American-Liberians=/=African-American

[Bawon Samedi]

You cant win a competiton nobody is having lol at this point you are borderline delusional.

Did Americo-Liberians as a collective go through Reconstruction era, Jim Crows, Black Codes, the Civil Rights movement and beyond? Yes or no.

Did they receive the same trauma that AAs did? Yes or no.

 

[Apollo Creed]

Did Americo-Liberians as a collective go through Reconstruction era, Jim Crows, Black Codes, the Civil Rights movement and beyond? Yes or no.

Did they receive the same trauma that AAs did? Yes or no.

To even ask me this question implies I made the statement saying these things happen.

You cant be this dumb breh

You are literally bringing up random points that have nothing to do with anything. If you actually had a lick of sense you would understand by the responses I gave earlier in this thread those these questions can be answered with the information provided.

But you are emotional and probably havent even read my posts hence you are continuing this emotional rant that others have gassed you up on.




If you are going to keep rambling then I’ll just put you on ignore at this point since it seems you are just going to keep going nowhere with this.

 

[IllmaticDelta]

Right.

Cause MOST Black Americans were enslaved and in the South -- they didn't even hear about Liberia or the proposal to send Black people to Liberia -- or know about it cause they were enslaved.

Those who did hear about it - it was after 1865 and those who left the South. Even them -- they also let them know - they weren't interested in leaving their families and the US.

some/many of the earliest aframs who went to liberia were free and from maryland

The first area in the Cape Palmas, in 1834, somewhat south of the rest of the American colony.[1] The Cape is a small, rocky peninsula connected to the mainland by a sandy isthmus. Immediately to the west of the peninsula is the estuary of the Hoffman River. Approximately 21 km (15 mi) along the coast to the east, the Cavalla River empties into the sea, marking the border between Liberia and the Ivory Coast. It marks the western limit of the Gulf of Guinea, according to the International Hydrographic Organisation (IHO).

Most of the settlers were freed African-American slaves and freeborn African Americans primarily from the state of Maryland.[6] The Colonization Society organizers thought they could establish new trading ties by relocating African Americans to West Africa. The colony was named Maryland In Africa (also known as Maryland in Liberia) on February 12, 1834.

Republic of Maryland - Wikipedia

 

[IllmaticDelta]

Hell that gotta do with me. Why isnt this tagged for them?


I’ve given my stance one that you actually agree with so what more is there to talk about?

I don't think the thread was specifically for YOU. You were tagged because whoever tagged you knew you were liberian

 

[Bawon Samedi]

To even ask me this question implies I made the statement saying these things happen.

You cant be this dumb breh

Yet it was your dumb old ass who posted THIS post QUESTIONING those statements:

How can you say skipped events when literally the institution of chattle slavery was a definitive event in AA history? Without that event we would not be having this discussion because people would be using their PRE SLAVERY Ethnic definitions.



Did people who died before the time you want to piggy back on “skip out” on events too?

This is laughable at this point and disrespectful.

I disagreed that chattel slavery was definitive event in AA history. Get some fresh air or something.

You are literally bringing up random points that have nothing to do with anything. If you actually had a lick of sense you would understand by the responses I gave earlier in this thread those these questions can be answered with the information provided.

The points I am bringing up are one of the reasons this flipping thread was made. Even @IllmaticDelta who says the Freed Color people were AAs agrees that they SKIPPED vital AA historic events.

But you are emotional and probably havent even read my posts hence you are continuing this emotional rant that others have gassed you up on.

I actually read your posts. Its you who's trolling and failing the grasps much of our posts.

If you are going to keep rambling then I’ll just put you on ignore at this point since it seems you are just going to keep going nowhere with this.

I told your crybaby ass that you can leave this thread if you feel its a troll thread. Yet, here your are still in it. You didn't even have to keep responding to my post. More importantly the fact that you are running to the Ignore button shows you can't address what I said. All you can do is corny trolling, spamming "your emotional!", and say "I already addressed it!"

Once again... Did Americo-Liberians go through Reconstruction, Jim Crow, Black Codes, Civil Rights and beyond? Yes or No?

Did they develop the same trauma that AA did? Yes or No?

You really are a shytty debater.

 

[Bawon Samedi]

I don't think the thread was specifically for YOU. You were tagged because whoever tagged you knew you were liberian

The twisting and turning that crybaby is doing is pathetic. At least @badtguy made some good points.

 

[xoxodede]

some/many of the earliest aframs who went to liberia were free and from maryland





Republic of Maryland - Wikipedia

Exactly. Between 1830-1850.

3.9+m out of 4m black people were enslaved in 1860. And weren't freed until 1865.

 

[Apollo Creed]

Yet it was your dumb old ass who posted THIS post QUESTIONING those statements:


I disagreed that chattel slavery was definitive event in AA history. Get some fresh air or something.


The points I am bringing up are one of the reasons this flipping thread was made. Even @IllmaticDelta who says the Freed Color people were AAs agrees that they SKIPPED vital AA historic events.




I actually read your posts. Its you who's trolling and failing the grasps much of our posts.



I told your crybaby ass that you can leave this thread if you feel its a troll thread. Yet, here your are still in it. You didn't even have to keep responding to my post. More importantly the fact that you are running to the Ignore button shows you can't address what I said. All you can do is corny trolling, spamming "your emotional!", and say "I already addressed it!"

Once again... Did Americo-Liberians go through Reconstruction, Jim Crow, Black Codes, Civil Rights and beyond? Yes or No?

Did they develop the same trauma that AA did? Yes or No?

You really are a shytty debater.

How can i be a “shytty debater” when there is nothing to debate?



Once again you are trying to argue two different things. What YOU want to title a person alive during a certain time is on YOU the fact is what ever you want to call these people they (the people who would eventually become the Americo Liberian ethnic group) are the descendants of free and or former enslaved black people from the new world (which includes the USA).

Regardless of the semantics you want to play the point still stands that there was a population of black people with various legal status from the USA who went to Liberia.

 

[Apollo Creed]

I don't think the thread was specifically for YOU. You were tagged because whoever tagged you knew you were liberian

And I’ve made my points, points that people agreed on so once again what is there to debate?

 

[Bawon Samedi]

How can i be a “shytty debater” when there is nothing to debate?



Once again you are trying to argue two different things. What YOU want to title a person alive during a certain time is on YOU the fact is what ever you want to call these people they (the people who would eventually become the Americo Liberian ethnic group) are the descendants of free and or former enslaved black people from the new world (which includes the USA).

Regardless of the semantics you want to play the point still stands that there was a population of black people with various legal status from the USA who went to Liberia.

But what I'm saying as a collective their history is largely different from AAs. Yeah they(although some came from the Caribbean and Africa itself) may have came from America but soon they developed their own ethncity, culture and history different from AAs. Yeah Diasporans came from West-Central Africa, but we developed our own culture, ethnicity and history. And our struggles became different.

Again as a COLLECTIVE and not INDIVIDUAL...

 

[Apollo Creed]

But what I'm saying as a collective their history is largely different from AAs. Yeah they(although some came from the Caribbean and Africa itself) may have came from America but soon they developed their own ethncity, culture and history different from AAs. Yeah Diasporans came from West-Central Africa, but we developed our own culture, ethnicity and history. And our struggles became different.

Again as a COLLECTIVE and not INDIVIDUAL...

And what your saying is something nobody is arguing.

Americo Liberias have ANCESTORS who were free or former enslaved peoples. From what I understand the initial people who came from the new world did not go by the title Americo Liberian, Americo Liberian a title that came later after new cultures and social hirearchy were established.

There are cases of Blacks from the new world who married women from indiginous tribes and their children would technically be considered Americo Liberian (due to the society being based on patriarchal concepts).

It makes no sense to look at Americo Liberians as AA during times like Jim Crow or the civil rights when both groups by that time had continue to establish culture and or customs which made them distinctly different. Hell we have to realize during those times Americo Liberians collaborated with AAs in numerous “Pan african” efforts such as having Liberians come to HBCUs or inviting AAs to Liberia for diplomatic purposes.

 

[Bawon Samedi]

And what your saying is something nobody is arguing.

Americo Liberias have ANCESTORS who were free or former enslaved peoples. From what I understand the initial people who came from the new world did not go by the title Americo Liberian, Americo Liberian a title that came later after new cultures and social hirearchy were established.

There are cases of Blacks from the new world who married women from indiginous tribes and their children would technically be considered Americo Liberian (due to the society being based on patriarchal concepts).

It makes no sense to look at Americo Liberians as AA during times like Jim Crow or the civil rights when both groups by that time had continue to establish culture and or customs which made them distinctly different. Hell we have to realize during those times Americo Liberians collaborated with AAs in numerous “Pan african” efforts such as having Liberians come to HBCUs or inviting AAs to Liberia for diplomatic purposes.

Then why did you say this?

The distinction can still be made today when it comes to AAs and even blacks in other nations being of the “same ethnic group” but having different experiences even if all those experiences have the same root cause of systematic white supremacy.
The funny thing is for a posters who quote Yvette Carnell so much this is one of the core things she and many others address when it comes to the experiences of say P Diddy and Oprah being vastly different than the average person even though they are both AA. Because of this you can’t live viciously through other people because they are part of your ethnic group (i.e because Oprah is a billionaire that means AAs are doing good in america) AND you cannot make the assumption that they understand your circumstances even though both of you are victims of systematic white supremacy.

Oprah's and Diddy's people still went through the experience unlike those Americo-Liberians. Especially with Oprah.

 

[Apollo Creed]

And my chattel slavery statement is stating you can NOT seperate the people who were alive pre 1865 from their descendants/those after them even if you want to say they went by different ethnic descriptions. The point is the modern AA is still desdendants of those slaves that died as slaves, people who were freed, and free people of color.

Hence me using the example earlier about we dont call an AA Mandingo even though they may have Mandingo ancestry.

Like I said Mispeaking about who became the people known as Americo Liberians and stating Americo Liberians = something are two very different conversations.

 

[Apollo Creed]

Then why did you say this?



Oprah's and Diddy's people still went through the experience unlike those Americo-Liberians. Especially with Oprah.

The statement is because people stated that black people of various legal statuses had DIFFERENT experiences in America even though they may have had am ancestor that was a slave at one point or another. My point is in modern times this still occurs. Oprah is a descendant of a slave but his is current experience the same as the average AA woman in say Charleston SC? Both of AA women, both have ancestors that were slaves. The point is people are acting as these variations in experiences do not exist today in one form or another to the point that you have internal ethnic conflicts of people with the same ancestors but different perspectives on what the “black experience” is in America.

 

[IllmaticDelta]

Exactly. Between 1830-1850.

3.9+m out of 4m black people were enslaved in 1860. And weren't freed until 1865.

you must realize that those same free people of color often had relatives who were direct slaves and in post slavery times, the two groups became even more intertwined. As far as the stock that went to liberia, their most direct present day relatives are most likely in the places that most originally left from

I can agree with this. But, they didn't go to Liberia.

the people who are actually related to the stocks that went to liberia most likely have distant relatives in Maryland, Virginia and Carolinas

Liberian exodus

The Liberian exodus was a mass emigration of African-American people from the United States, especially South Carolina, to Liberia in 1878.[1]

Interest in emigration had been growing among African-Americans throughout the South since the political campaign of 1876 and the overthrow of the Radical Republican government. Congressman Richard H. Cain called for a million men to leave the injustices they suffered in the United States and leave for Africa. In 1877, the Liberian Exodus Joint Stock Steamship Company was formed in Charleston, South Carolina with a fund of $6,000. Blacks began arriving in January 1878. The company then purchased a bark called the Azor, which arrived in Charleston in March.[1]

On April 21, the Azor set sail with 206 emigrants. A young reporter for the News and Courier, A.B. Williams, accompanied the emigrants all the way to Monrovia and wrote a comprehensive account of the voyage.[1]

Success did come for many of the emigrants who stayed, albeit slowly. By 1880, most had found a livelihood and did not wish to return. By 1890, the Azor passengers were well represented among Liberia's most prominent citizens.[1] Saul Hill, an earlier immigrant from York, South Carolina, established a successful, 700-acre coffee farm. Clement Irons, also of Charleston, built the first steamship constructed in Liberia. The Reverend David Frazier opened a coffee farm with 20,000 trees and was elected to the Liberian Senate in 1891. One passenger, Daniel Frank Tolbert, originally of a town called Ninety-Six in Greenwood County,[2] was the grandfather of President William R. Tolbert, Jr.[3]

I just did a quick search

Tolberts of Liberia.

Believe it or not, there are Tolberts from Liberia (West Africa!) who are descended from the Tolberts of South Carolina ! In 1869 they left the U.S to return to Africa on a ship called the Azor which they had purchased along with several hundred other Black South Carolinians in a group called the Liberian Exodus Movement. Daniel Frank Tolbert age 27 with his wife Sarah and 9 year old son William Richard Tolbert were from a little town called "Ninety Six" in Abbeville County,which is a few miles from Greenwood. Daniel Frank Tolbert left siblings in the U.S. If anyone has information on this branch of the Tolberts or on the Liberian Exodus Movement, I would love to hear about it.Many of the Liberian Tolberts are now back in the U.S and will be holding a family reunion in virginia in July 2000.e-mail Richard Tolbert at

Denise Talbert (View posts)
Posted: 18 Jul 2000 05:08PM
All of my life I've heard stories that some of my father's great-great-uncles went to Liberia and that those brothers who stayed behind changed their name to Talbert. I have a few cousins named Tolbert. My father was from Mississippi. Have your heard a similar story? If so, then we are distant cousins.
Denise

Denise, sorry it took me so long to see your message. I am most definitely interested in hearing more about your family as my great great grandfather Daniel Frank Tolbert left South Carolina in 1878 for Liberia and left sibblings. Any info on your side of the family would be highly appreciated as I am doing a paper on this now. Speak to the oldest living member of your family and get as much detail as possible . Email me at ANGELISTRA@AOL.COM or your can reach me by phone at 914 391 2214 or fax 914 633 7240. Best Richard Tolbert

Kelvinwright167 (View posts)
Posted: 29 Sep 2010 05:14AM
Classification: Query
Hello Mr. Robert Tolbert. I am the grandson of Mr. John Henry Tolbert and son the of Shirley Tolbert Wright. You visited my grandfather several years ago in Greenwood, SC and I remember my uncles telling me about your visit to our family church also. It would be really grey to hear from you as I am possibly planningon travelling to Liberia to work. I can be contacted by email at kelvinwright@gmail.com or calling me at 864-992-9015. Again Thanks

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