Why would a God desire to be praised/believed?

[GPBear]

There is a reason why militant atheism is most profound in regions where Abrahamic religions populate. When you are given someone so illogical, beyond reason and irrational behaviour of your supposed god/creator than fighting back is the only answer.

But once you are told going against this illogical religion and illogical god means eternity of hell for mere earthly sins; than only does militant atheism show itself.

Abrahamic religions never mention the nature goodness of man and woman. Yes, man and woman can do bad but most don’t. If you believe in the religions; than on the premise you’re thinking man and woman is inherently bad without even getting them a chance to act upon their free will.

Abrahamic religions gives you a creator that hates his creation.

In the Abrahamic faith; god only likes Angela, prophets and wisemen, everything he dislike and only likes a very few people in a few geographical locations of this wonderful earth

I mean, the historical facts are people were burned alive for saying that the universe was infinite. The Church killed scientists. Who knows how far back they set humanity. Then hundreds of years later, when evidence of the Big Bang was 'discovered' by a catholic priest, they want to claim the knowledge they killed others for.

What's really fukked up, and why 'militant atheism' is more like justified antitheism, is in the 21st century, I think, Pope Francis 'forgave' Giodarno Bruno. The guy they killed. fukk that. They're an organization of legitimate pedophiles who have a centuries long history of murdering people without consequences.

I could honestly give a fukk less if people want to believe that Jesus literally is the only begotten son of god who came to earth and sacrificed himself for our sins, that's some crazy weird zombie shyt, and i dont know why god would do that, but idgaf. What pisses me off, is that a lot of if not all of these organizations and religious groups are guilty of murder. And they've never really apologized, let alone faced any sort of consequences. Not just that, but they still think they have the moral authority to 'forgive' people they've killed in the past. It's fukking absurd.

The only reason I sometimes wish there was a god, is so that there would be a hell where all these fukked up monsters could get punished for eternity. Unfortunately, not the case.

 

[Cyrus' Wife]

I do respect the right not to believe in various religions but why would Atheists not at least try a relationship (key word relationship not religion) with God out if only just to prove there is no God? You can't go by how human beings have twisted the divine God's words around for evil in world politics and policies and injustices etcetera. After all human beings twisted God's words around in order to justify their murder of His Son so you can't go by religious doctrine. I am talking about finding out who God is for yourself in a relationship not a religion.



I mean what's the harm in trying? If for example you ask God in a genuine manner to reveal Himself to you this week and show you He's real and at the end of this week you feel He has not done it then what have you lost especially if you don't believe in Him in the first place? No harm in a test drive right?

 

[invalid]

he's truly the devil...why would the alpha n omega be so selfish?

soon as the devil open 2 ppls eyes to shyt ...knowledge was the first sin.

why was it a sin... when u knew from the moment u put the forbidden fruit their.. what was going to happen

destroyed n killed more things ....than the devil ever did

I don’t know if you’re a Christian or not, or if you’ve read the Bible for understanding or not, but a lot of the questions that have been posed in this thread are pretty remedial (and I’m not saying this as a point of condemnation to you). And when I say remedial, I mean that these are questions that you should have resolved by now. But it just shows that a lot of people grew up in churches where they hadn’t learned anything (not their fault) but also, that they haven’t sought out learning on their own (their fault).

First, the devil didn’t open anyone’s eyes. He didn’t have that power since he was not their creator. The devil’s only power is as a tempter and accuser.

Second, knowledge wasn’t the first sin. That would mean that the fruit of the tree was sinful or evil.

But in the creation story, it is said that everything that God created was very good.

So that would mean the tree and it’s fruit was very good as well.

So what was sinful?

The answer comes around the nature of love and free will.

Christianity holds the view that God is the very essence of love (if you want to debate that then we can debate that but roll with me for now.)

However, in order for there to be the presence of love, you need two variables:

1) Relationship
2) Free Will

First you need relationship for there to be the presence of love. Love isn’t some ethereal idea or emotion.

Which is one of the criticisms against Islam when Muslims proclaim that Allah is love. In Christianity, God has three persons. And each person of the Godhead existed in an eternal loving relationship with each other. The Christian God is the source of love because it has eternally existed in relationship within its three persons. However, in Islam, Allah has no persons, there is no one beside Allah. So Allah cannot intrinsically be love because Allah exists alone and love can’t be present without relationship. Allah has a relationship with his creation and he may love his creation but that love had to start at the beginning of his creation, which would mean prior to his creation, love did not exist. And if it did not exist, then we cannot say Allah is love like we can say with the Christian God.

Love is an act of free will. Think of it like this. In black history, we have numerous examples of relationships between slave master and slave women. From those relationships bore children. We cannot say that those relationships were relationships of love because of the master/slave dynamic. The master owned the slave so there was no presence of choice or free will.

To get back to the creation of Adam, God created Adam (humanity) in his image and likeness, which means, Adam had to be created with free will so that love can exist. God wanted to be in relationship with Adam and that relationship we characterize as a loving relationship, which is why, in my earlier post, I stated that the premise of this thread is wrong, God does not DESIRE praise and worship. He is God after all. But what he desires is relationship, a love relationship.

If God created everything good, man and nature, nothing Adam could have ever done would have been against God. But how could Adam truly have free in this scenario if everything created and everything done was pleasing in the sight of God?

In order for free will to work, God had to demand a prohibition. That prohibition was refraining from eating from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil. Why he picked that tree, as opposed to, the tree of life, I don’t know. But there had to be a prohibition in a place where everything was created very good.

Again, it is unlikely that the tree was bad in and of itself. Therefore, knowledge itself can not be a sin.

The first sin that was committed by Adam was disobedience. Not knowledge.

It is likely that it was disobedience, not the fruit, that opened Adam’s eyes to the knowledge of evil (in this sense disobedience, shame, evil, separation from God).

Love is an act of free will. God had to give Adam the ability to make a choice, since he was created in his image and likeness. Adam’s choice of disobedience was an act in opposition to his relationship with God. This was the first sin.

 

[Cyrus' Wife]

I don’t know if you’re a Christian or not, or if you’ve read the Bible for understanding or not, but a lot of the questions that have been posed in this thread are pretty remedial (and I’m not saying this as a point of condemnation to you). And when I say remedial, I mean that these are questions that you should have resolved by now. But it just shows that a lot of people grew up in churches where they hadn’t learned anything (not their fault) but also, that they haven’t sought out learning on their own (their fault).

First, the devil didn’t open anyone’s eyes. He didn’t have that power since he was not their creator. The devil’s only power is as a tempter and accuser.

Second, knowledge wasn’t the first sin. That would mean that the fruit of the tree was sinful or evil.

But in the creation story, it is said that everything that God created was very good.

So that would mean the tree and it’s fruit was very good as well.

So what was sinful?

The answer comes around the nature of love and free will.

Christianity holds the view that God is the very essence of love (if you want to debate that then we can debate that but roll with me for now.)

However, in order for there to be the presence of love, you need two variables:

1) Relationship
2) Free Will

First you need relationship for there to be the presence of love. Love isn’t some ethereal idea or emotion.

Which is one of the criticisms against Islam when Muslims proclaim that Allah is love. In Christianity, God has three persons. And each person of the Godhead existed in an eternal loving relationship with each other. The Christian God is the source of love because it has eternally existed in relationship within its three persons. However, in Islam, Allah has no persons, there is no one beside Allah. So Allah cannot intrinsically be love because Allah exists alone and love can’t be present without relationship. Allah has a relationship with his creation and he may love his creation but that love had to start at the beginning of his creation, which would mean prior to his creation, love did not exist. And if it did not exist, then we cannot say Allah is love like we can say with the Christian God.

Love is an act of free will. Think of it like this. In black history, we have numerous examples of relationships between slave master and slave women. From those relationships bore children. We cannot say that those relationships were relationships of love because of the master/slave dynamic. The master owned the slave so there was no presence of choice or free will.

To get back to the creation of Adam, God created Adam (humanity) in his image and likeness, which means, Adam had to be created with free will so that love can exist. God wanted to be in relationship with Adam and that relationship we characterize as a loving relationship, which is why, in my earlier post, I stated that the premise of this thread is wrong, God does not DESIRE praise and worship. He is God after all. But what he desires is relationship, a love relationship.

If God created everything good, man and nature, nothing Adam could have ever done would have been against God. But how could Adam truly have free in this scenario if everything created and everything done was pleasing in the sight of God?

In order for free will to work, God had to demand a prohibition. That prohibition was refraining from eating from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil. Why he picked that tree, as opposed to, the tree of life, I don’t know. But there had to be a prohibition in a place where everything was created very good.

Again, it is unlikely that the tree was bad in and of itself. Therefore, knowledge itself can not be a sin.

The first sin that was committed by Adam was disobedience. Not knowledge.

It is likely that it was disobedience, not the fruit, that opened Adam’s eyes to the knowledge of evil (in this sense disobedience, shame, evil, separation from God).

Love is an act of free will. God had to give Adam the ability to make a choice, since he was created in his image and likeness. Adam’s choice of disobedience was an act in opposition to his relationship with God. This was the first sin.

So many people discount how little a factor religion itself is and how big a factor RELATIONSHIP with God is which is inclusive of God giving us a free will to choose good or evil and to choose to accept Him or reject Him. Choose to try a relationship with God even on a temporary basis to see how it goes before saying He doesn't exist.

My spituality has nothing to do with religiousity and how human beings have twisted God's words around for nefarious reasons (including to justify the murder of God's own Son)...but instead it has everything to do with who I discovered God to be for myself in terms of a loving relationship and friendship between He and I. There's no harm in trying out a relationship with God. That is what He wants from us. He gives us free will to come to Him and discover who He really is outside of religious dogma and inaccuracies. I encourage everyone to try Him. He is real and His love is real as well.

 

[levitate]

And when I say remedial, I mean that these are questions that you should have resolved by now.

Questions that mankind has debated for millennia (and still have no answers to) are now “remedial”?

 

[Genos]

I’ve heard many critiques against a divine being and religion but this one is just petty. I tell you what…put in one of those 60 hours work weeks Coli brehs work and when you get a 20 hour check ask yourself “do I really need credit for all that?”

So god is subservient to humans like you are to your boss?

 

[invalid]

Questions that mankind has debated for millennia (and still have no answers to) are now “remedial”?

Within the context of questions with respect to the general existence of a higher being, the nature of that being, etc., no, I wouldn’t say that is remedial.

Within the context of Christianity, my assumption is that there is first a belief in Christian ideas. But as an adult, if you’re still stuck on questions like why was the tree of knowledge put in the garden, yeah, that’s a bit remedial. Those are questions as children we pondered on. As an adult, I would expect, at the least, that if you have not studied the Bible for understanding, that you have researched different commentaries about things that you may have been stumped on as a child. At least know the arguments for and against and reconcile your beliefs accordingly. And if you can’t accept them, that’s one thing.

But as an adult, in my opinion, one should have reconciled those younger remedial questions, at this point, and moved on because there are bigger theological questions that we can be pondering on. Such as the nature of salvation, free will, faith, etc. Within the Christian context, those are ideas that are still being debated on.

Things like why does God let evil persist and the like have been addressed, the answers have been pretty much consistent across time, so I’m not sure why people are still stuck on those and would assume that those that are, have not really grown in their understanding of the Christian faith.

 

[Nero Christ]

it's become pretty evident to me over the past couple of years that God, the bible (& all holy books), and religion were just creations of the wealthy at the time to keep the masses peaceful & law abiding until they took religion too far...kinda like conspiracy theorists now a days

also, stories in the bible, I never looked at them as real but rather lessons to guide someone in their life...it's like that dragon story in Rush Hour 2

 

[invalid]

So many people discount how little a factor religion itself is and how big a factor RELATIONSHIP with God is which is inclusive of God giving us a free will to choose good or evil and to choose to accept Him or reject Him. Choose to try a relationship with God even on a temporary basis to see how it goes before saying He doesn't exist.

My spituality has nothing to do with religiousity and how human beings have twisted God's words around for nefarious reasons (including to justify the murder of God's own Son)...but instead it has everything to do with who I discovered God to be for myself in terms of a loving relationship and friendship between He and I. There's no harm in trying out a relationship with God. That is what He wants from us. He gives us free will to come to Him and discover who He really is outside of religious dogma and inaccuracies. I encourage everyone to try Him. He is real and His love is real as well.

Religion is a construction of the human Ego and therefore a system of division.

We have to break down the systems of division which are the creation of the Ego, systems like politics, religion, nationalism, classicism, capitalism, racism, xenophobia, homophobia, misogyny, etc.

Once these systems of the Ego are broken down, systems that privatize and deprive, we can move into ultimate Truth, which is our unity with God.

And our unity with one another.

These systems of the Ego prevent us from seeing the image and likeness of God in our fellow man. If we cannot see God in our fellow man, then that means these systems are equally preventing us from knowing (the Hebrew ‘yada’) God.

 

[levitate]

Things like why does God let evil persist and the like have been addressed, the answers have been pretty much consistent across time, so I’m not sure why people are still stuck on those and would assume that those that are, have not really grown in their understanding of the Christian faith.

Respectfully yet totally disagree. You act as if there are definitive answers to questions like “why does God let evil persist?”. Let us not conflate opinions with answers/facts.

These question that you may consider childlike are still not definitively answered. You don’t know the answers to these questions.

 

[invalid]

Respectfully yet totally disagree. You act as if there are definitive answers to questions like “why does God let evil persist?”. Let us not conflate opinions with answers/facts.

These question that you may consider childlike are still not definitively answered. You don’t know the answers to these questions.

Respectfully, as a Christian, there is a definitive answer.

 

[levitate]

Respectfully, as a Christian, there is a definitive answer.

Respectfully, other religions claim to have different answers.
Again, you have beliefs and opinions. Not evidence or facts. Just the fact that you are supposedly pulling the thoughts/intentions/desires of a God…from a book written by man should tell you this.

 

[CodeBlaMeVi]

Honestly, these religions you listed make much more sense than Abrahamic religions when it comes to worship, devotion and prayer.

Abrahamic religions make God out to be illogical and thoughtless. If God wanted humanity’s worship, devotion and prayer than he would instil it in them from birth or give clear guidance of it himself. Yet he hasn’t done neither and Abrahamic religions squabble among each other and within themselves about worship, devotion and prayer. We are talking about thousands of years and generations of men and men wasted their life and time on this matter; without resolve sadly.

Also, if God himself didn’t show exactly how to worship, make devotion and make prayer; why would I listen to another man for what God wants or follow a scripture that no one can prove it is 100% God’s word. Yes, I know this is an atheist debate; but it definitely makes sense when it comes to worship, devotion and prayer.

Isn’t how you conduct yourself through actions, behaviour and words the real worship, devotion and prayer? Why would you need either of these when God knows your intent and see everything you do? A lot of people in these Abrahamic religions think they can out pray or out charity their bad actions, behaviours and words; sometime they see worship, devotion and prayer as a get out of hell card instead of actually believing in these principles.

I might look into these beliefs and religions you listed, the older I get as a man, all I want from God is logic and wisdom. Something I honestly cannot and haven’t found in these Abrahamic religions.

Thanks for the reply and God Bless(I still believe in a God/Creator)

The bolded is why cannot rock with Christianity like that anymore. I won’t ever crap on anyone who do but how I view God is being of acceptance and provides strength and confidence to be their best selves.

 

[CodeBlaMeVi]

I respect your opinion but ironically this is part of the reason why I value my relationship with God...His being willing to sacrifice His own Son for me.

In no other faith did gods/prophets/divine beings offer to sacrifice what meant most to them for the sake of saving humanity. This is why salvation is so key in Christianity. That is the highest form of love. There is no greater love than someone being willing to offer up what means most to them for the sake of saving someone else. And all God requires in return is faith...not praise or worship or even thanks but just faith in who He is and the tremendous sacrifice He paid for us.

God endured the most painful thing He could go through - the murder of His own son - all for our sake and because He loves us so much. That type of love is hard for most people to understand but I encourage you to test Him out with a truly open heart and He will reveal to you His deep and sacrificial love for you.

God sent plagues on Egypt, allowed the chosen people to cross the Red Sea through Him powering the staff and let people walked divided waters but had to watch His only begotten die without doing anything about it? This is the way the Bible describes it? Just doesn’t make sense to me.

 

[Take It In Blood]

I wonder what we're going to do when we come across an alien species that have an entirely different religious doctrine that predates humanity and puts them at the center of the universe