Will CM Punk one day surpass the likes of a Y2J, Angle or HBK?

[R=G]

Mic skills didn't come into real play until kayfabe went away during the mid 90s. Everybody that come up in the 80s were covered by naive fans and a desire to believe. CM Punk was around since 2006 and didn't have a "pipe bomb" in him until the Rock headlined WM 28 so he could cry about it on a ramp. That's not someone who has shown consistent mic greatness. He's only been seen on a legit top level since 2011? And they had him under Nash during most of that...

CM Punk could NEVER do the type of promo Rock and Austin did the Raw before Survivor Series 2011..he doesn't have it in him. He's whole template for talking is based on having lived through what others have done and accomplished and turning it against them for a new audience to think is cool and different. If his best is against their best, he'll get more lost than he was when Eve Torres had him shook last year.

 

[Momentum]

He's arguably my favorite of all time. Punk, Angle, and The Rock.

The total package, a unique look. Rare talent.

The only thing that will hold him back is being great in a weak legacy, but he would've been the man in any era, so that's not really fair IMO.

Punk not being in the attitude era actually saved a lot of legends from being ethered.

If Punk was around 88-94 he'd be food for Hogan, Warrior, Flair, etc. Let's be serious they even made Taker food back then with that BS six day title reign between Hogan and Flair.

I like the dude but CM Punk ain't transcending eras. Would he even be top 5 in the mid 90's ECW? Ahead of Eddie, Benoit, and Angle in 02-04?

 

[Versa]

Mic skills didn't come into real play until kayfabe went away during the mid 90s. Everybody that come up in the 80s were covered by naive and a desire to believe. CM Punk was around since 2006 and didn't have a "pipe bomb" in him until the Rock headlined WM 28 so he could cry about it on a ramp. That's not someone who shown consistent mic greatness. He's only been seen on a legit top level since 2011? And they had him under Nash during most of that...

CM Punk could NEVER do the type of promo Rock and Austin did the Raw before Survivor Series 2011..he doesn't have it in him. He's whole template for talking is based on having lived through what others have done and accomplished and turning it against them for a new audience to think is cool and different. If his best is against their best, he'll get more lost than he was when Eve Torres had him shook last year.

CM Punk out wrestled and out promo'd The Rock really badly all throughout their 2 PPV feud though breh. Punk would've embarrassed a lot of those attitude era cats on the mic.

And it's generally accepted him being underneath Kevin Nash was a horrible idea so I don't know why that's being brought up?

 

[TNC]

All 3 of these guys are in my top ten and ON PAPER, every they are 3 of the 5 most well rounded guys EVER in the business. I can't imagine CM Punk being better than any 3 of these guys in the ring because he's in his prime NOW and still not better than them in their primes, but is possible he could equal them on the mic if he hasn't already.

What kills Punk is that really, he's not a draw and all 3 of these guys, while not Rock/Austin/Hogan level, all have an arguement towards being a better draw than Punk, even HBK slightly. Punk is really the ONLY guy of this era I could see surpassing them but he's gonna have to grind this out for another decade...

 

[Versa]

All 3 of these guys are in my top ten and ON PAPER, every they are 3 of the 5 most well rounded guys EVER in the business. I can't imagine CM Punk being better than any 3 of these guys in the ring because he's in his prime NOW and still not better than them in their primes, but is possible he could equal them on the mic if he hasn't already.

What kills Punk is that really, he's not a draw and all 3 of these guys, while not Rock/Austin/Hogan level, all have an arguement towards being a better draw than Punk, even HBK slightly. Punk is really the ONLY guy of this era I could see surpassing them but he's gonna have to grind this out for another decade...

But let me ask you this. When popularity is at an all time low and so is the overall quality of the product, can you really blame Punk for that when he's literally one of the only people doing his thing night in and night out at a high level in the company?

 

[TNC]

No hate but how can you ask if this is a joke thread and then turn around and make this statement? They've showed Mick Foley fall off the HIAC countless times over the years, does that make him anywhere near even the top 20 of all-time? One thing i can say is that the Hardy feud is what legitimized Punk in the big leagues but that's as far as it goes.

Give Foley his props, he is top 20 of all time. 3rd most important wrestler of the biggest era

 

[R=G]

CM Punk out wrestled and out promo'd The Rock really badly all throughout their 2 PPV feud though breh. Punk would've embarrassed a lot of those attitude era cats on the mic.

And it's generally accepted him being underneath Kevin Nash was a horrible idea so I don't know why that's being brought up?

Even if you what you said had any truth, do you really think CM Punk could touch the Rock in 1999? You will never see anyone do promos like that again..never see anyone talk to anyone like that again...never see a crowd red hot for a eyebrow rise again....you speak like a child and apparently think like one if you think a Rock in 2013 who does 20x thing at once and doesn't sit down and think of every little counter point in these contrived in ring segments to see who owns someone is the same Rock of 1999. No. Rock at 40 is a CEO and a man who has proven his status in spades. Rock in 1999 was hungry and MURDERED his peers, the competition, dudes on other shows, Vince, his family, cussing LIVE and not giving a fukk, burying cats left and right, calling Cripple a queer for the fukk of it, etc. Get real...it's night and day.

You can want Punk to be Attitude Era level but he's just a kid trying to matter when all the attention is on superior talent.

 

[Versa]

If Punk was around 88-94 he'd be food for Hogan, Warrior, Flair, etc. Let's be serious they even made Taker food back then with that BS six day title reign between Hogan and Flair.

I like the dude but CM Punk ain't transcending eras. Would he even be top 5 in the mid 90's ECW? Ahead of Eddie, Benoit, and Angle in 02-04?

CM Punk might not be as good as those guys in the ring but he's still very good in the ring and a lot more entertaining on the microphone then all of them except maybe Kurt Angle. He'd be in mix.

The 80's era was just different. Jericho wouldn't have worked back then either. Doubt they would've put the belt on a goofy type of comic relief guy like Kurt Angle as well.

 

[TNC]

Depends. How old is he right now? How much longer do you think Cena will be wrestling?

Longer than Punk :smugcena:

 

[Versa]

Even if you what you said had any truth, do you really think CM Punk could touch the Rock in 1999? You will never see anyone do promos like that again..never see anyone talk to anyone like that again...never see a crowd red hot for a eyebrow rise again....you speak like a child and apparently think like one if you think a Rock in 2013 who does 20x thing at once and doesn't sit down and think of every little counter point in these contrived in ring segments to see who owns someone is the same Rock of 1999. No. Rock at 40 is a CEO and a man who has proven his status in spades. Rock in 1999 was hungry and MURDERED his peers, the competition, dudes on other shows, Vince, his family, cussing LIVE and not giving a fukk, burying cats left and right, calling Cripple a queer for the fukk of it, etc. Get real...it's night and day.

You can want Punk to be Attitude Era level but he's just a kid trying to matter when all the attention is on superior talent.

This is the first time I've ever seen you, even if it was in a roundabout and dismissive way, admit that The Rock got outwrestled and out promo'd by CM Punk and is a shell of his old self. I'm actually surprised you could even stomach typing up this response lol.

CM Punk is superior to most of the Attitude Era and just as good as the rest. Austin vs Punk with both of them in their primes would've been fantastic to watch both in ring and on the mic. Austin as his typical neutral bad ass self and Punk with a more of a sneaky, pesky role like he's been playing with Rock/Taker as of recent. Would've been great.

So much could've been done with Punk vs Michaels, Kane, The Rock, Triple H, Jericho, etc. Blows my mind that you can't see how he'd fit right in and excell.

Edit: Lol @ the "think and talk like a child" bit.

 

[TNC]

But let me ask you this. When popularity is at an all time low and so is the overall quality of the product, can you really blame Punk for that when he's literally one of the only people doing his thing night in and night out at a high level in the company?

I disagree with the popularity and quality being at an all time low. Things have been MUCH better than they were around the 2005-06 days.

And it's not about bashing Punk, it's about looking at things objectively. Punk despite ALL his ability has failed to move numbers, especially when his current peers (Cena, Orton, Hardy, Batista, and even fukkin Miz) have consistently done higher numbers than him. We fry EVERYONE from HBK to The Rock when it comes to underperforming on the numbers, I don't see why it should be different for Phil

 

[Versa]

I disagree with the popularity and quality being at an all time low. Things have been MUCH better than they were around the 2005-06 days.

And it's not about bashing Punk, it's about looking at things objectively. Punk despite ALL his ability has failed to move numbers, especially when his current peers (Cena, Orton, Hardy, Batista, and even fukkin Miz) have consistently done higher numbers than him. We fry EVERYONE from HBK to The Rock when it comes to underperforming on the numbers, I don't see why it should be different for Phil

When you say CM Punk has been outdrawn by those wrestlers, are you saying as a main eventer? Because even as champ he was hardly put at the top of the card. Cena was. Could be argued he wasn't really given those opportunities and when he did...he excelled.

 

[TNC]

When you say CM Punk has been outdrawn by those wrestlers, are you saying as a main eventer? Because even as champ he was hardly put at the top of the card. Cena was. Could be argued he wasn't really given those opportunities and when he did...he excelled.

Yes I mean as champ, but you can go deeper than that if you want to, but it doesn't get any better for Phil. :smugcena:

And the fact Punk wasn't at the top of the card alone is a bit embarrassing because all those other guys were at the top when they were champ. It makes Punks reign look secondary and really if you get down to the facts, half the time it was.

I'm not going to say Phil hasn't dropped quality because he has but he's failed to bring in any additional audience, which is the job of the champion. And I can't make excuses for him because he had that belt for over a year and still couldn't produce, not even Cena has held it that long. You can't say he didn't have opportunities

 

[captaincharisma]

one of the most overrated dudes ever because he started as an indy fan boy and the interwebz followed him throughout his career

he's either money or terrible on the mic
solid in-ring, but doesn't have classic, mention off the top of your head matches like jericho, angle or hbk

it's not his fault he's in a shytty era, BUT he's not even the best in his own era

 

[Lucky Millionaire]

Jericho is being underrated by a couple of people in here.

As for the thread, probably not. But it ain't gonna change the fact he's one of the best today. Stop having him (and this era, for that matter) fight ghosts of a past era and society. Let him be CM Punk.