The Official Israel-Gaza Thread

[Robbie3000]

"Trump will let Gaza turn into glass, Biden is holding bibi to the fire"

This is the only retort they have when we are seeing actual kids without heads. Seems like that's what's happening right now tbh, Biden and his team are bankrolling while they say no more deaths.

Those bombs that Nikki signed yesterday are being bankroll by Biden and his military team then sent to kill people TODAY. I don't want to hear about Trump when I'm seeing it done today

This right here. Liberals were outraged at Nikki Haley trolling by autographing those shells but had absolutely nothing to say about The Warlord providing the bombs in the first place. “But, but Trump” doesn’t hit the same when your guy is facilitating the beheading of children.

 

[mastermind]

Again you are ignoring several points to get your bullshyt off UNRWA affiliates confirm Biden is working to get aid to UNRWA and Palestine. That Biden is encouraging EU members to keep funding up. Trumps not gonna do none of that.

1) You didn't share any information that says the Biden admin is giving money to UNRWA affiliates
2) There is nothing that states that. The closest I've seen is this:

https://www.unrwa.org/newsroom/news-releases/unrwa-usa-resumes-funding-un-agency-palestine-refugees-providing-5-million

That's fine. He is encouraging others to give money, but that ain't the same as the US government giving money, is it?
3) US government can't give the UNRWA any money until 2025

https://www.politico.com/newsletters/national-security-daily/2024/04/23/bidens-hands-are-tied-on-unrwa-funding-00153894

4) Giving money to affiliates =/= giving money to the real thing. That you even thought this was a legit point and chose a smiley for it shows you ain't as serious a person as you think, and def not the serious thinker you want to present yourself as
5)

You think it can’t get worse than 30,000 dead

Trumps son in law and representatives have gone on record saying they want to turn Gaza into a beach front property? And you think it can’t get worse


Trump says he’s going to deport protestors and you think it can’t get worse?

Brehs, this is another unserious person who is laughing at 30,000 people dead. Who probably said, "Trump would have let much worse happen at that Rafah refugee camp. "

This is what I mean when I say they do not care about humans. Just the politics of optics.

 

[Kokoro]

Eventually liberals will learn that defining yourself by what you’re not, running on what your opponent could hypothetically do, and running on the idea that the other guy is worse so it’s okay for me to not listen to my constituents, is unacceptable in a so called democracy/republic. You could actually argue it’s undemocratic and part of the reason why America is backsliding.

Every reformation should be a step towards revolution.

 

[jj23]

And what I keep coming back to is these people don't care about people. It's the same thing with how these bills these people cheerlead because their person did something that they don't know the impact of long-term to people. They care all about the "politics" of it all and its disturbing that shyt like this is being accepted as a valid way of thinking. The human interest is not of the mind our politicians and their stans and its killing us all.

That is all it is. It's their right too. Not everyone was raised with a conscience.

Make a note of the folks who aren't and give them a wide berth. They cannot be saved.

 

[Pressure]

Eventually liberals will learn that defining yourself by what you’re not, running on what your opponent could hypothetically do, and running on the idea that the other guy is worse so it’s okay for me to not listen to my constituents, is unacceptable in a so called democracy/republic. You could actually argue it’s undemocratic and part of the reason why America is backsliding.

Every reformation should be a step towards revolution.

But that’s not what liberals are running on. In fact the left has decided this is more important than the actual issues and change trying to be brought forth.

You’re not getting your revolution that you think while being little p*ssy wanting some third party court in the Hague to speak truth to power for you.

You aren’t going to win a revolution by being any guns.

You aren’t going to win a revolution crying over why some nerds spending 50k a year on tuition are oppressed.

Grow up

 

[Pressure]

That is all it is. It's their right too. Not everyone was raised with a conscience.

Make a note of the folks who aren't and give them a wide berth. They cannot be saved.

Your country created this. But I get it. You’re just being conveniently African when it fits.

 

[Pull Up the Roots]

Let’s be clear. The right poses an unparalleled threat. Left criticism of Democrats is in part about preventing the return of Trump.

A Current Affairs reader recently emailed in to express their disappointment that our magazine frequently criticizes the current president. We have been critical of the Biden administration’s foreign policy, including its weapons aid to Israel, its undermining of the authority of the ICC, its hawkishness on China, and its cruel immigration policies. We have also criticized the administration’s self-defeating and inadequate approach to the climate catastrophe, which puts the interests of the fossil fuel and automobile industries above those of humanity.

Our dissatisfied reader argued that by making so much of Biden’s shortcomings, we were in fact helping Donald Trump. Trump, they pointed out, is in many ways much worse than Biden. By criticizing Biden, we are undermining him, and therefore making Trump’s election more probable, thus contributing to a worse outcome on the issues we care about.

Our reader is not alone in this kind of thinking. Senator John Fetterman recently criticized those protesting the administration’s support for Israel, arguing that they were “de facto supporting and helping Trump” by encouraging people to “walk away from supporting the president.” After Congresswoman Rashida Tlaib recently called Joe Biden an “enabler” of genocide, and said Palestine’s supporters would not forget his actions in November, liberal commentator Keith Olbermann said she was committing “the equivalent of treason” and would “enable a Trump dictatorship,” and that “to prioritize anything above defeating Trump is suicidal madness,” especially since “Trump is dedicated to destroying Palestine.”

He encouraged her to “repent” “immediately.” Economist Robert Marchini explained that “one of the basically overriding rules of party discipline, in any political party, is you do not publicly punch at other members of the party by name.” Criticism helps the enemy, thus anyone who criticizes Joe Biden must want Donald Trump to be president.

I actually understand why people subscribe to this view, since it can seem so logically straightforward as to be incontrovertible: if you are aware that doing X makes outcome Y more probable, and you choose to do X anyway, then you favor outcome Y. But I don’t think this formula works. For example, when President Roosevelt decided to round up Japanese Americans and put them in internment camps in 1942—an appalling violation of their human rights—a Democratic partisan could say to anyone who objected: starting a debate on this issue distracts from the war effort. Anything that distracts from the war effort makes it more likely Hitler will win. Therefore you want Hitler to win. (I wondered casually whether the New York Times was making arguments like this in 1942, so I looked up their coverage of Japanese internment, but the first headline I found was in fact much worse.)

Under many moral frameworks, a pure calculation of the probable consequences of an action simply cannot be the end of the analysis. Many activists who protested against Lyndon Johnson’s escalation of the war on Vietnam, including invading the country with 500,000 troops, probably knew full well that protesting Johnson in 1968 could undermine his presidency, and that the year would therefore end in a Republican victory. But they felt a moral duty to speak out against an atrocity, and their consciences revolted against the idea of remaining silent simply because Republicans tend to have worse foreign policy.

We also have to be careful about how we assign responsibility for consequences. I wrote about this a few years back in response to a Princeton professor who argued that violent protests in Black neighborhoods in the late 1960s contributed to the election of Richard Nixon, and used this as an argument that protesters should be nonviolent, lest they help Republicans.

 

[Anerdyblackguy]

That’s odd I thought Israel said everything was okay prior to October 7th

 

[LOST IN THE SAUCE]

Yes you did because you are seeking create confusion about what was actually said and intentionally misconstrued what was said under your false claim that the pier was a failure. The pier is not “sunk” it is being repaired. Aid has been confirmed to have been to delivered to Palestinians

Sounds like you have a vested interest in debating a straw man rather than the words of the government and my actual argument. Your cowardice is noted

So we’ve gone from functionally useless to “hasn’t been that good”



- and here we are


That’s for all of Gaza. The pier was for 500,000 people and as a supplemental - as quoted by the press secretary- to land delivery.

In fact the goal was 150 tons a day

Each boat can transfer between five and 15 trucks to shore. Once fully operational, the pier will be able to provide about 150 truckloads of aid to Gaza per day, according to U.S. officials.

Pier for Gaza aid in place, US military says

www.voanews.com

Your own quote says 150 truckloads, not tons. 150 trucks is well over 2000 tons. So 1000 tons in 5 days vs 2200+ tons daily, which as you noted is supposed to supplement the 200+ expected trucks to get close to the 500~ trucks the UN said is required to reverse the current famine that is happening right now. As I've already pointed out, the US has publicly acknowledged that less aid has been going in since the pier became operational. Sounds pretty functionally useless in the goal of reversing the current famine.

The Biden government just took the money and funneled it through other aid agencies

https://www.unrwa.org/newsroom/news-releases/unrwa-usa-resumes-funding-un-agency-palestine-refugees-providing-5-million
UNRWA USA also takes into consideration the fact that the Biden Administration has reportedly been actively urging other countries to resume funding and has continued to speak supportively of UNRWA in its public statements.


Also I’m assuming the pier was apart of the $1 billion in aid that was already earmarked for Gaza?

Supplemental Bill Becomes Law, Provides Billions in Aid for Ukraine, Israel, Taiwan

President Joe Biden said that the security supplemental — worth about $95 billion — is not just an investment in the security of U.S. partners around the world, but also in U.S. security at home and

www.defense.gov

Yes, the U.S. ceasing to dump billions into Palestine would be more cost prohibitive than just letting Israel go Third Reich on them like they probably want to.

This is just nonsense bullshyt. UNRWA was the only group with the needed infrastructure already in place to distribute aid. This is just a really bad and transparent white washing of the horrible, horrible thing we did, which was based on a bold faced lie, that probably signed the death warrant for thousands, if not tens to hundreds of thousands of Gazans.

 

[LOST IN THE SAUCE]

Whether we agree that the scope of UNRWA employee participation warranted a pause in funding, it’s a fact that a dozen out of hundreds of UNRWA employees knowingly were Hamas affiliates and helped plan and lead the attack.

This is a lie that even Israel gave up on repeating. Even the US has publicly pushed back on these lies, and yet here you are months later still repeating the lies.

 

[2Quik4UHoes]

That’s odd I thought Israel said everything was okay prior to October 7th

Maybe he was Hamas-curious? Pause

 

[Pressure]

Then stop whining about how you’re not going to vote. We know that you are.

 

[Shogun]

Let me pose some questions, and I’ll preface this by saying a part of me is still undecided on deferring my vote. But let’s say all the people that are disgusted with Biden decide “You know what, Trump is worse so by golly I’m gonna cut the malarkey and vote for Joe” and everyone goes to the polls and votes.

Given what he’s shown of himself during this whole ordeal, how do you think he, and by greater extent, America will look on the world stage? He’s being openly defied by a rogue state that he gleefully bankrolls. What makes us think that he can get the job done when something else happens on the world stage?

Or even at home, who’s really gonna take tough talk or red lines from him seriously? All a republican has to do is sic the Zionist lobby dogs on Biden and any other establishment Dem and they’ll fall in line. So what’s the answer to that? Is the answer eliminating special interest funding/lobbying? Do the Dems need to cultivate new talent for the White House? Can we at the very least acknowledge that the oversized influence of the Zionist lobby is incredibly problematic and a conflict of interest?

It's at least possible that 2nd term Biden is less beholden to the lobbies.
It's not likely, but not impossible. I'd rather take that chance than the possibility of 2nd term Trump riding the tidal wave of controversy that would come with brashly supporting and encouraging Israel...and doing it in a way to intentionally piss everyone off. His grand finale.

 

[LOST IN THE SAUCE]

As a supplemental read

The Left Is Not Joe Biden's Problem. Joe Biden Is.

Without a theory of change, nothing changes.

www.hamiltonnolan.com

 

[2Quik4UHoes]

It's at least possible that 2nd term Biden is less beholden to the lobbies.
It's not likely, but not impossible. I'd rather take that chance than the possibility of 2nd term Trump riding the tidal wave of controversy that would come with brashly supporting and encouraging Israel...and doing it in a way to intentionally piss everyone off. His grand finale.

That’s actually a good answer and I could see that possibly happening.