Who is the 5th Best QB in the NFL?

[Piff Perkins]

Why couldn't you say it last year? He was good enough to be in the "borderline Top 5" conversation last year, which is exactly what this topic is about; who is borderline Top 5.

I agree that it isn't clear but I like Goff over everyone else. Only reason people are slow to praise Goff is because of McVay's media buddies pushing his narrative that Goff was ass, after they traded him...

No one thought Goff was ass when he had that classic regular season duel with Mahomes 6 years ago...

I think NFL media is probably the best in (American) sports but perhaps its biggest flaw is what you just mentioned. The inability or refusal to let go of old narratives. How many times do I have to hear Mina Kimes or anyone else say something like "Jared Goff has a lot of help obviously but he's playing good and makes some good throws within structure." It's like nobody wants to let go of the talking points McVay gave them, and Jared Goff will always be judged off his 2019/2020 Rams seasons when he struggled (with a bad run game). I thought the point of roster building was to get as many good-to-elite players as possible. So why do I have to hear about Goff having an elite o-line and run game as if that takes away from his greatness. Yet when the Chiefs go all out to surround Mahomes with elite players every season, nobody says oh look Mahomes needs more help. When the Bills finally solidify a top 5 o-line around Josh Allen nobody says oh look now that he has great protection he's not throwing a bunch of INTs anymore. Tom Brady had all day to throw behind elite o-lines and nobody said but what would he look like without protection lol.

Goff had one really bad game this season and the team still won lol. Flip side with the way people talk about Josh Allen you'd think he didn't get his ass handed to him against the Ravens. And if we want to go deeper, Burrow is having a great season yet his team has struggled because of major flaws on the roster. So is the NFL QB a god-like entity who deserves all credit when things are going well or does team building matter. This concept about "help" needs to die because all of these guys are getting help whether people want to admit it or not. Mahomes has a great defense to save his ass this season, Allen has an elite o-line, Burrow has the best receiver in football, Goff has an elite o-line and run game. Seems to me like the only guy who doesn't have a bunch of toys is...Lamar Jackson. But the nerds will tell you Josh Allen should be MVP so.....yea. It's all a game.

 

[The Villain]

Herbert

Goff and Darnold are doing a great job keeping it in the road which is what you want w/ the talent around them, but they ain't cut like that

 

[Copy Ninja]

Stafford has better wow plays and physical gifts, he can make "wow" throws that Goff can't...

He's absolutely not a better QB in terms of big game credibility, wins and losses, elevating talent, etc. Give him a coach who already had a SB roster and he looks like a winner...

Goff is better. Stafford had a couple Lions teams that were better than these last two Rams teams, and did nothing with em. He's really not that guy...

Goff choked in the SB while Stafford won with the same team.

 

[Rekkapryde]

This year its Goff

Yeah, I agree with this. Wouldn't have a problem with Stafford either.

edit: Herbert is playing well too.

but this year, def Goff.

 

[Saysumthinfunnymike]

Who was the shameless Jordan Love voter lol

 

[Turk]

Drake Maye

 

[FTBS]

Goff has a stacked team due to the lions drafting extremely well

So they went from holding Stafford back to stacked the moment he was traded? Stafford had a WR that made the HOF after 9 seasons and the number 1 D in the league and did nothing. I do have to admit that drafting TEs in the 1st round to help Matt every other year didn't help matters.

Also when the Lions were trash, Stafford at least looked like A GUY. Goff was a JAG borderline bust before McVay

And now he has his second team that wasnt shyt before he got there contending. Multiple playoff wins without McVay. Meanwhile Stafford did nothing in Detroit but win folks fantasy chips. If he was black and didnt look the part he doesnt get the chances he got or traded to the best situation for him (ask Barry and Calvin). nikka got gift wrapped to a SB team that added Beckham and Miller and folks just ignore or twist that entire decade plus prior. Big arm on a white boy is the NFL version of a perty jumper.

 

[Surreal]

I've finally been impressed by Herbie this season

Let's see what the playoffs hold for him tho

 

[The Wolf Among You]

I think NFL media is probably the best in (American) sports but perhaps its biggest flaw is what you just mentioned. The inability or refusal to let go of old narratives. How many times do I have to hear Mina Kimes or anyone else say something like "Jared Goff has a lot of help obviously but he's playing good and makes some good throws within structure." It's like nobody wants to let go of the talking points McVay gave them, and Jared Goff will always be judged off his 2019/2020 Rams seasons when he struggled (with a bad run game). I thought the point of roster building was to get as many good-to-elite players as possible. So why do I have to hear about Goff having an elite o-line and run game as if that takes away from his greatness. Yet when the Chiefs go all out to surround Mahomes with elite players every season, nobody says oh look Mahomes needs more help. When the Bills finally solidify a top 5 o-line around Josh Allen nobody says oh look now that he has great protection he's not throwing a bunch of INTs anymore. Tom Brady had all day to throw behind elite o-lines and nobody said but what would he look like without protection lol.

Goff had one really bad game this season and the team still won lol. Flip side with the way people talk about Josh Allen you'd think he didn't get his ass handed to him against the Ravens. And if we want to go deeper, Burrow is having a great season yet his team has struggled because of major flaws on the roster. So is the NFL QB a god-like entity who deserves all credit when things are going well or does team building matter. This concept about "help" needs to die because all of these guys are getting help whether people want to admit it or not. Mahomes has a great defense to save his ass this season, Allen has an elite o-line, Burrow has the best receiver in football, Goff has an elite o-line and run game. Seems to me like the only guy who doesn't have a bunch of toys is...Lamar Jackson. But the nerds will tell you Josh Allen should be MVP so.....yea. It's all a game.

Because those guys have shown up and elevated those around them in bad situations.
Pat’s defense wasn’t always elite, Josh Allen was balling before Diggs, Burrow overcame his offensive line and helped his team to a Super Bowl appearance.

I believe Baker Mayfield has genuinely grown into a better QB. Jared Goff and Sam Darnold have a lot to prove before people can honestly believe that they’re on that level.

 

[Piff Perkins]

Also when the Lions were trash, Stafford at least looked like A GUY. Goff was a JAG borderline bust before McVay

As a Lions fan...Stafford was inconsistent more often than not and his numbers were largely a product of having no run game plus playing from behind. I'm not knocking him, he could have balled out if we had a decent GM at the time. But there's a reason he was rarely in the convo for top 10 QBs at the time.

Goff played for one of the worst/dumbest coaches in NFL history as a rookie. It was only one season (7 games) though, so saying he looked like a borderline bust before McVay showed up in year 2 isn't true.

 

[ECA]

As a Lions fan...Stafford was inconsistent more often than not and his numbers were largely a product of having no run game plus playing from behind. I'm not knocking him, he could have balled out if we had a decent GM at the time. But there's a reason he was rarely in the convo for top 10 QBs at the time.

Goff played for one of the worst/dumbest coaches in NFL history as a rookie. It was only one season (7 games) though, so saying he looked like a borderline bust before McVay showed up in year 2 isn't true.

Bad coaching or not, but there wasn't too many flashes of Goff being worthy of a first round pick. Stafford's rookie year was far from perfect but there were moments where he looked like a dude. That game winning drive where he separated his shoulder being one of them

 

[Blessings]

Voting strictly for the QB (not factoring their team, offensive unit, HC/OC)
It's easily Herbert

Some of y'all voting for Goff because of his OC, Amon-Ra, Gibbs, JAMO, LaPorta, and elite offensive line lol

Put Herbert in the Lions offense

The poll results would've been a more accurate representation of "best" had OP mentioned it should be team-agnostic

 

[FTBS]

Voting strictly for the QB (not factoring their team, offensive unit, HC/OC)
It's easily Herbert

Some of y'all voting for Goff because of his OC, Amon-Ra, Gibbs, JAMO, LaPorta, and elite offensive line lol

Put Herbert in the Lions offense

The poll results would've been a more accurate representation of "best" had OP mentioned it should be team-agnostic

Irony of course being that Goff is the only person that has produced (numbers and winning) on more than one team. People pick and choose which help they wanna harp on. Meanwhile folks ready to crown Burrow for, possibly, making the playoffs and putting up big numbers with the best WR duo in the league. Goff lost a SB too so you cant even use that plea.

 

[Piff Perkins]

Bad coaching or not, but there wasn't too many flashes of Goff being worthy of a first round pick. Stafford's rookie year was far from perfect but there were moments where he looked like a dude. That game winning drive where he separated his shoulder being one of them

Stafford threw 20 INTs as a rookie and generally didn't look good. Goff didn't look good as a rookie either. As a Lions fan I loved that drive against the Browns and he def proved how tough he is. But I'm not gonna use that one example to say one guy was better than the other. Especially when Goff had way more success in his career in his first few years.

 

[Po pimp]

I remember last year, CJ was playing like a top 5 QB. My how things have changed…