U.S. Drone Strike Said to Have Killed Ayman al-Zawahri, Top Qaeda Leader

mastermind

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Not just fun, but even "funny". The exact words of the shyt we were talking about was "unprecedented psychological trauma", and his response to a decade of receipts of him treating the situation like a video game was to make another joke about it.


They still haven't addressed the suffering of the civilian populations that we're doing this to.

They still haven't addressed the evidence that it's driving MORE people to the terrorists.

They still haven't addressed that there's been a heavy INCREASE in terrorist attacks since we started doing this.

They still haven't addressed that we have a history of creating these cycles where the manner in which we've chosen to get one guy keeps creating the next guy over and over.

They still haven't addressed the alternatives I suggested.



But they have cracked jokes and gloated about American military superiority like it was a sports team they were rooting for. Plenty of energy for that.
They've addressed it by ignoring it because they truly do not care. It's why humanity is done unless we have a societal change.

I am still waiting for what "bringing him to justice" means.

They also don't care about laws when it comes to the US breaking them.
 
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A lot of Americans sadly think war is fun. Its only because the US hasn't been invaded since the War of 1812 and no one is alive from that.
I don't believe this is true. I agree the majority of Americans don't understand the nuances or repercussions of warfare but I also feel like you all's idealistic view of warfare is the same type of naivety, just at the opposite end of the spectrum.

Warfare did not begin nor will it end with the US. War is evil, destructive and traumatizing on both sides but is a necessity in the world we live in because the moral spectrum is vast.
 

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Not just fun, but even "funny". The exact words of the shyt we were talking about was "unprecedented psychological trauma", and his response to a decade of receipts of him treating the situation like a video game was to make another joke about it.


They still haven't addressed the suffering of the civilian populations that we're doing this to.

They still haven't addressed the evidence that it's driving MORE people to the terrorists.

They still haven't addressed that there's been a heavy INCREASE in terrorist attacks since we started doing this.

They still haven't addressed that we have a history of creating these cycles where the manner in which we've chosen to get one guy keeps creating the next guy over and over.

They still haven't addressed the alternatives I suggested.



But they have cracked jokes and gloated about American military superiority like it was a sports team they were rooting for. Plenty of energy for that.
It's funny because I began reading takes on the ethics of drone warfare, and outside of a hyperfocus on the lingering impacts of drone warfare that I really had to go out of my way to find, a majority of the takes approached it as I expected, which is a sliding utilitarian approach that would justify the usage of drones on the basis of the simple fact that we don't have to deploy a soldier and that the designated targets have been rendered combatants. Most people on this topic will consider collateral damage, of course, but what is not being considered is the impact of the surrounding citizens of a country being subjected to constant drone surveillance and instances where the drones are on a targeted run, and from that, an uptick in an unfavorable perception of western intervention, and thus a increase in proclivity towards supporting extreme responses.

So I think consideration for the lingering impacts of drones is typically either tone deaf, or for the most part, nonexistent. That is a problem, of course. But given the typical utilitarian approach, especially when approaching military actions, most will unfortunately chalk it up to a factor they are willing to permit in order to eliminate what is deemed as a high value target, and a proponent of political terror. An irony there when considering how that could play into creating more high value targets, but still, the typical approach.

Now this doesn't justify drone usage entirely, quite the opposite, it justified drone usage within this specific context, but we can work towards improving relations with countries, help these countries reach a form of government that is less likely to fall towards oppressing its citizens by establishing a legitimate democracy, chalk on other important factors, and from there, we can work with these countries in joint operations to safely remedy these problems with most of concentration of military tactics being focused solely on the suspect/target with little to no impact on innocent bystanders. I mean, it's what we would do with any other developed nation, if Canada needed U.S. assistance with a terrorist group, we wouldn't be surveilling neighborhoods with drones and then firing off when we have confirmed that blast radius will be primarily restricted to the target. Citizens would lose their minds if this was common occurrence. And as I sit here, I can imagine being on constant edge in combination with a built up trauma in response to that approach. But as I noted earlier, you will be hard pressed to get people to place themselves in the shoes of these people, when you consider where most humans would fall on the illustration of Peter Singer's expanding circle theory.


So with that, I would conclude that the current approach, while seemingly considering for civilian casualties, overlooks the lingering impact of drone usage primarily due to a lack of care for those that are significantly removed from us, in terms of physical distance. And if there are these blind spots in academia, getting the average person to recognize them or even expecting them to consider it beforehand, is almost an exercise in futility, and my personal cynical approach would say it is futile at this point in human development. :yeshrug:
 

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I don't believe this is true. I agree the majority of Americans don't understand the nuances or repercussions of warfare but I also feel like you all's idealistic view of warfare is the same type of naivety, just at the opposite end of the spectrum.

Warfare did not begin nor will it end with the US. War is evil, destructive and traumatizing on both sides but is a necessity in the world we live in because the moral spectrum is vast.
I don’t have an idealistic view of war. :wtf:

War is horrible. Thats my entire point.
 

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They've addressed it by not ignoring it because they truly do not care. It's why humanity is done unless we have a societal change.

I am still waiting for what "bringing him to justice" means.

They also don't care about laws when it comes to the US breaking them.
Good point. What does "bringing him to justice" mean to you? :jbhmm:
 

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It's funny because I began reading takes on the ethics of drone warfare, and outside of a hyperfocus on the lingering impacts of drone warfare that I really had to go out of my way to find, a majority of the takes approached it as I expected, which is a sliding utilitarian approach that would justify the usage of drones on the basis of the simple fact that we don't have to deploy a soldier and that the designated targets have been rendered combatants. Most people on this topic will consider collateral damage, of course, but what is not being considered is the impact of the surrounding citizens of a country being subjected to constant drone surveillance and instances where the drones are on a targeted run, and from that, an uptick in an unfavorable perception of western intervention, and thus a increase in proclivity towards supporting extreme responses.

So I think consideration for the lingering impacts of drones is typically either tone deaf, or for the most part, nonexistent. That is a problem, of course. But given the typical utilitarian approach, especially when approaching military actions, most will unfortunately chalk it up to a factor they are willing to permit in order to eliminate what is deemed as a high value target, and a proponent of political terror. An irony there when considering how that could play into creating more high value targets, but still, the typical approach.

Now this doesn't justify drone usage entirely, quite the opposite, it justified drone usage within this specific context, but we can work towards improving relations with countries, help these countries reach a form of government that is less likely to fall towards oppressing its citizens by establishing a legitimate democracy, chalk on other important factors, and from there, we can work with these countries in joint operations to safely remedy these problems with most of concentration of military tactics being focused solely on the suspect/target with little to no impact on innocent bystanders. I mean, it's what we would do with any other developed nation, if Canada needed U.S. assistance with a terrorist group, we wouldn't be surveilling neighborhoods with drones and then firing off when we have confirmed that blast radius will be primarily restricted to the target. Citizens would lose their minds if this was common occurrence. And as I sit here, I can imagine being on constant edge in combination with a built up trauma in response to that approach. But as I noted earlier, you will be hard pressed to get people to place themselves in the shoes of these people, when you consider where most humans would fall on the illustration of Peter Singer's expanding circle theory.


So with that, I would conclude that the current approach, while seemingly considering for civilian casualties, overlooks the lingering impact of drone usage primarily due to a lack of care for those that are significantly removed from us, in terms of physical distance. And if there are these blind spots in academia, getting the average person to recognize them or even expecting them to consider it beforehand, is almost an exercise in futility, and my personal cynical approach would say it is futile at this point in human development. :yeshrug:
The R9X is literally the culmination of 20 years of bloodshed to reduce casualties.
 

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The R9X is literally the culmination of 20 years of bloodshed to reduce casualties.
Yeah, I don't see how this is related to my post. I have already given my opinion on collateral damage, and that aspect of warfare is the most readily available with longstanding opinions on it.
 

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You will have to pay me to watch this dumbass, last time I interacted with him, he got bodied in a vegan debate channel and since then acted like a child and went scorched earth. This guy is a dumbass, take this from someone that knew him long before he blew up, back when he was "irishladdie".


But could you summarize his views, what is he defending in this debate? Like I said, I think you are misinterpreting my post, I'm addressing a very specific ethics issue with drone warfare, not casualties or collateral damage, I'm not discussing that at all beyond noting it takes a large precedence in discussions involving warfare ethics as opposed to what I'm focusing on.
 

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You will have to pay me to watch this dumbass, last time I interacted with him, he got bodied in a vegan debate channel and since then acted like a child and went scorched earth. This guy is a dumbass, take this from someone that knew him long before he blew up, back when he was "irishladdie".


But could you summarize his views, what is he defending in this debate? Like I said, I think you are misinterpreting my post, I'm addressing a very specific ethics issue with drone warfare, not casualties or collateral damage, I'm not discussing that at all beyond noting it takes a large precedence in discussions involving warfare ethics as opposed to what I'm focusing on.
he goes 2 v 1 against people pushing your general argument.

Look, war is bad, but I'm asking you what you want to happen. Specifically.
 

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he goes 2 v 1 against people pushing your general argument.

Look, war is bad, but I'm asking you what you want to happen. Specifically.
Oh, I see, yeah, you need to read my posts. lol You have my opinion entirely wrong. What do you think my argument is if you have to put into one proposition?
 

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You should put the "#" at the start of your name, your current format makes incredibly difficult to @ you, at least for me.

I should note, because I was in debate mode earlier, when I shouldn't be, but I support interventionism, I'm assuming you weren't really reading my post or you think I'm vieling my true position behind those posts. But I support intervention even beyond the point that it interferes with what someone would consider an infringement on a nations sovereignty. And I can flush out that position but I'm keeping this short, if I deem some actions to be an infringement on human rights occuring within a country, I also deem it perfectly fine to intervene and alleviate the situation. So I'm far from "war bad". lol

Side note, I would avoid referencing that dumbass Vaush, he is decent at rherotic when debating low hanging fruit but in anything beyond that, he is a dumbass. I think you can find his last vegan debate, but I was in that channel when he was getting dunked on and his arguments were beyond terrible, so much so that I question any work he has put into developing his currently held beliefs, as if my previous knowledge of him before he blew up didn't already cast doubt on him.

I guess he is good for promoting leftism but in an ideal world, someone much more mature and studied would be doing it. Are you active in his community?
 

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he goes 2 v 1 against people pushing your general argument.

Look, war is bad, but I'm asking you what you want to happen. Specifically.
I responded with an updated post above in which I tried to include your quote without text but it broke format. Fix your username. :childplease:
 
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