Ya have any desire to change your last name (Slave name)

[IllmaticDelta]

But yeah I hate how grammar elitist(mainly racists) try to look down on AAVE dialect. There is no supreme form of English unless linguistics try make a big monolithic worldwide English where every English speaking person in the world speaks the SAME dialect. Other than that English is English with different region flavor.

It's not just AAVE is basically all regional dialects that don't sound "proper".This could range from Appalachian, Florida Cracker to those North Eastern (Boston, NYC etc..) Italian, Irish and Jewish versions of English.

 

[IllmaticDelta]

thats what i'm saying right here. AAVE has decreolized to the point that you can't call it a language. Especially compared to Atlantic English creoles and English based creoles worldwide, AAVE is very similar to standard English. very few people speak the "archaic", "deep" version of AAVE that exist in literature from the 1800s and 1900s anymore

because of isolation Geechee experienced less decreolization which is why i said its a language not a dialect like AAVE

It's still distinct enough...the guy talks about in the video I posted/below starting @ 20:12


The Story Of English Program 5 Black On White

Program five in the series Story of English examines the origins of Black English, beginning with the influx of Africans to the American continent caused by the slave trade. In the American south, Gullah is spoken on the Sea Islands near the South Carolina coast. The old plantations bred a different strain and other regions of the south are equally unique. Footage of pidgin English speakers in West Africa is also featured. This video also discusses the roots of rap, the uses of rap in public schools, and jive talk with Cab Calloway -- including showing the efforts of non-African-American entertainers to utilize the style, with mixed success.

 

[IllmaticDelta]

because of isolation Geechee experienced less decreolization which is why i said its a language not a dialect like AAVE

The distinction between the two are blurry

Languages and Dialects.


There are no universally accepted criteria for distinguishing languages from dialects, although a number of paradigms exist, which render sometimes contradictory results. The exact distinction is therefore a subjective one, dependent on the user’s frame of reference. Specific language varieties are often called dialects rather than languages. This is because dialects do not differ enough from each other to be considered truly separate languages, but there are recognizable differences between them. This is often because the speakers of any given dialect reside in different geographical areas, causing the dialects to develop differently from a shared base language.


Anthropological linguists define dialect as the specific form of a language used by a speech community. In other words, the difference between language and dialect is the difference between the abstract or general and the concrete or particular. From this perspective, no one speaks a “language” everyone speaks a dialect of a language. Those who identify a particular dialect as the “standard” or “proper” version of a language are in fact using these terms to express a social distinction.

http://www.compasslanguages.com/languages/languages-and-dialects/

There is no universally accepted criterion for distinguishing two different languages from two dialects (i.e., varieties) of the same language.[4] A number of rough measures exist, sometimes leading to contradictory results. The distinction is therefore subjective and depends on the user's frame of reference.

The most common, and most purely linguistic, criterion is that of mutual intelligibility: two varieties are said to be dialects of the same language if being a speaker of one variety confers sufficient knowledge to understand and be understood by a speaker of the other; otherwise, they are said to be different languages. However, this definition becomes problematic in the case of dialect continua, in which it may be the case that dialect B is mutually intelligible with both dialect A and dialect C but dialects A and C are not mutually intelligible with each other. In this case the criterion of mutual intelligibility makes it impossible to decide whether A and C are dialects of the same language or not. Cases may also arise in which a speaker of dialect X can understand a speaker of dialect Y, but not vice versa; the mutual intelligibility criterion flounders here as well.

Another occasionally used criterion for discriminating dialects from languages is that of linguistic authority, a more sociolinguistic notion. According to this definition, two varieties are considered dialects of the same language if (under at least some circumstances) they would defer to the same authority regarding some questions about their language. For instance, to learn the name of a new invention, or an obscure foreign species of plant, speakers of Bavarian German and East Franconian German might each consult a German dictionary or ask a German-speaking expert in the subject. By way of contrast, although Yiddish is classified by linguists as a language in the "Middle High German" group of languages, a Yiddish speaker would not consult a German dictionary to determine the word to use in such case.

By the definition most commonly used by linguists, any linguistic variety can be considered a "dialect" of some language—"everybody speaks a dialect". According to that interpretation, the criteria above merely serve to distinguish whether two varieties are dialects of the same language or dialects of different languages.

A framework was developed in 1967 by Heinz Kloss, abstand and ausbau languages, to describe speech communities, that while unified politically and/or culturally, include multiple dialects which though closely related genetically may be divergent to the point of inter-dialect unintelligibility.

Dialect - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[BigMan]

It's still distinct enough...the guy talks about in the video I posted/below starting @ 20:12


The Story Of English Program 5 Black On White

i'm going to watch the whole video tonight
also dude said more slaves wen to the South than West Indies tho
but the thing is in 2015 AA do not speak "plantation creole" anymore. AAVE has become very close to standard American English to the point that most AAVE can't understand Geechee

 

[Whogivesafuck]

i'm going to watch the whole video tonight
also dude said more slaves wen to the South than West Indies tho
but the thing is in 2015 AA do not speak "plantation creole" anymore. AAVE has become very close to standard American English to the point that most AAVE can't understand Geechee

Where else have you lived besides New York and New Jersey?

 

[BigMan]

Where else have you lived besides New York and New Jersey?

no where else. And now you're going to tell me that no AA live in Ny and NJ and since i don't like in the South i can't speak about AAVE huh

 

[Whogivesafuck]

no where else. And now you're going to tell me that no AA live in Ny and NJ and since i don't like in the South i can't speak about AAVE huh

Why are you being defensive? Of course you can

 

[IllmaticDelta]

i'm going to watch the whole video tonight
also dude said more slaves wen to the South than West Indies tho
but the thing is in 2015 AA do not speak "plantation creole" anymore. AAVE has become very close to standard American English to the point that most AAVE can't understand Geechee

AAVE is closer to plantation creole than Gullah and has always (since it's documentation) looked/sounded closer to standard English than Gullah.

 

[BigMan]

Why are you being defensive? Of course you can

that's usually the argument coli dudes make

 

[BigMan]

AAVE is closer to plantation creole than Gullah and has always (since it's documentation) looked/sounded closer to standard English than Gullah.

in the video you posted dude said plantation creole came from geechee

 

[Poitier]

obviously every language comes from a motherlanguage but still, of the Englishbased creoles of the world, AAVE has to be one of most similar to standard English and defintely not a separate language. whereas the difference between Kreyol and French are much more profound. but then again South Africacs made Afrikaans a separate language when its 99% Dutch Languages are political tho

AAs should consciously push aave further from standard English

 

[Poitier]

Why are you being defensive? Of course you can

Lol

 

[Bawon Samedi]

It's not just AAVE is basically all regional dialects that don't sound "proper".This could range from Appalachian, Florida Cracker to those North Eastern (Boston, NYC etc..) Italian, Irish and Jewish versions of English.

My co-worker from Florida even noticed my New York accent.

 

[IllmaticDelta]

in the video you posted dude said plantation creole came from geechee

I think everyone (black slaves) in the South once talked that way but once it was documented and we can see proof of it, the rest of the South outside of the Sea Islands were speaking something related but different. Even when the white minstrels were trying to mock slave speech from the 1800's, it looked/sounded different from Gullah.

 

[BigMan]

AAs should consciously push aave further from standard English

that's a decision for AAs to make but it seems as if AAs have been going away from that. in middle/high school i was apart of an oratory organization for black kids founded by AA (most from the South) and Standard English was pushed heavily. AAVE is not held in high esteem compared to other English creoles