the at hletic talk
NBA Draft confidential: Coaches, execs discuss Cade Cunningham, debate Jalen Green vs. Jalen Suggs, sleepers
NBA Draft confidential: Coaches, execs discuss Cade Cunningham, debate Jalen Green vs. Jalen Suggs, sleepers
The Pistons will take Cade Cunningham at No. 1 … right?
Detroit’s brain trust said all the right things after winning the NBA Draft Lottery — that it wasn’t wedded to the do-everything Cunningham, the brilliant Oklahoma State playmaker, that the Pistons would give strong consideration to Gonzaga’s Jalen Suggs or G-Leaguer Jalen Green with the top selection. They’ll no doubt do their due diligence on everyone else, including USC big Evan Mobley. But you can’t overthink No. 1. There’s no one making a true compelling argument against the obvious choice of Cunningham, a 6-foot-8 guard with a 7-1 wingspan, amazing passing ability and poise.
Eastern Conference executive 1: All worthy candidates to at least consider, but Cade is hard to pass on.
Eastern Conference executive 2: Now, maybe (GM Troy Weaver) sees something in Mobley that nobody else sees. And that could be him. Troy knows how to pick ’em. So maybe he sees something in Evan that he doesn’t quite see in Cade — long term, for their team. The other part about Evan is Wasserman. Arn (Tellem, the former mega-agent, who is now the Pistons’ vice chairman) created Wasserman, so there could be a connection there.
It’s kind of unfair (to discuss weaknesses) because he obviously is a level above what he was playing, where he was playing, in college. Maybe he didn’t show the athleticism that he might show once he gets to this level. The lack of athleticism that he wasn’t forced to show in college, he was able to get by because of his size, by position and skill set. So if he’s not explosive like Paul George, he’s not able to do those things, that size is only going to take him so far. (Luka) Dončić is doing some things at that same size. Luka’s big. Luka’s a big dude. And he’s very crafty with his footwork and his ability to separate, get his shot off. And I don’t know if Cade has that against this speed, at this level. But it’s kind of unfair for me to say those are weaknesses because he wasn’t forced to show those strengths at the level he was playing.
Western Conference executive 1: He has it. He surveys the game for the first 15, 20 minutes, then says “what do we need?” And he does it. He’s Scottie Barnes (Florida State’s forward, expected to go high in the Lottery) with a jump shot. That’s my problem with Scottie. (Cunningham)’s Jayson Tatum. Same size. Can score from anywhere on the court.
College head coach (his team played OSU last season): Really impressed by his poise. Unbelievable court presence. Mike (Boynton, Jr., OSU’s head coach) got him prepared for the NBA. He can do everything. He can shoot it, he can pass it. And his body is a kid. When he gets in the weight room he will become even stronger. He didn’t get sped up. We tried. It didn’t bother him one bit. He’s just got that poise and that ability to dictate what happens on the floor. We coached against Ja Morant (in college). Ja made everybody better. He gave them another level of confidence because he makes plays for everybody. He’s got that (same) presence and that ability. He’s got the makeup to be a good defender. You get out there a little early to see his presence. I didn’t feel (any) ego walking into the gym. It’s just a kid that’s excited to play. Some kids just play. He competes.
Jalen or … Jalen?
Very few things are as clear as this — the explosion of the name “Jalen,” and almost all of its variants, from “Jaylen” to “Jaylin,” and so forth — came about because of one person: the late Jeanne Rose, who gave her fourth child a mashing of the baby’s father’s name, James, and her brother’s name, Leonard, in 1973. Two decades later, Jalen Rose was one of the chief catalysts of the famed “Fab Five” at Michigan, and a movement was born. Dozens of Jalens, etc., have come to play basketball and football in the succeeding years. And this year, two more Jalens — Gonzaga freshman guard Jalen Suggs and guard Jalen Green, who played for the G League’s Ignite select team this year rather than go to college — are both set to go in the top four.
Pro-Green
G League coach (his team played Ignite): I’ve seen Jalen since he was in 11th grade, when he was with “Why Not!!” in the EYBL. Then he went to Prolific Prep. … I am impressed with this young man. Someone said he’s like a Zach LaVine. I agree with that. Early on, I don’t know how Zach was when he first came out. I think they considered Zach a little wild, out of control, but an explosive guard, just being athletic. This kid is like Zach, but a little more mature at that age.
That stint in the bubble, I think it helped him play under control. He had to learn to play defense. BShaw (Brian Shaw, Ignite’s coach) and them, playing against all those experienced players (including former NBA vets Jarrett Jack and Bobby Brown), it helped him. … I remember how Kobe was as a young dude. He tried to just be explosive, jump over people at any time. Just being reckless, deviates from the play.
(Green’s) going to be an incredible player. … I heard some negative stuff I didn’t like in the bubble. No one knows these high school dudes, so you hear it. These G league guys and these two-way guys, they have to treat (Ignite) seriously. They were like, “man, what’s with this dude?” Then all of a sudden, he goes on, like, a streak, five in a row, he was hitting 3s, athletic. And you look at him, and he’s just 17 or 18 years old. He’s going to be a steal for a team. He’s going to be a legit two-guard.
I’m trying to look for some problems for him. You’re waiting for his age to kick in, like a problem with his youth. Maybe he’ll get a little wild with it, not know all the pro concepts, deviate from the plays and just go rock on his own. But I don’t see it. … I think he’ll do that right away in the NBA if they let him, and he’s on the right team. The right team has to let him do his thing. He’s a little light of frame, maybe get knocked off his spot. But I can’t think of anything else. He’s got the 3 ball. I think he’s got great elevation on his jumper. He’s relatively consistent with the 3. He takes good shots. Nice little pull-up on the fade. And he can elevate to get his shot off.
G League team executive: He got better and better. On and off the court, he matured. Diligent about his work, wants to make every shot. Smooth. Runs like a deer. He wants to get better. You tell him something, he does it. He wants to be great. He has open ears. … (Ignite) put him in ball screens, he was getting downhill, he was making plays. Whatever you asked him to do, he made the correction. Did a good job of mixing it up, jumper and driving, (which) will make him more dangerous. I think he’s only going to get better and better. (Defensively), he wanted to get better. In the bubble, he cared. He hooped. He never said anything bad. When things didn’t go well, he was accountable.
USA Basketball Member 1: We went to Argentina for the U16s. The experiences these kids have, it really kind of numbs them from being awestruck. Both those kids, it’s not like they had everything perfect. We talked to Jalen Green about coming off the bench. He was sixth man and he handled that tremendously. He was the MVP. Jalen is definitely (better) off the ball. His mindset, to me, is not that of a point guard. He’s a scorer and defender at that wing position. Both (Green and Suggs) can adjust their games to who they’re playing. And they’re both smart kids. You tell them don’t let him go to his right, they’ll pick. They’re not obnoxiously outspoken. Evan (Mobley, who was also on the team) didn’t talk much. Both of them are extroverts. The really good ones want to be coached.
Pro-Suggs
USA Basketball Member 2: Nothing against Jalen Green, but I love Jalen Suggs. That football mentality that he brought to basketball, his toughness, I think is a real separator. Jalen Green is a freak athlete, but Jalen Green also has that smooth west coast game that can sometimes be misconstrued as soft or lazy because he does things so effortlessly. But I would go to war with Suggs every day. He’s tough. He can play. He talks. He leads. His mentality is just different, and I loved it. Loved it. Suggs brought it every day. You knew what you were going to get with him. Part of leading is leading by example. You never had to question whether or not you were getting his best effort. You never had to question whether or not he was locked in. He wanted to win. Winning, sometimes, can get lost in the shuffle. Never with him. If he had to do something that wasn’t glamorous, or wasn’t going to get all the attention, so be it. He was going to be right there doing it. He’s a winner. That’ll translate.
Guys have to be able to play with other really good players. They can’t be that ball dominant. If you get drafted by the Mavericks, Luka Dončić is going to have the ball 90 percent of the time. So if all you can do is be productive when you have the ball, you’re going to have a problem. You go to the Lakers, LeBron’s going to have the ball. If you go to Atlanta, Trae Young’s going to have the ball. That’s just reality. There’s very few guys who are gonna be picked where a team says ‘here’s the ball; it’s your team now.’ That just isn’t gonna happen.
Jalen Suggs, to me, has proved that he can play with other good players and that he’s going to do things that aren’t the most glamorous jobs. He can sacrifice. ’Cause he’s all about winning. If I were picking No. 1 — and no offense to Cade Cunningham, he’s a totally different beast, he’s a 6-8 point guard — but it would take a lot for me to pass up on picking Jalen Suggs. He’s one of my favorites. He’s it, man. …
Jalen Suggs’ game just translates so much easier. His size is going to help him (defensively), both his height and his physicality. He’ll be allowed to be a little bit more physical, as long as he keeps his hands off. Anything inside the 3-point line, he’s going to be allowed to use his chest and his hips. Again, he’s a football player.
Western Conference executive 2: Shot’s not broken. He just needs reps. Everyone wants Ben (Simmons) to become a shooter. So does the defense. That’s what they want him to do. If Suggs can get it to 36, 37 percent, that will be great because he’s really good. The football shows up. He’s got some of that blue-collar shyt in him.
USA Basketball member 1: He is ultra competitive. He loves to compete. Any time we played three-on-three, cutthroat, where there’s a winner or loser, he’d play for a couple of hours. He’s a good athlete, but not as good as Green. Playing football helps his vision. He’s got great vision. From a quarterback standpoint, he knows where people are at. He knows how to make a tough pass. Suggs is certainly, his learning curve will be really low in how to play defense, where he should be. Understands spacing. Reacts really well. Moving when the ball is in the air. He made up a lot of ground when the ball was in the air. Really good on-ball defender.
Eastern Conference executive 2: I’ve seen him work through adversity. I’ve seen him take a step back to fit in with the team, and step in when they needed him to score. I’ve seen him start off bad in a game and come back the second half and turn it on. I have more faith in him coming in. … a lot of times, players are limited in how they’re able to read (plays) — not only offensively, but defensively, too. That’s a player being able to know, “OK, if this happens, then this is going to happen.” You’ve got to have that creativity to be a step ahead of a play.
That’s another reason I like Suggs, because I’ve seen that with him. He’s able to anticipate, not only defensively, but offensively. “If I make this pass, or I come off this screen, I can read that this defense is going to do this, and I’ll have these options to make reads off of.” … Jalen can manipulate the play. I’ve seen LeBron manipulate the play because he knows two steps ahead and what reads to make.
Detroit’s brain trust said all the right things after winning the NBA Draft Lottery — that it wasn’t wedded to the do-everything Cunningham, the brilliant Oklahoma State playmaker, that the Pistons would give strong consideration to Gonzaga’s Jalen Suggs or G-Leaguer Jalen Green with the top selection. They’ll no doubt do their due diligence on everyone else, including USC big Evan Mobley. But you can’t overthink No. 1. There’s no one making a true compelling argument against the obvious choice of Cunningham, a 6-foot-8 guard with a 7-1 wingspan, amazing passing ability and poise.
Eastern Conference executive 1: All worthy candidates to at least consider, but Cade is hard to pass on.
Eastern Conference executive 2: Now, maybe (GM Troy Weaver) sees something in Mobley that nobody else sees. And that could be him. Troy knows how to pick ’em. So maybe he sees something in Evan that he doesn’t quite see in Cade — long term, for their team. The other part about Evan is Wasserman. Arn (Tellem, the former mega-agent, who is now the Pistons’ vice chairman) created Wasserman, so there could be a connection there.
It’s kind of unfair (to discuss weaknesses) because he obviously is a level above what he was playing, where he was playing, in college. Maybe he didn’t show the athleticism that he might show once he gets to this level. The lack of athleticism that he wasn’t forced to show in college, he was able to get by because of his size, by position and skill set. So if he’s not explosive like Paul George, he’s not able to do those things, that size is only going to take him so far. (Luka) Dončić is doing some things at that same size. Luka’s big. Luka’s a big dude. And he’s very crafty with his footwork and his ability to separate, get his shot off. And I don’t know if Cade has that against this speed, at this level. But it’s kind of unfair for me to say those are weaknesses because he wasn’t forced to show those strengths at the level he was playing.
Western Conference executive 1: He has it. He surveys the game for the first 15, 20 minutes, then says “what do we need?” And he does it. He’s Scottie Barnes (Florida State’s forward, expected to go high in the Lottery) with a jump shot. That’s my problem with Scottie. (Cunningham)’s Jayson Tatum. Same size. Can score from anywhere on the court.
College head coach (his team played OSU last season): Really impressed by his poise. Unbelievable court presence. Mike (Boynton, Jr., OSU’s head coach) got him prepared for the NBA. He can do everything. He can shoot it, he can pass it. And his body is a kid. When he gets in the weight room he will become even stronger. He didn’t get sped up. We tried. It didn’t bother him one bit. He’s just got that poise and that ability to dictate what happens on the floor. We coached against Ja Morant (in college). Ja made everybody better. He gave them another level of confidence because he makes plays for everybody. He’s got that (same) presence and that ability. He’s got the makeup to be a good defender. You get out there a little early to see his presence. I didn’t feel (any) ego walking into the gym. It’s just a kid that’s excited to play. Some kids just play. He competes.
Jalen or … Jalen?
Very few things are as clear as this — the explosion of the name “Jalen,” and almost all of its variants, from “Jaylen” to “Jaylin,” and so forth — came about because of one person: the late Jeanne Rose, who gave her fourth child a mashing of the baby’s father’s name, James, and her brother’s name, Leonard, in 1973. Two decades later, Jalen Rose was one of the chief catalysts of the famed “Fab Five” at Michigan, and a movement was born. Dozens of Jalens, etc., have come to play basketball and football in the succeeding years. And this year, two more Jalens — Gonzaga freshman guard Jalen Suggs and guard Jalen Green, who played for the G League’s Ignite select team this year rather than go to college — are both set to go in the top four.
Pro-Green
G League coach (his team played Ignite): I’ve seen Jalen since he was in 11th grade, when he was with “Why Not!!” in the EYBL. Then he went to Prolific Prep. … I am impressed with this young man. Someone said he’s like a Zach LaVine. I agree with that. Early on, I don’t know how Zach was when he first came out. I think they considered Zach a little wild, out of control, but an explosive guard, just being athletic. This kid is like Zach, but a little more mature at that age.
That stint in the bubble, I think it helped him play under control. He had to learn to play defense. BShaw (Brian Shaw, Ignite’s coach) and them, playing against all those experienced players (including former NBA vets Jarrett Jack and Bobby Brown), it helped him. … I remember how Kobe was as a young dude. He tried to just be explosive, jump over people at any time. Just being reckless, deviates from the play.
(Green’s) going to be an incredible player. … I heard some negative stuff I didn’t like in the bubble. No one knows these high school dudes, so you hear it. These G league guys and these two-way guys, they have to treat (Ignite) seriously. They were like, “man, what’s with this dude?” Then all of a sudden, he goes on, like, a streak, five in a row, he was hitting 3s, athletic. And you look at him, and he’s just 17 or 18 years old. He’s going to be a steal for a team. He’s going to be a legit two-guard.
I’m trying to look for some problems for him. You’re waiting for his age to kick in, like a problem with his youth. Maybe he’ll get a little wild with it, not know all the pro concepts, deviate from the plays and just go rock on his own. But I don’t see it. … I think he’ll do that right away in the NBA if they let him, and he’s on the right team. The right team has to let him do his thing. He’s a little light of frame, maybe get knocked off his spot. But I can’t think of anything else. He’s got the 3 ball. I think he’s got great elevation on his jumper. He’s relatively consistent with the 3. He takes good shots. Nice little pull-up on the fade. And he can elevate to get his shot off.
G League team executive: He got better and better. On and off the court, he matured. Diligent about his work, wants to make every shot. Smooth. Runs like a deer. He wants to get better. You tell him something, he does it. He wants to be great. He has open ears. … (Ignite) put him in ball screens, he was getting downhill, he was making plays. Whatever you asked him to do, he made the correction. Did a good job of mixing it up, jumper and driving, (which) will make him more dangerous. I think he’s only going to get better and better. (Defensively), he wanted to get better. In the bubble, he cared. He hooped. He never said anything bad. When things didn’t go well, he was accountable.
USA Basketball Member 1: We went to Argentina for the U16s. The experiences these kids have, it really kind of numbs them from being awestruck. Both those kids, it’s not like they had everything perfect. We talked to Jalen Green about coming off the bench. He was sixth man and he handled that tremendously. He was the MVP. Jalen is definitely (better) off the ball. His mindset, to me, is not that of a point guard. He’s a scorer and defender at that wing position. Both (Green and Suggs) can adjust their games to who they’re playing. And they’re both smart kids. You tell them don’t let him go to his right, they’ll pick. They’re not obnoxiously outspoken. Evan (Mobley, who was also on the team) didn’t talk much. Both of them are extroverts. The really good ones want to be coached.
Pro-Suggs
USA Basketball Member 2: Nothing against Jalen Green, but I love Jalen Suggs. That football mentality that he brought to basketball, his toughness, I think is a real separator. Jalen Green is a freak athlete, but Jalen Green also has that smooth west coast game that can sometimes be misconstrued as soft or lazy because he does things so effortlessly. But I would go to war with Suggs every day. He’s tough. He can play. He talks. He leads. His mentality is just different, and I loved it. Loved it. Suggs brought it every day. You knew what you were going to get with him. Part of leading is leading by example. You never had to question whether or not you were getting his best effort. You never had to question whether or not he was locked in. He wanted to win. Winning, sometimes, can get lost in the shuffle. Never with him. If he had to do something that wasn’t glamorous, or wasn’t going to get all the attention, so be it. He was going to be right there doing it. He’s a winner. That’ll translate.
Guys have to be able to play with other really good players. They can’t be that ball dominant. If you get drafted by the Mavericks, Luka Dončić is going to have the ball 90 percent of the time. So if all you can do is be productive when you have the ball, you’re going to have a problem. You go to the Lakers, LeBron’s going to have the ball. If you go to Atlanta, Trae Young’s going to have the ball. That’s just reality. There’s very few guys who are gonna be picked where a team says ‘here’s the ball; it’s your team now.’ That just isn’t gonna happen.
Jalen Suggs, to me, has proved that he can play with other good players and that he’s going to do things that aren’t the most glamorous jobs. He can sacrifice. ’Cause he’s all about winning. If I were picking No. 1 — and no offense to Cade Cunningham, he’s a totally different beast, he’s a 6-8 point guard — but it would take a lot for me to pass up on picking Jalen Suggs. He’s one of my favorites. He’s it, man. …
Jalen Suggs’ game just translates so much easier. His size is going to help him (defensively), both his height and his physicality. He’ll be allowed to be a little bit more physical, as long as he keeps his hands off. Anything inside the 3-point line, he’s going to be allowed to use his chest and his hips. Again, he’s a football player.
Western Conference executive 2: Shot’s not broken. He just needs reps. Everyone wants Ben (Simmons) to become a shooter. So does the defense. That’s what they want him to do. If Suggs can get it to 36, 37 percent, that will be great because he’s really good. The football shows up. He’s got some of that blue-collar shyt in him.
USA Basketball member 1: He is ultra competitive. He loves to compete. Any time we played three-on-three, cutthroat, where there’s a winner or loser, he’d play for a couple of hours. He’s a good athlete, but not as good as Green. Playing football helps his vision. He’s got great vision. From a quarterback standpoint, he knows where people are at. He knows how to make a tough pass. Suggs is certainly, his learning curve will be really low in how to play defense, where he should be. Understands spacing. Reacts really well. Moving when the ball is in the air. He made up a lot of ground when the ball was in the air. Really good on-ball defender.
Eastern Conference executive 2: I’ve seen him work through adversity. I’ve seen him take a step back to fit in with the team, and step in when they needed him to score. I’ve seen him start off bad in a game and come back the second half and turn it on. I have more faith in him coming in. … a lot of times, players are limited in how they’re able to read (plays) — not only offensively, but defensively, too. That’s a player being able to know, “OK, if this happens, then this is going to happen.” You’ve got to have that creativity to be a step ahead of a play.
That’s another reason I like Suggs, because I’ve seen that with him. He’s able to anticipate, not only defensively, but offensively. “If I make this pass, or I come off this screen, I can read that this defense is going to do this, and I’ll have these options to make reads off of.” … Jalen can manipulate the play. I’ve seen LeBron manipulate the play because he knows two steps ahead and what reads to make.
aka got a undrafted/2nd round grade
cause I'm 6 foot barefoot and I thought some of these guards so much taller. But more power to them .
KPJ and Green about to be the future, they need to tank one more year and get their dream big man and rockets back to being a playoff team 
Told you when rockets got the 2nd pick they would pick Green over Mobley, rockets are going to be bad next year to and the top guys next year play the same damn position as Mobley(provided the rockets get another top 5 pick) with Chet and Paolo and i believe both Chet and Paolo are better then Mobley and will come in to the league better day 1, rockets going to end up like the 76ers where they kept drafting big after big until one work out if they draft mobley this year then draft Chet and Paolo the next 
