How did DC end up Larry Holmes in pop culture while Marvel ended up so popular? (no troll post)
- Thread starter TheDarceKnight
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HipHopStan
Top 113 Poster
Thanks. Yeah, the more I thought about it, the more I realized the only toy-line for an X-Men movie I ever saw get any kind of push was for X-Men Origins: Wolverine.
This thread also reminds me of the Marvel vs DC 4-issue special. Fans got to vote on the matchups and everything. They both swindled me big time as I thought for sure this would settle shyt once and for all, like both companies would respect the outcome moving forward on some canon shyt. Little did I know it was to kick off the whole amalgam titles.... which I also copped 
Marvel won, in case anyone was wondering.
Marvel won, in case anyone was wondering.
verbalkint
I see you niccas...
By one. The matchups were pretty good. If Lobo didnt job to Wolverine DC would've had it. Thor over Capt. Marvel also pretty questionable.This thread also reminds me of the Marvel vs DC 4-issue special. Fans got to vote on the matchups and everything. They both swindled me big time as I thought for sure this would settle shyt once and for all, like both companies would respect the outcome moving forward on some canon shyt. Little did I know it was to kick off the whole amalgam titles.... which I also copped
Marvel won, in case anyone was wondering.
The first six primary battles were:
- Aquaman (DC) vs. Namor (Marvel). Aquaman won by crushing Namor with a whale.
- Elektra (Marvel) vs. Catwoman (DC). Elektra won by making Catwoman fall off a building.
- Flash (DC) vs. Quicksilver (Marvel). Flash won due to his superior speed
- Robin (DC) vs. Jubilee (Marvel). Robin (Tim Drake) won by using his cape as a decoy and then by tying up Jubilee.
- Silver Surfer (Marvel) vs. Green Lantern (DC). Silver Surfer won when both collided with each other and released a huge explosion which knocked out Green Lantern but Silver Surfer was unfazed
- Thor (Marvel) vs. Captain Marvel (DC). Thor won when Captain Marvel was forced to change back to his alter ego Billy. Billy tried to change back but Thor exerted control over him using the magic lightning and the resulting blow caused his hammer to fly off and Billy to fall unconscious.
- Superman (DC) vs. Hulk (Marvel). Superman wins in an all out brawl.
- Spider-Man (Marvel) vs. Superboy (DC). Spider-Man wins by electrocuting Superboy.
- Batman (DC) vs. Captain America (Marvel). Batman won by knocking Captain America out with his batarang. Initially both are evenly matched but then a sudden wave of water (their battle takes place in a sewer) knocks Cap off balance as the both throw their weapons. Batman's batarang strikes Cap's forehead, while Cap's shield misses.
- Wolverine (Marvel) vs. Lobo (DC). Wolverine beats Lobo in a brutal barfight which was largely off panel.
- Storm (Marvel) vs. Wonder Woman (DC). Storm won the fight after repeatedly hitting Diana with her lightning after a brief melee encounter. However it should be noted that Wonder Woman threw away Thor's hammer prior to the fight in order to have a clean fight.
Art Barr
INVADING SOHH CHAMPION
00000000000000000000000000000022
I answered this in the other thread, just the other day.
It was easier to answer this back in the day.
Before everything got weird overall quality wise in the mid-nineties. Which was affected by mothers groups over time in the late eighties. I still believe it holds somewhat true.
in actual execution and in perception that marvel is the better quality company than dc.
Which has more to do with these factors.
First off, mother's group ruined America and I am not sure if mother's group were apart of the inside damaging of America in cahoots with the war on drugs.
Or part of the cover up, of America selling guns and drugs and needed the quick liquid capital for the cold war against Russia.
Yet, as time passes I would like to believe innocently.
that mother's groups had everyone's best interest.
Although, I am starting to believe that not to be true.
Yet, for this I will say maybe mother's groups had everyone's positive interest at hand.
Yet, their meddling ruined America's actual moral fiber and destroyed the male /female dialectic.
Or their meddling was just part of them seizing a portion of the profit in the American pie. as trickle down from America selling guns and drugs..while using the premise of being mother's.
to wash their hands from profits being created from guns and drugs.
As actual products on the streets of America.
As, I believe mother's groups are run by females who benefitted from the husbands and families who profited from guns and drugs. being made readily available on American streets.
All during the cold war for oil profits and we know we really did not need oil in the amounts we needed oil.
Oil is just a business that people in oil never learned to diversify and move into other sectors because oil was marketed as a necessary resource in American life.
All because of its profit margin and also was used as the model.
to get whomever funded the practice of poisoning America with unnecessary guns and drugs.
As America meddled in the dealings of Russia and vice versa.
As America, we are the pirates.
now, we got the hard stuff out the way.
Comics fit into a gateway cog for kids in the eighties after cartoons.
When originally comics were marketed as the original gateway because of technology.
Or lack of modern technology as we enjoy it today.
So, originally comics were used as gateway devices for war with children.
Being used as the bridging device for the highest profitable demographic with the highest disposable income.
This was all after kids were given freedom from slavery.
Or, allowed to be free because they needed the independence of children to populate the mills and factories during war.
While not appearing to be as evil in scope as the evil gnatzi's.
Yet still doing the same thing on its own soil. Which will come into play in this rant but let's just deal with this component and come back to that later in this rant.
This is how cinema became as popular.
In that someone along the way.
noticed that cartoons had traction as an adult medium and later those same cartoons could be repackaged to make more money with children.
A lot has changed about media since I was a kid and I have noticed the older practices of American life.
are starting to be re-instituted and American life is being patterned back into being redline America boring.
With that said, our Gen kinda falls in the we are prey to the older gens and they have manipulated us. using media and not really given us quality consistently.
So, for our Gen we pick up when cartoons were forced on the airwaves on the big three, and then as time went. the big three got to seize control and move cartoons to their vault. Plus, at one point in time later in the nineties never even airing cartoons on Saturday anymore.
till cable took off and lesser uhf channels on the larger dial.
took up the model of using cartoons as a slow profit builder.
Which lucky for us, we got the benefit of the one time in history because of the boom of star wars.
Which expanded the child cognitive mind and offered America its only grassroots moral fiber and rubrick.
Star wars luckily also made it so we as a Gen.
Got to get quality imported or repackaged cartoons in the mid 70's as far as I cognitively know.
In that is how in our gen marvel got to be more popular than dc from a grassroots generational level.
So, by the time superman and batman were honored by dc as popular draws.
They missed the boat so to speak on capitalizing on the star wars and children marketed boom of the mid seventies and the hot toy era of the eighties and fell out of the loop.
Marvel luckily had an abundance of older cartoons that still were current. As marvel gravitated towards soul and funk to market its products and definitely its cartoons. As Spiderman is basically a Jackie Wilson song and we all know the spider man theme song from the cartoon. Even if you were never old enough to actually see it air on tv.
Plus, because of how slow things were year to year and the fact pop white american culture did not advance and was resistant to change for so long.
so time in white america really was slow to advance but advancing at a much faster rate than the depression to redline era of America.
Or the fact that America also noticed how to use nazi war propaganda based medium.
marketed to nazi children in their own capitalism driven way. That the science was applied but not as brazenly overt as nazi programming.
Yet and still we still have those component that cerebrally take precedence in our subconscious.
As gi Joe was attacked by mother's group and any gun toting character were attacked by mother's groups.
Which i feel mother's group worked in unison to deflect blame away from the people profiting from guns and drugs being sold to fund the cold war. Which we are learning was internally purposeful for nothing more than money.
Whether we know it or not. the government knows all about it cause it creates it. I know we are talking comic book companies and perception but we need to pay attention to that small dark fact to just discuss this for real.
Art Barr
To be continued....
I had to split this up because of length.
I answered this in the other thread, just the other day.
It was easier to answer this back in the day.
Before everything got weird overall quality wise in the mid-nineties. Which was affected by mothers groups over time in the late eighties. I still believe it holds somewhat true.
in actual execution and in perception that marvel is the better quality company than dc.
Which has more to do with these factors.
First off, mother's group ruined America and I am not sure if mother's group were apart of the inside damaging of America in cahoots with the war on drugs.
Or part of the cover up, of America selling guns and drugs and needed the quick liquid capital for the cold war against Russia.
Yet, as time passes I would like to believe innocently.
that mother's groups had everyone's best interest.
Although, I am starting to believe that not to be true.
Yet, for this I will say maybe mother's groups had everyone's positive interest at hand.
Yet, their meddling ruined America's actual moral fiber and destroyed the male /female dialectic.
Or their meddling was just part of them seizing a portion of the profit in the American pie. as trickle down from America selling guns and drugs..while using the premise of being mother's.
to wash their hands from profits being created from guns and drugs.
As actual products on the streets of America.
As, I believe mother's groups are run by females who benefitted from the husbands and families who profited from guns and drugs. being made readily available on American streets.
All during the cold war for oil profits and we know we really did not need oil in the amounts we needed oil.
Oil is just a business that people in oil never learned to diversify and move into other sectors because oil was marketed as a necessary resource in American life.
All because of its profit margin and also was used as the model.
to get whomever funded the practice of poisoning America with unnecessary guns and drugs.
As America meddled in the dealings of Russia and vice versa.
As America, we are the pirates.
now, we got the hard stuff out the way.
Comics fit into a gateway cog for kids in the eighties after cartoons.
When originally comics were marketed as the original gateway because of technology.
Or lack of modern technology as we enjoy it today.
So, originally comics were used as gateway devices for war with children.
Being used as the bridging device for the highest profitable demographic with the highest disposable income.
This was all after kids were given freedom from slavery.
Or, allowed to be free because they needed the independence of children to populate the mills and factories during war.
While not appearing to be as evil in scope as the evil gnatzi's.
Yet still doing the same thing on its own soil. Which will come into play in this rant but let's just deal with this component and come back to that later in this rant.
This is how cinema became as popular.
In that someone along the way.
noticed that cartoons had traction as an adult medium and later those same cartoons could be repackaged to make more money with children.
A lot has changed about media since I was a kid and I have noticed the older practices of American life.
are starting to be re-instituted and American life is being patterned back into being redline America boring.
With that said, our Gen kinda falls in the we are prey to the older gens and they have manipulated us. using media and not really given us quality consistently.
So, for our Gen we pick up when cartoons were forced on the airwaves on the big three, and then as time went. the big three got to seize control and move cartoons to their vault. Plus, at one point in time later in the nineties never even airing cartoons on Saturday anymore.
till cable took off and lesser uhf channels on the larger dial.
took up the model of using cartoons as a slow profit builder.
Which lucky for us, we got the benefit of the one time in history because of the boom of star wars.
Which expanded the child cognitive mind and offered America its only grassroots moral fiber and rubrick.
Star wars luckily also made it so we as a Gen.
Got to get quality imported or repackaged cartoons in the mid 70's as far as I cognitively know.
In that is how in our gen marvel got to be more popular than dc from a grassroots generational level.
So, by the time superman and batman were honored by dc as popular draws.
They missed the boat so to speak on capitalizing on the star wars and children marketed boom of the mid seventies and the hot toy era of the eighties and fell out of the loop.
Marvel luckily had an abundance of older cartoons that still were current. As marvel gravitated towards soul and funk to market its products and definitely its cartoons. As Spiderman is basically a Jackie Wilson song and we all know the spider man theme song from the cartoon. Even if you were never old enough to actually see it air on tv.
Plus, because of how slow things were year to year and the fact pop white american culture did not advance and was resistant to change for so long.
so time in white america really was slow to advance but advancing at a much faster rate than the depression to redline era of America.
Or the fact that America also noticed how to use nazi war propaganda based medium.
marketed to nazi children in their own capitalism driven way. That the science was applied but not as brazenly overt as nazi programming.
Yet and still we still have those component that cerebrally take precedence in our subconscious.
As gi Joe was attacked by mother's group and any gun toting character were attacked by mother's groups.
Which i feel mother's group worked in unison to deflect blame away from the people profiting from guns and drugs being sold to fund the cold war. Which we are learning was internally purposeful for nothing more than money.
Whether we know it or not. the government knows all about it cause it creates it. I know we are talking comic book companies and perception but we need to pay attention to that small dark fact to just discuss this for real.
Art Barr
To be continued....
I had to split this up because of length.
Art Barr
INVADING SOHH CHAMPION
Now we have handled a bit of the social factors,...
we can move into the entertainment portion. that we all love and now we all use as a mainstream popular culture escape mechanism that we all have grown to love.
As we all love to be a superhero and why people in this day and age. take a lesser brunt for still showing nostalgic love.
for what would be termed a children play toy in comic books or cartoons.
Which has now become blockbuster billion dollar property movies.
In the mid seventies I can only tell you cognitively my experience.
Plus, how it relates to other kids possibly but every region of the country maybe different because of programming practices on tv.
Plus, programming illustrate what the scope of those tv stations were about in that region.
To start out dc is formerly a number of well to do publishers who over time because of war had to sell properties to the big boys.
To either stay alive or handle bankruptcy bills because of the first fall of the American propaganda of war being used to market media.
Plus, what will eventually happen again which is the fall and near death of comic books and superheros.
So, superman and batman are the most popular dc characters.
All because the eventual big boy who came to own these properties were Warner brothers.
Warner is basically a slave film movie house in basic scope.
Which operates on a human worker made into a slave.
Then, grafting the same scope onto ita acquired properties as a corporate entity as well. Where dc, will operate in a mass cop and blow pimp technique. Where basically you take a bottom bytch and use her up and only throw a few shilling or none to the bytch or in this case a system of workers.
Namely actors directors, etc.....
In that dc operates as a cop and blow discovery and gateway zone property for Warner brothers..that handles gateway marketed media for children and supposedly in scope.
should market a bridgeway product to its other properties to transition the gateway children products into adult consumers in charge of their own income. In that dc has a disconnect, and lets a high attrition rate occur in the demographic of children to the highest disposable income of young adults.
So, couple the change of America to understand how to make a profit off another form of free slaves in children.
Plus, the disrespect in scope America has for children to use them just like Germany in nazi times. We arrive at this point where we are now with dc.
In the mid seventies since Warner was a slave based employee movie house and had control of dc for so long and never saw the potential to make a profit.
Plus not understanding how to cultivate the demographic of children to adults in their demographic.
By using a large bulk of acquired properties to create cop and blow to generate profit.
Dc never saw the benefit to make dc properties a great gateway quality product for children.
Their idea was,...basically the shyt is out there and eventually we will get our number so we don't really give a fukk.
Yet, star wars came about and changed everything we see and do in American economics. By actually giving children importance by the fact you could create a large new money fast money profit off of children.
In that since marvel was still a self owned publisher.
that pretty much was the same type of thing as McDonald's as a corporation.
Where it owned a publishing house that seized and renamed itself and made its profit from a certain demographic.
Where it had to pay a higher attention to detail in the market place because it was not a large conglomerate or movie house like Warner that had seized a number of commodities and profits to use the cop and blow model.
So, marvel was a small self contained publisher with smaller profit based commodities and properties.
So, in that marvel had to pay attention to its consumer base in EXTREME detail. Which they did so by making it an attention to detail base company for comic books and eventually cartoons and film media.
Plus, was very good to market its editor, Stan lee or its most influential creator and writer as an actual father figure and voice.
Plus, the eventual letter to the editor page of every marvel comic.
Where you could write as a kid or adult and get your questions answered privately or publically. Where you answers were answree by the very passionate Stan lee followed by his signature excelsior. Which became a father figure vocal featured at the end or beginning of most marvel programming.
To be continued....
we can move into the entertainment portion. that we all love and now we all use as a mainstream popular culture escape mechanism that we all have grown to love.
As we all love to be a superhero and why people in this day and age. take a lesser brunt for still showing nostalgic love.
for what would be termed a children play toy in comic books or cartoons.
Which has now become blockbuster billion dollar property movies.
In the mid seventies I can only tell you cognitively my experience.
Plus, how it relates to other kids possibly but every region of the country maybe different because of programming practices on tv.
Plus, programming illustrate what the scope of those tv stations were about in that region.
To start out dc is formerly a number of well to do publishers who over time because of war had to sell properties to the big boys.
To either stay alive or handle bankruptcy bills because of the first fall of the American propaganda of war being used to market media.
Plus, what will eventually happen again which is the fall and near death of comic books and superheros.
So, superman and batman are the most popular dc characters.
All because the eventual big boy who came to own these properties were Warner brothers.
Warner is basically a slave film movie house in basic scope.
Which operates on a human worker made into a slave.
Then, grafting the same scope onto ita acquired properties as a corporate entity as well. Where dc, will operate in a mass cop and blow pimp technique. Where basically you take a bottom bytch and use her up and only throw a few shilling or none to the bytch or in this case a system of workers.
Namely actors directors, etc.....
In that dc operates as a cop and blow discovery and gateway zone property for Warner brothers..that handles gateway marketed media for children and supposedly in scope.
should market a bridgeway product to its other properties to transition the gateway children products into adult consumers in charge of their own income. In that dc has a disconnect, and lets a high attrition rate occur in the demographic of children to the highest disposable income of young adults.
So, couple the change of America to understand how to make a profit off another form of free slaves in children.
Plus, the disrespect in scope America has for children to use them just like Germany in nazi times. We arrive at this point where we are now with dc.
In the mid seventies since Warner was a slave based employee movie house and had control of dc for so long and never saw the potential to make a profit.
Plus not understanding how to cultivate the demographic of children to adults in their demographic.
By using a large bulk of acquired properties to create cop and blow to generate profit.
Dc never saw the benefit to make dc properties a great gateway quality product for children.
Their idea was,...basically the shyt is out there and eventually we will get our number so we don't really give a fukk.
Yet, star wars came about and changed everything we see and do in American economics. By actually giving children importance by the fact you could create a large new money fast money profit off of children.
In that since marvel was still a self owned publisher.
that pretty much was the same type of thing as McDonald's as a corporation.
Where it owned a publishing house that seized and renamed itself and made its profit from a certain demographic.
Where it had to pay a higher attention to detail in the market place because it was not a large conglomerate or movie house like Warner that had seized a number of commodities and profits to use the cop and blow model.
So, marvel was a small self contained publisher with smaller profit based commodities and properties.
So, in that marvel had to pay attention to its consumer base in EXTREME detail. Which they did so by making it an attention to detail base company for comic books and eventually cartoons and film media.
Plus, was very good to market its editor, Stan lee or its most influential creator and writer as an actual father figure and voice.
Plus, the eventual letter to the editor page of every marvel comic.
Where you could write as a kid or adult and get your questions answered privately or publically. Where you answers were answree by the very passionate Stan lee followed by his signature excelsior. Which became a father figure vocal featured at the end or beginning of most marvel programming.
To be continued....
Notorious 1 E.Y.E.
Superstar
breh........... wtf nobody reading all that
Art Barr
INVADING SOHH CHAMPION
in the nineties after Jim shooter was ousted and Stan was never brought back into the real fold of marvel creatively and shunned. For the guy who destroyed dc and batman in Joe Quesada the embittered Indy hack with jeph Loeb the other indy hack who ruined marvel, as a quality comic book company.
So, now marvel has its little dc/warner shyt, too.
As marvel actually hired the guy who ruined dc's main property and also failed. to re-right the ship by making quesada a figure head ignorantly.
Yet, in our Gen, marvel before Quesada were heavy on attention to consumer detail.
All because they had to be.
or they would be dead in the water.
Earlier a poster said simply:
Dc = wcw or turner after it was acquire by viacom
Marvel = wwf, before it ruined the wrasslin boom with the racist decision.
to never crown the rock as a champion at mania, during its boom and later went public
This is true in scope but i am gon add the detail.
so we can stop having this damn convo.
As both marvel and dc are now a part of large film houses and at this point we are only seeing the difference being.
Marvel acts as the bridging properties of Disney.
to cultivate its gateway wing of Disney and CGI film properties. from the child demographic to the highest disposable income and profit demographic of 18-42.
Dc is owned by Warner and dc operates as the gateway wing for Warner brothers.
Since, Warner is pretty much an evil slave based film house in fukk'n scope all the way around. It never cultivated a wing to do what Disney has used marvel to do and bridge the gap.
Once upon a time, dc did have vertigo.
Which was more or less a head of its time possibly.
As vertigo is where all the adult writers came from that would imo, ruin marvel as a quality comic book company with the likes of Moore and Morrison who suck on real comic book hero titles.
Where they are imo, out of control ego wise like John Byrne became and had to be torn away from xmen and eventually would ruin the westcoast avengers.
Till, the re-appearance of vision in the last avengers movie.
Westcoast avengers imo, should logically be the next marvel property to be made into a blockbuster film. Yet, Byrne ruined the property so bad.
Just like fox and weirdo writers at marvel would ruin xmen and eventually spider man as a quality product as well..
So, over time marvel before it was acquired by Disney.
also mirrored dc's low quality practices and lost scope of what a quality experience was as a comic book fan..couple it with the mother's group of the mid to late eighties and eventually everything sucks segueway into the nineties, and here we are.
Yet i will go back in time now, to explain possibly why in theory marvel in a grassroots way.
used to actually be better in perception and as an actual product.
When i was a kid, you would wake up in the morning and turn the dial to PBS for mass programming and see sesame street on constant educational loop.
To the point i believe PBS should still run sesame street and all its old programming still to this day regardless of the numbers.
As i feel their telethons at this point would have generated what was missed monetarily.
Regardless of what the spreadsheet would say in black and white database 123 and later excel dot matrix print.
Even though by whoever decides the standards and says sesame street was outdated.. Which is not true. as to this day nobody understood children as well as Jim Henson, nobody.
In my Gen, you learned to do everything by watching PBS and i know so because i could walk and talk by six months years old and was drawing real comic books by three and able to copy comic book character splash pages at that age.
PBS is also how i learned about hip hop from the new York special on gangs and later the actual pbs special on hiphop at four years old.
Where i first witnessed crazy legs doing a helicopter on a ny street at sunset and the image of the setting sun and crazy killing it next to a box and linoleum is still a driving image for me to this day. From comics is how i discovered cartoons and in that bridging gap or summer visit to another market and older relatives is how i discovered cartoons.
Somewhere when i was two and a half years old.
The first cartoon, I remember.
Plus, being rabid about was from a visit to Baltimore.
Which was a different programming market than Chicago.
As my parents are east coast transplants and i was born in Chicago as a native.
In Baltimore, I of course got more culture from hiphop.
plus discovered my love for not just comics but discovered my first favorite cartoon.
In the Baltimore programming market, is where i discovered:
Speed racer
Art Barr
To be continued
So, now marvel has its little dc/warner shyt, too.
As marvel actually hired the guy who ruined dc's main property and also failed. to re-right the ship by making quesada a figure head ignorantly.
Yet, in our Gen, marvel before Quesada were heavy on attention to consumer detail.
All because they had to be.
or they would be dead in the water.
Earlier a poster said simply:
Dc = wcw or turner after it was acquire by viacom
Marvel = wwf, before it ruined the wrasslin boom with the racist decision.
to never crown the rock as a champion at mania, during its boom and later went public
This is true in scope but i am gon add the detail.
so we can stop having this damn convo.
As both marvel and dc are now a part of large film houses and at this point we are only seeing the difference being.
Marvel acts as the bridging properties of Disney.
to cultivate its gateway wing of Disney and CGI film properties. from the child demographic to the highest disposable income and profit demographic of 18-42.
Dc is owned by Warner and dc operates as the gateway wing for Warner brothers.
Since, Warner is pretty much an evil slave based film house in fukk'n scope all the way around. It never cultivated a wing to do what Disney has used marvel to do and bridge the gap.
Once upon a time, dc did have vertigo.
Which was more or less a head of its time possibly.
As vertigo is where all the adult writers came from that would imo, ruin marvel as a quality comic book company with the likes of Moore and Morrison who suck on real comic book hero titles.
Where they are imo, out of control ego wise like John Byrne became and had to be torn away from xmen and eventually would ruin the westcoast avengers.
Till, the re-appearance of vision in the last avengers movie.
Westcoast avengers imo, should logically be the next marvel property to be made into a blockbuster film. Yet, Byrne ruined the property so bad.
Just like fox and weirdo writers at marvel would ruin xmen and eventually spider man as a quality product as well..
So, over time marvel before it was acquired by Disney.
also mirrored dc's low quality practices and lost scope of what a quality experience was as a comic book fan..couple it with the mother's group of the mid to late eighties and eventually everything sucks segueway into the nineties, and here we are.
Yet i will go back in time now, to explain possibly why in theory marvel in a grassroots way.
used to actually be better in perception and as an actual product.
When i was a kid, you would wake up in the morning and turn the dial to PBS for mass programming and see sesame street on constant educational loop.
To the point i believe PBS should still run sesame street and all its old programming still to this day regardless of the numbers.
As i feel their telethons at this point would have generated what was missed monetarily.
Regardless of what the spreadsheet would say in black and white database 123 and later excel dot matrix print.
Even though by whoever decides the standards and says sesame street was outdated.. Which is not true. as to this day nobody understood children as well as Jim Henson, nobody.
In my Gen, you learned to do everything by watching PBS and i know so because i could walk and talk by six months years old and was drawing real comic books by three and able to copy comic book character splash pages at that age.
PBS is also how i learned about hip hop from the new York special on gangs and later the actual pbs special on hiphop at four years old.
Where i first witnessed crazy legs doing a helicopter on a ny street at sunset and the image of the setting sun and crazy killing it next to a box and linoleum is still a driving image for me to this day. From comics is how i discovered cartoons and in that bridging gap or summer visit to another market and older relatives is how i discovered cartoons.
Somewhere when i was two and a half years old.
The first cartoon, I remember.
Plus, being rabid about was from a visit to Baltimore.
Which was a different programming market than Chicago.
As my parents are east coast transplants and i was born in Chicago as a native.
In Baltimore, I of course got more culture from hiphop.
plus discovered my love for not just comics but discovered my first favorite cartoon.
In the Baltimore programming market, is where i discovered:
Speed racer
Art Barr
To be continued
Last edited:
Art Barr
INVADING SOHH CHAMPION
Which for my time never aired on a chicago uhf station and the whole idea.
of being able, or wanting to take life by the reins and do stuff for myself started with speed racer.
As a little two and a half year old, watching PBS in Baltimore..as every kid was in my age bracket was addicted to Jim Henson sesame street. Plus, adults were also addicted to Jim Henson and th Muppet show.
So, watching adults gets up and turn the tv was behavior you were restricted from doing.
Plus, never saw a kid your age do so the idea of turning a tv was foreign to me as a kid at two and a half.
watching my older cousin who is basically me on giant juice, get up as an older kid. When, three o'clock came. to get up and turnoff PBS and turn tv and see loud static..
Which i never heard before or experienced.
Then seeing him move the big little uhf dial to speed racer.
blew my fukk'n mind,.....as a two and a half year old.
All because i had no idea there were other shows on the static filled little dial on the tv. For all you younger dudes tv was not a digital number counter.
for most black people just yet in what would have been 1979.
So, of course i was hooked immediately and was rabid about speed racer.
Plus, infatuated with the little uhf dial.
As i started to learn it was more stuff on tv than just PBS.
That if i got up and turned the tv dial after experimenting with it.
I could turn the big little dial to u and then work the smaller dial to find fukk'N THE HOLY GRAIL: MORE CARTOONS, BREH!!
So, later when i came back to Chicago from vacation.
I ALSO through my cousin learned about how to find records in hiphop and play them on the windup travel fisher price.
Plus, got to acquire that luke in the white outfit with the sliding light saber.
As my older cousin, rand put me onto toys and how to care for them..all because back then a millenium falcon and xwing fighter and all the action figures had weapons.
Plus, was some complicated shyt to even own for that time as a kid. As toys like that were next next level.
back then a kid really protected and did not lose, so to this day. I still believe in quality of product and care of products and i would like to believe this was a constant with most kids i encountered for that Gen.
Mother's groups damaged the attention to detail for children as they removed the extras that accompanied toys out of fear of bullshyt. Which imo was a ploy to eliminate their group from being connected to weapons, and guns and drugs being sold on American streets to the youth as an actual covert American business.
discovering star wars from him via action figures as a cognitive thing in toys. Is also how, i got the gateway to all the great shyt we had in our Gen. Which as we all know everyone in that era learned from including the corporations.
In that dc never really understood or took care like marvel.
So, as you turned the dial as a kid back in Chicago.
As Chicago does not care about kids and prey upo kids because it is the most segregeted area in the world and the model jn which America bases segregetion kn via jfk and major Daley senior.
Plus, the fact Chicago is the worst school system in american history for like sixty plus years straight.
Plus, Chicago has public transportation and big box based economics which means they don't want you to earn enough money to have a car.
So sadly, speedracer was not programmed in the Chicago market in my Gen.
Yet, instead on the uhf dial on 32 which would become fox and channel sixty or later fifty, and the immortal channel 66.
Would program all the cartoons that experienced a boom as properties. Yet before all that channel 60, which would become upn.
later would run loops of looney tunes and old depression era cartoons and also the older marvel character cartoons.
In that dc never had cartoons as hip and the only representative of dc in media was reruns of batman with Adam west.
Which of course was found on 32, or fox.
Which as i became more aware and cognitive of older kids said and stigma'd as phoney. [i only heard phoney, mentioned twice in regards to media back then. First with batman with Adam west and later with hulk hogan].
With that is how i believe dc was stigma'd as phoney incomparison to marvel. Plus, as i started to read at three as well.
I explored how to read through comics because i was looking for what i would learn was called splash pages. So, i could grab tracing paper and copy. Till a kid told me my art was phoney because i traced using tracing paper.
Which eventually lead to me not using tracing paper and eventually copying the splash pages. By looking to just draw from the splash pages. All because i did not want my comics to be ripped apart like how other kids had their comics. Plus, i appreciated art because of the long time it took to copy the pictures. Plus, i wanted to prove i did not use tracing paper to create. So sooner or later somebody notice i could recreate these splash pages.
Which lead to me being introduced to Chicago's black guard of artist as a four year old. Who were family friends and they were illustrators and painters named Jan Spivey and lillian Morgan Lewis.
Which i would use to ask questions about art and i believe my question asking is what lead to me being known as self taught.
As i never took art classes. They would just create their work and i would create mine at their houses and we would share.
These were grown real professional women creators and also Chicago black female artist pioneers as well.
Lillian Morgan Lewis if you are a Chicago native. Is the person who created the large jazz lady mural you can see from the brown line el, and other murals across the city. Plus, is known for being an advancing oil pastel artist who could use them to create oil pastels of water. This is before cgi....like she can paint water in oil pastel and show depth and realism of fukk'n water. She is amazing! I can't draw water breh, i don't know nobody that can paint or draw water but her. Jan spivey-Gilchrist is an award winning illustrator.
i never got any techniques or art history know how from them.
All because i never cared for art school based semantics or schooling. I hate art school to be honest. till i was exposed to other older art talent in Chicago. A decade later in high school and then as a year one gallery 37 student. After winning the art fair six years in a row and a total of seven times in grammar school.
In high school I had s teacher named miss Meredith who sent me to gallery 37 as my first job. We were paid minimum wage for our work. Till the faithful day a girl in my high school named Teresa created a piece purchased by then president bill Clinton and the rest is history. Which made us all like museum natural art history museum artist over night and to this day. Our year one stuff from gallery 37 stuff is in the natural museum of art.
Gallery 37 offered me a chance to go to comic school, at the marwen foundation
Which is where i learned the comic book method of publishing.
Including the history of marvel and dc and the spirit as comic book history mainstays from norm Dwyer and Ralph nieves.
Raph nieves was thr wroter on marvel's hellstorm. Who wrote an iconic death scene by straw. Which i believe could be the inspiration for the dark knight film iconic joker magic trick pencil death scene. supplied on film by heath ledger.
norm Dwyer was comico's lead penciler on speed racer.
So, i hung to every word norm and raph had to say.
As i was in comic books school for three years while in high school as a supplement.
Plus, norm dwyer was the guy who drew my childhood gateway into cartoons, on speed racer.
Which before wutang became a platinum group.
that influenced Viacom to reair speed racer seventeen years later.
after it was never shown in the Chicago market to my knowledge.
In comic school is how I found out about mother's groups, the comic code and how comics were looked at as actual taboo items in popular culture.
As they were war propaganda.
Or in our era used as expression for rallies against social injustice and why just till now.
comic book characters are just now becoming this large booming item again. From that is also how i learned after the fact.
that marvel was politically on the ball during all this time and made quality continuity based material.
All centered around racial equality and the sign of the times.
Which is probably where in the black community the disconnect to dc is probably lengthened.
As superman and dc titles although probably active in Content about the times. Never really handled the permeation of that content.
given that dc was a warner property that Warner let flounder by the wayside. So, by the time the eighties came and the black home was still somewhat intact, give or take. the project era mentality dually being forged at the same time. Marvel took more care in its content to show it was mindful of the times.
Which to say even as a kid, reading older comics there was alway a black panther rally present. In all the pages of my early youth in older issues. Xmen was based on making Xavier into mlk and magneto into Malcolm x. Spiderman was best friends in college with Robbie Robertson the editor's son. Falcon was cap's guy, ironman had war machine, and their was powerman and iron fist,, captain marvel was a gorgeous black woman with a fro, and storm was the mainstay and focus of Chris claremont's xmen. Plus, the black panther was ironman meets bruce wayne but lead an entire country and had the next most valuable resource in the marvel universe of vibranium. Which emulated Africa's resources and the danger of invaders trying to seize the land as well.
marvel comics were welled in some type of expression.
that emulated what was occurring in real life. So, i wanna say the disconnect from marvel and dc is from these factors.
Where marvel had to be and used to be a quality Content product. with its finger on the direct pulse of all its viewership.
Whereas in dc, they never had great marketing or its finger on the pulse of what was occurring.
to get away from the stigma of what comics were viewed as being war propaganda.
Plus, may have been neglecting the times for permeation and false perception. So, it may have been dc content based projects with media that addressed these issues. Yet, it was never given the distinction of caring indepthly. Plus, dc would neuter its characters and content continuity. So, in essence i think public perception became globally an idea. dc will just have superman sing her i come to save the day.
Superman, would just swoop in.
as some white guy and give a bullshyt rescue and reprimand with a service message with no care behind the product or execution.
Or batman was simply the outdated still airing Adam west series.
Which over time came to spiral out of control and never was really squelched or elongated.
to be more social conscious in general perception or scope.
Which i can say is probably true.
as any dc comic i picked up at a young age at white hen pantry. Would never have any content about what was occurring in real time in America.
Plus, dc would issue out several style of flagship character books that made purchasing them for content difficult to follow. Which i gather made it difficult to connect to the general fan base.
While when i was a kid, marvel seemed to keep a mindful idea and content base on the sign of the times. While dc and Warner seemed to be oblivious and as your Gen came into consciousness..this dc disconnect spiraled out of control.
Leading to them actually killing superman and injuring batman beyond control or repair with bane and doomsday. Two overpowered villains created out the blue. With no real quality meaning or origin.
Till pisspoor readership from their direction.
lead them to fail to reboot superman successfully.
Then, also stop the joe Quesada goofball Indy presence on batman.
To return batman back to Bruce Wayne under the cowl.
Which over time that stigma holds true and everytime dc/Warner shows disconnect.
it retroacts any good they may do.
that may would have been a profit building move.
Case in point any and all the superman early movies to the man of steel. Plus the failed batman series i film after burton.
So, dc is counter productive and has created and elongated disconnect from my perspective as a fan in my era legacy wise.
Which in nature i think holds true for the pop gateway crowd.
That Warner never cultivates from dc as their gateway marketing model and wing.
While marvel had a historically responsible background of cultivating their gateway.
Then, marvel was later acquired by Disney.
to cultivate and eliminate the attrition rate of their gateway Disney CGI film model.
To cultivate the highest disposable income age range of 18-42.
Art Barr
of being able, or wanting to take life by the reins and do stuff for myself started with speed racer.
As a little two and a half year old, watching PBS in Baltimore..as every kid was in my age bracket was addicted to Jim Henson sesame street. Plus, adults were also addicted to Jim Henson and th Muppet show.
So, watching adults gets up and turn the tv was behavior you were restricted from doing.
Plus, never saw a kid your age do so the idea of turning a tv was foreign to me as a kid at two and a half.
watching my older cousin who is basically me on giant juice, get up as an older kid. When, three o'clock came. to get up and turnoff PBS and turn tv and see loud static..
Which i never heard before or experienced.
Then seeing him move the big little uhf dial to speed racer.
blew my fukk'n mind,.....as a two and a half year old.
All because i had no idea there were other shows on the static filled little dial on the tv. For all you younger dudes tv was not a digital number counter.
for most black people just yet in what would have been 1979.
So, of course i was hooked immediately and was rabid about speed racer.
Plus, infatuated with the little uhf dial.
As i started to learn it was more stuff on tv than just PBS.
That if i got up and turned the tv dial after experimenting with it.
I could turn the big little dial to u and then work the smaller dial to find fukk'N THE HOLY GRAIL: MORE CARTOONS, BREH!!
So, later when i came back to Chicago from vacation.
I ALSO through my cousin learned about how to find records in hiphop and play them on the windup travel fisher price.
Plus, got to acquire that luke in the white outfit with the sliding light saber.
As my older cousin, rand put me onto toys and how to care for them..all because back then a millenium falcon and xwing fighter and all the action figures had weapons.
Plus, was some complicated shyt to even own for that time as a kid. As toys like that were next next level.
back then a kid really protected and did not lose, so to this day. I still believe in quality of product and care of products and i would like to believe this was a constant with most kids i encountered for that Gen.
Mother's groups damaged the attention to detail for children as they removed the extras that accompanied toys out of fear of bullshyt. Which imo was a ploy to eliminate their group from being connected to weapons, and guns and drugs being sold on American streets to the youth as an actual covert American business.
discovering star wars from him via action figures as a cognitive thing in toys. Is also how, i got the gateway to all the great shyt we had in our Gen. Which as we all know everyone in that era learned from including the corporations.
In that dc never really understood or took care like marvel.
So, as you turned the dial as a kid back in Chicago.
As Chicago does not care about kids and prey upo kids because it is the most segregeted area in the world and the model jn which America bases segregetion kn via jfk and major Daley senior.
Plus, the fact Chicago is the worst school system in american history for like sixty plus years straight.
Plus, Chicago has public transportation and big box based economics which means they don't want you to earn enough money to have a car.
So sadly, speedracer was not programmed in the Chicago market in my Gen.
Yet, instead on the uhf dial on 32 which would become fox and channel sixty or later fifty, and the immortal channel 66.
Would program all the cartoons that experienced a boom as properties. Yet before all that channel 60, which would become upn.
later would run loops of looney tunes and old depression era cartoons and also the older marvel character cartoons.
In that dc never had cartoons as hip and the only representative of dc in media was reruns of batman with Adam west.
Which of course was found on 32, or fox.
Which as i became more aware and cognitive of older kids said and stigma'd as phoney. [i only heard phoney, mentioned twice in regards to media back then. First with batman with Adam west and later with hulk hogan].
With that is how i believe dc was stigma'd as phoney incomparison to marvel. Plus, as i started to read at three as well.
I explored how to read through comics because i was looking for what i would learn was called splash pages. So, i could grab tracing paper and copy. Till a kid told me my art was phoney because i traced using tracing paper.
Which eventually lead to me not using tracing paper and eventually copying the splash pages. By looking to just draw from the splash pages. All because i did not want my comics to be ripped apart like how other kids had their comics. Plus, i appreciated art because of the long time it took to copy the pictures. Plus, i wanted to prove i did not use tracing paper to create. So sooner or later somebody notice i could recreate these splash pages.
Which lead to me being introduced to Chicago's black guard of artist as a four year old. Who were family friends and they were illustrators and painters named Jan Spivey and lillian Morgan Lewis.
Which i would use to ask questions about art and i believe my question asking is what lead to me being known as self taught.
As i never took art classes. They would just create their work and i would create mine at their houses and we would share.
These were grown real professional women creators and also Chicago black female artist pioneers as well.
Lillian Morgan Lewis if you are a Chicago native. Is the person who created the large jazz lady mural you can see from the brown line el, and other murals across the city. Plus, is known for being an advancing oil pastel artist who could use them to create oil pastels of water. This is before cgi....like she can paint water in oil pastel and show depth and realism of fukk'n water. She is amazing! I can't draw water breh, i don't know nobody that can paint or draw water but her. Jan spivey-Gilchrist is an award winning illustrator.
i never got any techniques or art history know how from them.
All because i never cared for art school based semantics or schooling. I hate art school to be honest. till i was exposed to other older art talent in Chicago. A decade later in high school and then as a year one gallery 37 student. After winning the art fair six years in a row and a total of seven times in grammar school.
In high school I had s teacher named miss Meredith who sent me to gallery 37 as my first job. We were paid minimum wage for our work. Till the faithful day a girl in my high school named Teresa created a piece purchased by then president bill Clinton and the rest is history. Which made us all like museum natural art history museum artist over night and to this day. Our year one stuff from gallery 37 stuff is in the natural museum of art.
Gallery 37 offered me a chance to go to comic school, at the marwen foundation
Which is where i learned the comic book method of publishing.
Including the history of marvel and dc and the spirit as comic book history mainstays from norm Dwyer and Ralph nieves.
Raph nieves was thr wroter on marvel's hellstorm. Who wrote an iconic death scene by straw. Which i believe could be the inspiration for the dark knight film iconic joker magic trick pencil death scene. supplied on film by heath ledger.
norm Dwyer was comico's lead penciler on speed racer.
So, i hung to every word norm and raph had to say.
As i was in comic books school for three years while in high school as a supplement.
Plus, norm dwyer was the guy who drew my childhood gateway into cartoons, on speed racer.
Which before wutang became a platinum group.
that influenced Viacom to reair speed racer seventeen years later.
after it was never shown in the Chicago market to my knowledge.
In comic school is how I found out about mother's groups, the comic code and how comics were looked at as actual taboo items in popular culture.
As they were war propaganda.
Or in our era used as expression for rallies against social injustice and why just till now.
comic book characters are just now becoming this large booming item again. From that is also how i learned after the fact.
that marvel was politically on the ball during all this time and made quality continuity based material.
All centered around racial equality and the sign of the times.
Which is probably where in the black community the disconnect to dc is probably lengthened.
As superman and dc titles although probably active in Content about the times. Never really handled the permeation of that content.
given that dc was a warner property that Warner let flounder by the wayside. So, by the time the eighties came and the black home was still somewhat intact, give or take. the project era mentality dually being forged at the same time. Marvel took more care in its content to show it was mindful of the times.
Which to say even as a kid, reading older comics there was alway a black panther rally present. In all the pages of my early youth in older issues. Xmen was based on making Xavier into mlk and magneto into Malcolm x. Spiderman was best friends in college with Robbie Robertson the editor's son. Falcon was cap's guy, ironman had war machine, and their was powerman and iron fist,, captain marvel was a gorgeous black woman with a fro, and storm was the mainstay and focus of Chris claremont's xmen. Plus, the black panther was ironman meets bruce wayne but lead an entire country and had the next most valuable resource in the marvel universe of vibranium. Which emulated Africa's resources and the danger of invaders trying to seize the land as well.
marvel comics were welled in some type of expression.
that emulated what was occurring in real life. So, i wanna say the disconnect from marvel and dc is from these factors.
Where marvel had to be and used to be a quality Content product. with its finger on the direct pulse of all its viewership.
Whereas in dc, they never had great marketing or its finger on the pulse of what was occurring.
to get away from the stigma of what comics were viewed as being war propaganda.
Plus, may have been neglecting the times for permeation and false perception. So, it may have been dc content based projects with media that addressed these issues. Yet, it was never given the distinction of caring indepthly. Plus, dc would neuter its characters and content continuity. So, in essence i think public perception became globally an idea. dc will just have superman sing her i come to save the day.
Superman, would just swoop in.
as some white guy and give a bullshyt rescue and reprimand with a service message with no care behind the product or execution.
Or batman was simply the outdated still airing Adam west series.
Which over time came to spiral out of control and never was really squelched or elongated.
to be more social conscious in general perception or scope.
Which i can say is probably true.
as any dc comic i picked up at a young age at white hen pantry. Would never have any content about what was occurring in real time in America.
Plus, dc would issue out several style of flagship character books that made purchasing them for content difficult to follow. Which i gather made it difficult to connect to the general fan base.
While when i was a kid, marvel seemed to keep a mindful idea and content base on the sign of the times. While dc and Warner seemed to be oblivious and as your Gen came into consciousness..this dc disconnect spiraled out of control.
Leading to them actually killing superman and injuring batman beyond control or repair with bane and doomsday. Two overpowered villains created out the blue. With no real quality meaning or origin.
Till pisspoor readership from their direction.
lead them to fail to reboot superman successfully.
Then, also stop the joe Quesada goofball Indy presence on batman.
To return batman back to Bruce Wayne under the cowl.
Which over time that stigma holds true and everytime dc/Warner shows disconnect.
it retroacts any good they may do.
that may would have been a profit building move.
Case in point any and all the superman early movies to the man of steel. Plus the failed batman series i film after burton.
So, dc is counter productive and has created and elongated disconnect from my perspective as a fan in my era legacy wise.
Which in nature i think holds true for the pop gateway crowd.
That Warner never cultivates from dc as their gateway marketing model and wing.
While marvel had a historically responsible background of cultivating their gateway.
Then, marvel was later acquired by Disney.
to cultivate and eliminate the attrition rate of their gateway Disney CGI film model.
To cultivate the highest disposable income age range of 18-42.
Art Barr
Art Barr
INVADING SOHH CHAMPION
00000000000000000000000000000022
I was tagged in this and not you,....
You do the math....
Anyway, I wrote a smaller piece on this already like a day ago.
So, either way,...someone is going to take the Content from the pieces here and get what they asked for.
Now stfu and lemme do what I always did, post the relevant content no matter the length.
You nikkas think that life is a small meme text and it is not.
You can not learn fully about life from a damn meme.
If you picked up a book on the history of comics.
it would be a bible and if you went to comic school.
You would fail, too.
You are the reason dc makes money.
All cause they know they have mental ass midgets to sell to and fukk it all up listening to goofball consumers like you.
Art Barr
I was tagged in this and not you,....
You do the math....
Anyway, I wrote a smaller piece on this already like a day ago.
So, either way,...someone is going to take the Content from the pieces here and get what they asked for.
Now stfu and lemme do what I always did, post the relevant content no matter the length.
You nikkas think that life is a small meme text and it is not.
You can not learn fully about life from a damn meme.
If you picked up a book on the history of comics.
it would be a bible and if you went to comic school.
You would fail, too.
You are the reason dc makes money.
All cause they know they have mental ass midgets to sell to and fukk it all up listening to goofball consumers like you.
Art Barr
Notorious 1 E.Y.E.
Superstar
I deal with this all the time. Or they bring up one arbitrary event as the end all be all of comic knowledge. "Silver Surfer did his thing in Infinity Saga, nobody in DC is fukkin with him...."
I had to actually argue with a friend about why they went with Gwen Stacy instead of Mary Jane in ASM. Same friend didn't understand why they used Green Goblin in the first Raimi Spider-man.
Check out the Comic book thread about monthly issues, and people hardly talk about DC. Always Marvel this n that, and their constant events.
Miles the only young Avenger not fired yet!!!
Magneto and the crew saving the healing mutants
Deadpool is rich and got his own crew of mercs
The Vision on some Eerie Indiana shyt
Iron Man new armor and Dr.Doom on some Mr.Rogers shyt
What Superman and them doing?!
The Devil's Advocate
Call me Dad
marvel's entire basis was being relatable... and i'm not pulling this out of my ass.. stan lee said it in some doc i was watching
he hated out all the comics had these heros that could do everything, then their alter ego's were still perfect too... no problems.. no issues... just kicking ass and taking names
so he introduced characters that had issues and problems... mutants that were just normal ass humans one day and super the next... but still had to face racism (mutanism) or go to school and deal with high school shyt (spidey) or just be straight up jew prison camp survivors (magneto)
so marvel always related to normal people and kids cause they actually focused on that.... where dc was on some, lets let batman beat up superman cause he rich and got prep time