattails to titles. When Jordan went down, it was Shaq's turn to run the league and Bryant flourished under that train.

What? He went on to greatness without shaq but shaq never did the same without Kobe, those are just the facts.

And Kobe was clearly behind shaq in 00, but from 01' on they were equal. You can't ride someone to titles when your outscoring the other guy for entire playoff series and Scoring overall the same points. Then you add in the fact Kobe was their lead playmaker, Best defensive player, and their closer, he can't ever be considered a sidekick

2001 playoffs
shaq 30.4 ppg
kobe 29.4 ppg
1.0 ppg difference

2002 playoffs
shaq 28.5 ppg
kobe 26.6 ppg
1.9 ppg difference

 

[Street Knowledge]

Oh and Hakeem 95' playoffs
http://www.the-coli.com/coliseum/9629-lets-look-back-hakeems-95-playoff-run.html#.T8uZMol5nTo

>>>>>>>Any shaq run. And that's without a 29 PPG scorer like Bryant on his team

 

[R=G]

He went to greatness because he was younger by 8 or 9 years and not even in his prime, dude. WTF is wrong with you? Kobe's best against Shaq's best is no contest. Shaq is the 3x MVP Finals MVP on a team with Kobe Bryant. Kobe didn't even look like an MVP during one of those times..it was almost like Gasol was the one who got that shyt done. They weren't fukking equals in 2001...they were great two punch combo. That was the level that Kobe rose to under Shaq's umbrella. How could he not? He was guaranteed to have easy scores with the attention Shaq was drawing.

Hakeem 95' playoffs

Against weak competition...Shaq went against real contenders and didn't win fluff titles without the real champion around to defend his crown.

2001 playoffs
shaq 30.4 ppg
kobe 29.4 ppg
1.0 ppg difference

Why do you keep focusing on scoring? What about the rest of that shyt? Shaq was the CLEAR MVP and leader of that squad. There is no goddamn revising that. You're showing the wrong person those little numbers because Shaq was how KILLED the East teams in the Finals. Not Kobe. He was scoring almost 40pts a game in one of those Finals? Either the 76ers one or the one with the Nets? Get real

 

[Street Knowledge]

Weak Competetion? What real contenders? The nets? Dream Beat the 4 best teams In the NBA back to back to back on the road. The 95' magic sweep any of the teams shaq beat in the finals

60 win peak Stockton and Malone Jazz
62 win Spurs with League MVP Drob and Peak Dennis Rodman
59 win Suns with Barkley and KJ
57 win Magic with Penny and Shaq

And again compare shaq without Kobe and Kobe without shaq and it's night and day

 

[R=G]

Yeah it's night and day? Kobe was going strong in his prime when Shaq was getting older. Shaq at his best MURDERS Kobe Bryant. Simple. Always has been. He's a difference maker unlike anyone in history the way it seems. Kobe Bryant probably would of got two titles, like he's done now, without a Shaq but that's about it. Bron and Wade was always gonna play a factor in his success later on no matter what.

 

[Mic-Nificent]

Alot of the shyt he did during the Shaq run was only possible because Shaq drew endless guaranteed double teams every single time he got his hands on the ball.

How was it only possible with Shaq drawing double teams if he started performing at an even higher level without Shaq? That's what makes that particular argument so stupid.

 

[god shamgod]

Has alot to do with it. He made him credible. He rode Shaq to 3 titles and then everyone wanted to make it seem like he did MORE than Shaq to win those titles after he got another two with Gasol to help him. That's why Kobe ends up coming off as overrated. Alot of the shyt he did during the Shaq run was only possible because Shaq drew endless guaranteed double teams every single time he got his hands on the ball.

Yes indeed

Its a lot of history being re written.They think because kobes numbers were close it means he was even in impact

Stats dont tell the whole story these kobe fanatics don't understand that

 

[Street Knowledge]

Yeah it's night and day? Kobe was going strong in his prime when Shaq was getting older. Shaq at his best MURDERS Kobe Bryant. Simple. Always has been. He's a difference maker unlike anyone in history the way it seems. Kobe Bryant probably would of got two titles, like he's done now, without a Shaq but that's about it. Bron and Wade was always gonna play a factor in his success later on no matter what.

Yea night and day

Shaq without Kobe
1 title/1 finals appearance
1 scoring title
No MVP's
No finals MVP's
2 first team ALL NBA callups
Sweep after sweep after sweep in the playoffs

Kobe without shaq
League MVP
2 scoring titles
7 1st team ALL NBA callups
2 titles/3 finals appearances
2 finals MVP's

 

[Mic-Nificent]

Why do you keep focusing on scoring?

You're just as focused on scoring when it comes to Shaq's dominance.

Shaq was a dominant offensive player, but what was he doing on the defensive end? 18 years in the league but only a couple all defensive second team selections?

And lets keep in mind Shaq himself has admitted to not wanting to play defense.

 

[R=G]

How was it only possible with Shaq drawing double teams if he started performing at an even higher level without Shaq? That's what makes that particular argument so stupid.

No you're the idiot here. He started performing at a higher level? No..he was going strong but he wasn't fukking outplaying the reason they got to playoffs every year. That's for damn sure. Shaq is why those teams coasted and were able to dominate that great western division.

Kobe has been masterful without Shaq, huh? Just dominant as fukk? Then why does Bron have more MVPs? Why is it that Wade can carry his team against an impressive Mavericks without stacking his team up? Always blinders on when it comes to Bryant. Silly shyt.

 

[Mic-Nificent]

Kobe has been masterful without Shaq, huh? Just dominant as fukk? Then why does Bron have more MVPs? Why is it that Wade can carry his team against an impressive Mavericks without stacking his team up? Always blinders on when it comes to Bryant. Silly shyt.

Bron has more MVP's than Shaq also, and Shaq was on that Heat team with Wade.

 

[swag2011]

No you're the idiot here. He started performing at a higher level? No..he was going strong but he wasn't fukking outplaying the reason they got to playoffs every year. That's for damn sure. Shaq is why those teams coasted and were able to dominate that great western division.

Kobe has been masterful without Shaq, huh? Just dominant as fukk? Then why does Bron have more MVPs? Why is it that Wade can carry his team against an impressive Mavericks without stacking his team up? Always blinders on when it comes to Bryant. Silly shyt.

Don't even use that MVP sh*t cause you basically saying Nash was more dominant than Kobe right?

Funny how in one sentence you talk about Wade carrying his team against an impressive Mavs team without stacking up, yet isn't that exactly what the "Superfriends" did July 2010? Stack up cause neither of them could either get outta the first round(Wade) or beat the Celtics (Wade and Lebron)?

Oh yea that same Mavs team that D.Wade beat in the finals, Kobe beat by himself in 3 quarters that season.

The haters always say Kobe gets overrated, but b/c of people like you constantly underrating him, no wonder why his stans overrate him smh.