The Official "Better Call Saul" Season 6 Thread (Final Season)
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Also Skyler was going to commit suicide in "BB" but they decided against it.
Fred.
First reaction before I read everyone else's responses....
I liked the episode okay and it was plenty intense, but didn't hit that next level for me. I think the main problem was that, for the first time in the show, I predicted most of the main points. I've been saying since forever that it was certain that Lalo would die. Several episodes ago I suggested they might kill off Lalo quickly and then focus on Saul/Kim's story for the closing. Back when Gus hid the gun I said it was obvious foreboding that he would kill Lalo with it, but wanted to doubt myself because it felt too obvious and that was unlike the show.
During the show itself, as Kim was at the door I suddenly realized that it was obvious that this wasn't Lalo's plan, that even though he was desperate he wasn't going to bet on such a weak plan, and that he was doing this all to draw Gus out and divert his team somewhere else. At that moment I also knew that he would force Mike's team to deal with Howard's body and cleanup. Once they showed up at the laundromat it became obvious that Gus would kill him there. And when that power cord appeared on the ground, I knew that Gus was going to work his way over to it to black out the lights and make a run for the gun, and that his body armor would save him.
So unfortunately not much really surprised me, unlike so many previous episodes. This isn't to brag about guessing everything, because as I've said before until now I've pretty much always gotten EVERYTHING wrong and been taken by surprise over and over. It's just suggesting that in some ways the closing of this storyline was either somewhat lazier than previous storylines, or they're just getting a little bit too predictable.
Things I did like:
* Patrick Fabian's acting performance in the episode was extraordinary, probably his best yet
* Lalo being willing to change his plan on Jimmy's suggestion was a great touch. Like Gus it was part of what gave me a clue that this wasn't Lalo's real plan, though I didn't put that together until Kim got to the door and the plan failed.
* The moment where Lalo wiped out the team was set up really well and a great moment
* There's that great ambiguity for Jimmy at the end, where he's been assured by Mike that Lalo is gone....but he's been assured that before....a great place to leave him that neatly closes up the Breaking Bad reference to Lalo that has had everyone guessing all this time.
* When Gus finally gets busted in Breaking Bad, do the feds ever dig up the floor of the meth lab in the laundromat? If so, do they find Lalo and Howard's bodies? And if they do, are they going to just assume that Howard got killed by his drug connection (further tainting his name in the afterlife), or are they going to be able to make some other crazy connections?
I liked the episode okay and it was plenty intense, but didn't hit that next level for me. I think the main problem was that, for the first time in the show, I predicted most of the main points. I've been saying since forever that it was certain that Lalo would die. Several episodes ago I suggested they might kill off Lalo quickly and then focus on Saul/Kim's story for the closing. Back when Gus hid the gun I said it was obvious foreboding that he would kill Lalo with it, but wanted to doubt myself because it felt too obvious and that was unlike the show.
During the show itself, as Kim was at the door I suddenly realized that it was obvious that this wasn't Lalo's plan, that even though he was desperate he wasn't going to bet on such a weak plan, and that he was doing this all to draw Gus out and divert his team somewhere else. At that moment I also knew that he would force Mike's team to deal with Howard's body and cleanup. Once they showed up at the laundromat it became obvious that Gus would kill him there. And when that power cord appeared on the ground, I knew that Gus was going to work his way over to it to black out the lights and make a run for the gun, and that his body armor would save him.
So unfortunately not much really surprised me, unlike so many previous episodes. This isn't to brag about guessing everything, because as I've said before until now I've pretty much always gotten EVERYTHING wrong and been taken by surprise over and over. It's just suggesting that in some ways the closing of this storyline was either somewhat lazier than previous storylines, or they're just getting a little bit too predictable.
Things I did like:
* Patrick Fabian's acting performance in the episode was extraordinary, probably his best yet
* Lalo being willing to change his plan on Jimmy's suggestion was a great touch. Like Gus it was part of what gave me a clue that this wasn't Lalo's real plan, though I didn't put that together until Kim got to the door and the plan failed.
* The moment where Lalo wiped out the team was set up really well and a great moment
* There's that great ambiguity for Jimmy at the end, where he's been assured by Mike that Lalo is gone....but he's been assured that before....a great place to leave him that neatly closes up the Breaking Bad reference to Lalo that has had everyone guessing all this time.
* When Gus finally gets busted in Breaking Bad, do the feds ever dig up the floor of the meth lab in the laundromat? If so, do they find Lalo and Howard's bodies? And if they do, are they going to just assume that Howard got killed by his drug connection (further tainting his name in the afterlife), or are they going to be able to make some other crazy connections?
This is a lot but I'll say a couple things.
1. The closer we get to the "BB" time line the more predictable this show will become. Which is fine IMO because they're just closing a circle at this point. There's 5 eps left, unless they introduce the multiverse we already pretty much know what happens to Lalo (he's not in "BB"), Gus, Saul, Mike, etc.
The only wild cards atm are Kim and Gene.
2. In episode 1 of season 5 of "BB", they briefly showed the lab burned up with Hank and Gomez down there, which is when they noticed the camera.
Aside from that they didn't really go too much into what else they found down there. They could do another scene during "BB" timeline addressing what you said....but with 5 eps left I doubt they will.
Fred.
1. good point
2. I'm not thinking needing an episode to address it. I'm thinking during the post-BB timeline there may be some chance of Saul's identity getting exposed and then when the feds get at him it becomes known they're looking into Howard's murder too and not just the drug shyt.
Lalo's death could have been more realistic.
Lalo is a lifelong cartel goon and trained assassin.
Gus is a businessman and fringe psychopath.
Yet Gus pulls a James Bond out of thin air?
I thought it was realistic enough. Gus has the advantage of the bulletproof jacket and knowing the terrain, which is a big-ass deal in the dark when you're almost shooting at random. Plus he knew what his plan was going to be and Lalo was taken by surprise.
Lalo's biggest advantage is gun in hand and almost on point (even with the camera causing difficulties) whereas Gus has to get his gun, but sometimes luck is against you.
The other biggest deal is Gus is running while Lalo stood still. It's hard as hell to hit a moving target with a pistol, you almost always end up trailing cause you don't get the barrel on target or you pause for a moment while you pull the trigger. Tough to learn to sweep through the target while making the pull, it's a completely different skill than target practice on stationaries. Whereas once Gus gets his gun he's immediately shooting at the exact spot the shots are coming from.
Gus is a military leader from Chile. It was confirmed when he met with the German and Lidya in the hotel room.
It’s why Don Eladio and company didn’t like or trust him. He’s not just a businessman. He’s a killer on a higher level who’s past is shrouded in mystery.
“In Gus' case, that world of order would have been the Chile of the dictator Augusto Pinochet, whose military government jailed, tortured, or killed tens of thousands in an effort to quash dissent after rising to power in 1973.”
The Gus Origin Story We Never Got To See In Breaking Bad - Looper
There are certain characters that you just know would thrive wherever you dropped them.www.looper.com
“Hector Salamanca refers to him as "generalissimo" and Don Eladio Vuente tells him he's only alive because his reputation preceded him. What we do know is that he left Chile for Mexico in 1986”
Exactly, I told cats about this like 10 years ago:
"All BAD Things Must Come to an End" - Breaking Bad Season 5: Part 2 Official Thread (SPOILERS)
"Breaking Bad" Episode #5.14 (2013) ad feedback IMDbPro.com offers representation listings for over 120,000 individuals, including actors, directors, and producers, as well as company and employee contact details for over 50,000 companies in the entertainment industry. Click here for a free...
Fred.
Holy shyt yeah, never considered that angle of it. Gus coulda been a real killer back in the day.
Saul with the heel turn on Kim.That moment might be the starting point where Kim bounces on Saul.
I can't believe this getting any traction at all. Jimmy DEFINITELY was trying to save her. He knew that if he went to kill Gus, that he probably wouldn't succeed and then Kim's dead, or even if he does succeed Lalo might kill her anyway. Whereas if he sends Kim then she can decide not to go through with it and save her own life if she wants. He wanted it to be her choice rather than being subjected to Lalo's whims.
But once Kim was out there, she was just too loyal to Jimmy and couldn't think of any way to save him without at least trying to go through with it.
Exactly, Lalo didn't expect that shyt to work for a second. At first I thought he was getting desperate and throwing a hail mary without risking himself, but when she got caught at the door I realized the real direction it was going.
She was actually ready to do it
Blew my mind man, and they built it up well too.
I under you being underwhelmed, but it's not a bad thing for some things to be predictable being that the show wasn't trying to pull any plot twist and we essentially KNOW certain things NEED TO HAPPEN to finalize the series and have it seamlessly connected with Breaking Bad. So, we should've known Lalo was gonna die because Gus in the BB series stated to Hector that he was last of the Salamonca's. We should've known WHERE he was going to die due to the foreshadowing of Gus measuring his steps and planting the gun episodes prior. But this is what consistent with this show, the only different is as we approach the end game, some things we just KNOW how it would play out. Lalo going out early is simple deduction because there's so much story that needs to be handled that the Lalo part have to be concluded and they managed to do that well with it tying in how Saul still would've suspected he could be still alive but never fully be sure.
Not all shows are for the purpose of some plot twist or shock. Or every episode for that matter.
As for your BB question. No, the agents didn't dig through the cement or never off-screen stated that they did. Even though that could be a possibility as this show was suggested to bleed into the BB series. But with that said, it would've led into some crazy connections IF the next few episodes are what I think they are in how Howard's "disappearance" is going to be handled. I think the blood on the candle been shown too blatantly that it'll leave a clue. But that's my suspicion.
Going to have to rewatch the episode, so many layers of strategy
One question: why did Lalo leave jimmy alive before leaving? Seems like Jimmy no longer served a purpose at that point
I don't disagree with the first part but worst case scenario he never goes back to Saul's apartment. Leaving him alive at least means he has the option of questioning him at some point.
As far as why he didn't interrogate Saul, and then kill him, before Kim leftyou can look at it one of two ways:
1. Saul can't die because he's in "BB".
2. Lalo is impatient and wanted to set the plan in motion ASAP. He's been trying to prove the lab exists, and failing, for most of his character arc.
Fred.
This is a great debate and a lot of good points.
I think Lalo didn't have anything against Jimmy. He clearly liked him and didn't have any definitive reason to distrust him. And Jimmy doesn't really have anything on Lalo that can hurt Lalo, so keeping him alive isn't any sort of disadvantage. Lalo kills people strategically, he's never random about it, so just blowing Jimmy away when Jimmy might one day provide something useful to him (like telling him more about what he knows about Mike and Gus) isn't his M.O.
And it's worth remembering that as much as we build Mike up, in the end he's just a smart cop. No different than Hank. He's a good detective and he can set up a plan but he's not some kingpin or strategic mastermind. Both of them are brilliant in tough moments but both of them also fall victim to traps when they haven't thought through everything.
Its crazy that the whole time we watched breaking bad, Gus was literally walking on Lalo Salamanca’s grave
I love it when shows completely transform some aspect of their earlier parts like that. No one can ever watch the lab scenes without thinking about the bodies again.
I was really impressed with the cinematography at first but had been getting a bit tired of random shots that felt like they were there for no reason. But the camera moving with the dragging chair shot broke the mold, that shyt was next-level.
Gus had a body double
That caught me by surprise.
"it was ignacio" same shyt he said in BB right ?
Dropping that line to tie it back to BB was beautiful. Jimmy got PTSD for the rest of his life from those repeat apartment moments, he gonna be seeing Lalo in the shadows whenever shyt goes down.
called his family whores
Salamancas been taking mad L's in the death scenes this season.
Gus was playing chess while Lalo was playing checkers
That’s disrespectful as all hell. Lalo, one man, had Gus’s entire operation against the ropes and had Gus himself dead to rights, but fell victim to the classic too much talking trope.
They were both playing chess; Gus just won.
They were both playing some wild risky and at times brilliant chess, Lalo was just too focused on pressing his advantage and didn't know that Gus was trapping him into a set piece in the endgame.
Legit one of my favorite scenes of the episode. Sucks that the entire business is gonna get dissolved by the DEA cause Lyle had put so much work into that shyt and deserved to own his own franchise one day.
Yup yup yup, can't wait to see how that gets tied in.
I was wondering about that too. My thought is that they are probably officially employed by Gus, at least some of them, so if they all go missing at once without explanations there are questions to be asked and he's probably gonna get his shyt searched. So they can't just disappear them, they have to figure out a way to get the bodies explained that doesn't leave people asking questions (same as Howard). Gonna have to put some bodies into a massive fiery car accident or some shyt.
Almost a perfect character, just a fantastic creation.
Nah, Lalo never would have put himself into such a position to be killed by a goon that he was actively combating, he was always too far ahead of them. Only way a guy like Lalo gets killed is if he gets double-crossed by his own, picked off by a random like Saul that he doesn't see coming, underestimates a rival like Gus, or gets cornered completely by the Feds.
Kinda crazy to think about but Kim has fully earned her outcome with that Howard shyt. She completely ruined a man's life and very easily could have driven him to suicide even if he didn't get caught up with Lalo.
I still don't believe she's gonna die, I think she's getting disbarred and probably going to jail, but whatever happens she's certainly not one of the innocents anymore.
Interesting to compare her to Jesse, since they are parallel characters. Jesse did some fukked up shyt (I mean cooking meth already is pretty fukked up shyt even before the killings), but the difference between Jesse and Kim is that Jesse was never fully in control. He's basically did all the shyt he did just to survive. Whereas Kim had real choices ahead of her (yeah yeah yeah shytty upbringing but she had already outlived that) and chose to break bad.
I agree that nothing in Kim's character has pointed to suicide. It would be a total break from how they've built her. Same with Jimmy - he's not the suicidal type. Whereas Chuck was crazy as fukk and Nacho was clearly ready to give his life for his pops. The only reason Jimmy would kill himself is if it somehow frees Kim in the end.
Zero chance of that, Jimmy's brother is a very, very careful lawyer who always had all his shyt in order, he clearly has a will in place and NONE of his pride and joy is going to his fukk-up of a brother.
Nah, this is the Kim and Jimmy story, they're gonna stretch Kim out close to the end. I can't imagine her going until the last three episodes and more likely last two.
Again, be in denial... but as much as part of Jimmy told Kim to go instead of him was to so-called "save Kim", a lot of it is due to his alter-ego taking over as SAUL.
The last scene between Jimmy and Saul TOLD US EXACTLY what it was. It was Chuck at his most brutally honest of who Jimmy is and always been.
It def lacked the shock of episode 7, episode was carried by the music and Kim's intense nervousness. I figure the rest of the cartel storyline is going to be exposition to explain Fring's position in Breaking Bad. Don Eladio is set to return in next weeks episode(pic included)
Thankfully, with the cartel story wrapped up, we'll be back to the what if's since all eyes will be on Kim and Jimmy. I predict the last handful of episodes are gonna throw us through many twists and turns compared to episode 8.
BrBa doesn't show them digging up the bodies, but who's to say they don't eventually? Im sure those investigations take awhile, and they could always have a metal detector go off(remember the guns were throw into the pit with Lalo and Howard), or discover the bodies during deconstruction/demolition of the lab after investigation. Could possibly bring some trouble for Saul as he's making his escape(or return) in Albuquerque.
It def lacked the shock of episode 7, episode was carried by the music and Kim's intense nervousness. I figure the rest of the cartel storyline is going to be exposition to explain Fring's position in Breaking Bad. Don Eladio is set to return in next weeks episode(pic included)
Thankfully, with the cartel story wrapped up, we'll be back to the what if's since all eyes will be on Kim and Jimmy. I predict the last handful of episodes are gonna throw us through many twists and turns compared to episode 8.
BrBa doesn't show them digging up the bodies, but who's to say they don't eventually? Im sure those investigations take awhile, and they could always have a metal detector go off(remember the guns were throw into the pit with Lalo and Howard), or discover the bodies during deconstruction/demolition of the lab after investigation. Could possibly bring some trouble for Saul as he's making his escape(or return) in Albuquerque.
they could only prove that saul knew both of them, not enough to charge him with murder or whatever