The Official Socialism/Democratic Socialism/Communism/Marxism Thread

[CHL]

MarxismToday

Really good introduction to Marxism, especially the initial sub-topic explanation videos

 

[CHL]

Why were there only 9 posts on the last page in what should be a 15 post per page thread.
Is Taj spamming again?

 

[JahFocus CS]

Marxist.com also has really good introductory material for someone unfamiliar (or ignorant) about Marxism.

 

[ill]

USSR wasn't a bad place to be post Stalin, in the grand scheme atleast.

Love getting lectured on soviet history from people who have never read a primary source

In the grand scheme guys, I'm not saying the USSR had a higher standard of living than the us. People weren't falling out in the street tho. Soviet nostalgia has a lot to do with nationalism but there's a real material basis for this phenomena

Sorry breh but you're completely off base. I was born in Moscow and my family has gone through Lenin, Stalin, and the rest of the Communists. Russia in no way, shape, or form "wasn't a bad place to be". The government held all of the power and was corrupt. The general public lived well below the means of the country. Every single Russian I talk to now, loves that the country went capitalist. There's no such thing as the glory days for the common person in post-Stalin Russia.

 

[Tate]

You don't even know the fukking cyrillic alphabet.

Get THE fukk outta here bro talking about "primary sources"

I GUARANTEE you, I know more about the Cold War than you will ever wish you did so don't pretend to be an expert on this bullshyt. Stick to your little bullshyt undergrad schedule before your card gets pulled any further.

Considering you apparently think translating documents makes them secondary sources I'm doubting youre that historically literate

Sorry breh but you're completely off base. I was born in Moscow and my family has gone through Lenin, Stalin, and the rest of the Communists. Russia in no way, shape, or form "wasn't a bad place to be". The government held all of the power and was corrupt. The general public lived well below the means of the country. Every single Russian I talk to now, loves that the country went capitalist. There's no such thing as the glory days for the common person in post-Stalin Russia.

I'm not saying the Soviet Union was a glorious place to live post-Stalin, just that there was a decent standard of living relative to most of the world. Especially considering the abject backwards nature of Russian history and the absolute devastation of the Nazi invasion. There's a material basis for Soviet nostalgia, it wasn't just breadlines and such.

 

[BaggerofTea]

Considering you apparently think translating documents makes them secondary sources I'm doubting youre that historically literate



I'm not saying the Soviet Union was a glorious place to live post-Stalin, just that there was a decent standard of living relative to most of the world. Especially considering the abject backwards nature of Russian history and the absolute devastation of the Nazi invasion. There's a material basis for Soviet nostalgia, it wasn't just breadlines and such.

I would imagine that Western Propaganda had a hand in this as well

 

[BaggerofTea]

Sorry breh but you're completely off base. I was born in Moscow and my family has gone through Lenin, Stalin, and the rest of the Communists. Russia in no way, shape, or form "wasn't a bad place to be". The government held all of the power and was corrupt. The general public lived well below the means of the country. Every single Russian I talk to now, loves that the country went capitalist. There's no such thing as the glory days for the common person in post-Stalin Russia.

Many older Russians actually are old staunch Soviets. Many of the new Russians hate it because of Putin's oligarchical rule

 

[Tate]

I would imagine that Western Propaganda had a hand in this as well

You see that more on the western end. American Millennials love socialism and communism compared to gen Xers and boomers who are not big fans

 

[BaggerofTea]

You see that more on the western end. American Millennials love socialism and communism compared to gen Xers and boomers who are not big fans

Whats grinds my gears are the millennials who really don't understand socialism but hop on it like it is some sort of fad.


Your Xers and boomers were groomed by years of red scare propaganda so I am not surprised

 

[Dr. Acula]

Considering you apparently think translating documents makes them secondary sources I'm doubting youre that historically literate



I'm not saying the Soviet Union was a glorious place to live post-Stalin, just that there was a decent standard of living relative to most of the world. Especially considering the abject backwards nature of Russian history and the absolute devastation of the Nazi invasion. There's a material basis for Soviet nostalgia, it wasn't just breadlines and such.

You say that the Soviet Union wasn't a glorious place to live but wasn't THAT bad. I guess my question is if you had to pick between the form of government in western countries vs the one that existed in the Soviet Union, which would you pick?

You mention the devastation after WW2, but lets take a look at countries that suffered heavily after WW2. Britian, China, Japan, USSR, and Germany. Japan, Britain and West Germany and West Berlin took on more western style forms of democracy while China, East Germany, and East Berlin took on another. I think most agree that the Japanese, Britain, and Western German societies recovered faster and had higher quality of life. In relative terms it makes these communist influenced governments appear inferior and leads to a lower quality of life.

So...why support it and be an apologist for it?

 

[shonuff]

if a place has to have guys with fukking guns to keep you IN the country

chances are its a place you dont want to live


just saying



example - mexico kinda sucks to be there - there aint no dudes with guns in mexico shooting you because you are trying to leave mexico

them dudes are rolling out a fukking carpet

by your standard China isnt such a bad place in the 40's ...oh wait there was a revolution - no china was good in the 50's ....no wait defintiely was bad time you could be killed by your neighbor or hell even your kids - 60's that was a good time...oh wait not really they had the cultural revolution then hmmm 70's 80s? sucked then too because of the oppresive govt and backwards society that hadnt changed in 50 years

oh fukk it - lets face facts - socialism sucks - ask any cuban - any mainland chinese - any north korean -

 

[Tate]

You say that the Soviet Union wasn't a glorious place to live but wasn't THAT bad. I guess my question is if you had to pick between the form of government in western countries vs the one that existed in the Soviet Union, which would you pick?

You mention the devastation after WW2, but lets take a look at countries that suffered heavily after WW2. Britian, China, Japan, USSR, and Germany. Japan, Britain and West Germany and West Berlin took on more western style forms of democracy while China, East Germany, and East Berlin took on another. I think most agree that the Japanese, Britain, and Western German societies recovered faster and had higher quality of life. In relative terms it makes these communist influenced governments appear inferior and leads to a lower quality of life.

So...why support it and be an apologist for it?

I'm not an apologist or a supporter of the Soviet Union, I just value historical accuracy. I advocate democracy in everything; the ussr practiced democracy in next to nothing. The picture that's painted of the ussr on here and in most western consciousness is simply inaccurate much of the time however.

Besides Germany and maybe China, no one received worse in WW2 than the soviets. There's no comparison between even what the French went though to the experiences at Stalingrad and Leningrad. And All these other countries had access to the Marshall plan, hundreds of millions in investment specifically to rebuild after WW2. The ussr was isolated internationally.

 

[Tate]

Never thought I'd post something from The American Conservative in here but this is a pretty nice article on class ID What Middle Class?

 

[JahFocus CS]

Never thought I'd post something from The American Conservative in here but this is a pretty nice article on class ID What Middle Class?

Sennett and Cobb discovered that the most marginal of America’s working class would rather be perceived as “middle class” than revolt and overthrow the rule of capital altogether—or even make more money.

 

[JahFocus CS]

A Crisis With No Capitalist Way Out