CinnaSlim
Queen of Swords
You misunderstand my previous statement. Feminists advocated for white women, ignoring women of color and their issues.
The Official Feminist/Womanist/Women's Issues Thread :umad:
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CinnaSlim
Queen of Swords
Women who wanted to focus on their career or who didn't want kids, were/are shamed, called selfish, manly, or unable to get/keep a man, useless. If you can't/couldn't have kids, didn't want any or weren't married by 25, it's perceived as something is wrong with you.
The end goal is to be treated with respect as equals.
CinnaSlim
Queen of Swords
Nowadays in most first world countries women can be almost anything they want. The issue comes in how they are treated at the workplace, or in their lives because they are a woman.
And there are people fighting for equality throughout the world.
philmonroe
Superstar
I'm not trying to be funny since I know we go back and forth with disagreements but this sounds like a lot of avoidable stuff that your using for a movement. Truth is nobody is going to like us all and or treat everybody like equals. Its just not possible and even we don't do it. We treat different people different outside of basic pleasantries most times.
philmonroe
Superstar
We are US based for the majority on here so I'm keeping it here talking about the last sentence. Can't really speak on the other stuff outside of I haven't saw it but know it happens at times.
Can we use the same excuses for the maltreatment of blacks in this country?
CinnaSlim
Queen of Swords
So you mean it's unavoidable?
It's not about being liked. It's about respect, it's about rights.
Just because something is common doesn't mean it's acceptable. All these oppressed groups are fighting for social change and we have seen throughout history that it takes a while but it is possible. Will it be perfect? No. But you can make progress.
philmonroe
Superstar
Actually I do others don't subscribe to my views though but we all have different reasons for our views. I don't know why people use that can we use this for whites too like I'm just going to say damn you got me. I'm pretty consistent on dang near any position I have. I'm human though I'm sure I've been wishy washy before.
Yes it is unavoidable life isn't a utopia. Its always going to be filled with people on that other shyt. You can get basic respect stuff changed and I'd say for the most part we have that but some of the stuff y'all talking about que up the taken good look clip. Y'all can show me stuff going on and I'd never say it don't happen never regarding racial issues but for most of us on a day to day I'd say we are living our lives just as normal as everyone else.
We always make progress but I still feel a lot of people are into excuse making. I hear cats talking like its the 50/60's out here and that's lunacy. Maybe because I see in my own family success and advancement its hard to take other people serious. Not only them but a friend from HS making a mill a year on avg, other friends I've shown work on here making movies, apps, other avenues of making money. Can't lie seeing that around probably leads to me biased like that and not seeing these same things y'all see so much more than I've ever saw.
wet landscapes
ghost
I feel like every person in a group should be working towards getting the most fair treatment for that group socially and legally (excluding criminals and pedos obv)
so feminists, womanists, MRA's, thats all fine
i think instead of blindy attacking feminism because they think they're being excluded from the girls club, men should be looking to fix the injustices they think they suffer from women
so feminists, womanists, MRA's, thats all fine
i think instead of blindy attacking feminism because they think they're being excluded from the girls club, men should be looking to fix the injustices they think they suffer from women
I get you on that, and that definitely was their GOAL, however I think the "Ignore" wasn't an "Ignore" in the general sense.....cause they recognized you and us as a whole, but had a sinister purpose.........which always brings to mind this famous picture....btw what do you think of the fact finding regarding Gloria Steinam and the CIA connections, that she helped steer the Black feminist movement to destroy the black family:
Check that.........now let me hit you with this...........do you think the Black Feminst movement by DEFAULT, not on PURPOSE, but by DEFAULT, neglected the Black struggle and Black Family as a whole by seeking this goal out?
i'd say (1) relevance and (2) fatigue
there were some poor tactical choices (in hindsight)
feminists picked the wrong hills to die on
it is like when teachers used to push "i before e except after c"
i mean, that's actually a horrible rule of thumb (think about it)
you only have one chance to make a first impression
when you do a suboptimal presentation?? (pick the wrong hill, emphasize wrong rule of thumb)
you'll probably have partial success
then have to split/share priority on the remaining concerns
because you had your chance
as for fatigue, people have limited patience for absorbing challenging information
it becomes shrill noise after a while (like a preacher stuck on hellfire)
larry bird said a team starts tuning out the coach after 2 years
or as they say in management..
if everything is a priority, then nothing is really a priority
indifference builds and intensity/urgency is lost
so less gets done.. and that's why clarity of goals is so important
basically.. women fukked up by not securing more stuff like title ix while the getting was good
now they gotta fall back and wait in a long line with everyone else
CinnaSlim
Queen of Swords
Ok, so from the little bit of Googling I've done, it seems Gloria Steinem's CIA involvement was concerning propaganda. They first used her in Vienna to combat Soviet propaganda.I get you on that, and that definitely was their GOAL, however I think the "Ignore" wasn't an "Ignore" in the general sense.....cause they recognized you and us as a whole, but had a sinister purpose.........which always brings to mind this famous picture....btw what do you think of the fact finding regarding Gloria Steinam and the CIA connections, that she helped steer the Black feminist movement to destroy the black family:
Then I found this page: (I saw many articles written by men but I wanted to get an less biased account)
http://www.harrietfraad.com/writings/the-feminist-movement-what-happened-and-why.html
So it seems, that within the second wave of feminism, there were two groups: The Women's Liberation Movement which was inclusive, inspired by the Civil Rights movement and touted justice for all; and the gendered feminist group, run by priveleged educated mainly white women. With alleged CIA funding, Steinem became the face nc leader of Second Wave Feminism, overshadowing the Women's Lib Movement. That's the gist that I got.
Not surprising. Propaganda is a powerful tool used for social conditioning and engineering. Gloria Steinem herself is a self proclaimed "radical feminist", has multiple times mentioned her (previous) connection with the CIA.
Now onto the "juicy" bit:
http://www.wrongkindofgreen.org/2012/05/01/black-feminism-the-cia-and-gloria-steinem/
This article claims, Steinem ghost wrote and promoted a book, "Black Macho and the Myth of Black Superwoman" for Michelle Wallace.
The book then insulted Black men and the Black Power Movement, inspiring Black Feminism and "Hate Black Men" media.
Here is a recent article on the website for Steinem's magazine which featured and promoted Wallace and her book.
http://msmagazine.com/blog/2011/02/...h-the-myth-of-the-black-superwoman-revisited/
And here is Wallace's own blog:
http://mjsoulpictures.blogspot.com/2009/08/black-macho-and-myth-of-superwoman.html
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My response:
It is sad how Wallace was treated and used by people to push their own agenda. However, again I am not surprised by any of this. Feminism is not a monolithic group. Within feminism there are different groups and ideologies. Every thinks they know what's best for women.
I am glad that you brought this up, because it encourages people to do their own research, to question what they hear and read and to come to their own conclusions.
I don't think most Black Feminists/ Womanists hate black men or want to tear apart Black families. I think whenever you have a disadvantaged group trying to regain power or find their strength there is going to be some resistance and power struggles. Most people don't like change. I do think tho that Black women are more oppressed by White men, the ones in power, but we also have issues with men in general. We still have to deal with issues in our community and in the home.
Women are multi-taskers we are able to make decisions based on multiple varying factors. Men in general think more compartmentalized, solve one problem first, then move on to the next. Men are more black/white, while women are more shades of grey. Men are more like opened/closed circuits, on/off switches while women are more like dimmers lol.
Both ways of thinking are important.
CinnaSlim
Queen of Swords
It's all about priorities.
Women do not want to have to rely on a man, because if you don't have one you are pretty much SOL. So they fight for opportunities for women.
Some women put career first, sacrificing family. Some women put family first sacrificing career. Now, the problem occurs when women want both. They stretch themselves thin. I'm I saying it's impossible? No, but I do believe in the importance of two parent households. Just because you can raise a child alone doesn't mean you should or that it is ideal.
Women who put their career first have children later in life, which is more risky for both mother and child, which is why fertility clinics make so much money today. People are waiting later to have kids. Men too, men don't want to settle down as early, they want to play the field.
Now, career women actually help with the Black struggle. Women are becoming more educated. Like I said, both masculine and feminine ways of thinking and action are needed. However, we need to remember to work together. I do agree that white supremacy succeeds when we fight eachother. We both need to be receptive to eachothers issues and learn to effective communicate without putting eachother down. We are a family, a unit. We have more power when we work together.
If what you imply is true, then yes, the CIA used Steinem to twist real issues and use them as an opportunity to divide black men and women. They didn't create the issues tho. They were already there for centuries.
Men are strong, but you are even stronger and wiser when you have women backing you up. You must also value and protect your women.