THE LANGUAGE OF GOD (Good Lecture)

MMS

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Right but I’m trying to understand the scripture you quoted in response to the other scriptures how YOU see it. Otherwise why even did you respond to me with what you did.

Defeats the purpose if I don’t know your POV on the verse.... which is what I’m asking lol

I want to know what you think, not tell you what I think about what you send me :why:
because from my perspective, you are pro-Goliath without realizing it :jbhmm: thats why I said: "have you really contemplated Goliath?"

source.gif

 
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DoubleClutch

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because from my perspective, you are pro-Goliath without realizing it :jbhmm: thats why I said: "have you really contemplated Goliath?"

source.gif


I tried to click that link but I get an error.
It’s crazy I can’t even view my own thread. I don’t mind replies closed but it’s basically wiped from the internet? :gucci:




:manny:
 

MMS

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Koichos

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@Koichos does Bethlehem really mean “house of bread” in Hebrew :ohhh:
לֶֶֽחֶֶֶֶם leħem is a much more generalized term that means food at least as often as it does bread, and בֵֵּית beit in this sense just means 'place [of]'. Consider last week's Seder-service: the matzοt used for the ceremony are meant to represent לֶֶֽחֶֶֶם עֹֹֽנִִי leħem ˁοni ('poor man’s food').

Why the interest in בֵֵּית־לֶֶֽחֶֶֶֶם Beit-Leħem, anyway—and which town: the one in the Galil or the one high up in the Y'hudean hills?
 
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MMS

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לֶֶֽחֶֶֶֶם leħem is a much more generalized term that means food at least as often as it does bread, and בֵֵּית beit in this sense just means 'place [of]'. Consider last week's Seder-service: the matzοt used for the ceremony are meant to represent לֶֶֽחֶֶֶם עֹֹֽנִִי leħem ˁοni ('poor man’s food').

Why the interest in בֵֵּית־לֶֶֽחֶֶֶֶם Beit-Leħem, anyway—and which town: the one in the Galil or the one high up in the Y'hudean hills?
so...remember when you told me that there was a difference between Nahash (serpent), Nahoshet etc...

could a helmet of "nahoshet" be confused as a "helmet of magic"? :jbhmm: could Goliath be defeated with food?



f819ef261f81f0e867d600a0a781e6b6.jpg
 
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Koichos

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so...remember when you told me that there was a difference between Nahash (serpent), Nahoshet etc...
I am unable to access that thread (it must have been moved to the 'vault', unfortunately), but
נָָָחָָָָשׁ naħash (accent on the last syllable) = snake
נַַֽחַַשׁ naħash (accent penultimate) = sorcery, magic
נְְחֹֹֽשֶֶֶׁת n'ħοshet (accent penultimate) = pure copper

The first and last of these occurs as a kind of pun created by the repeated use of similar-sounding words in ParashatĦuḳḳat’ 21:9
וַַיַַּ֤עַַשׂ מֹֹשֶֶֶׁה֙ נְְחַַ֣שׁ נְְחֹֹֹ֔שֶֶֶׁת וַַיְְשִִׂמֵֵ֖הוּ עַַל־הַַנֵֵּ֑ס
וְְהָָָיָָ֗ה אִִם־נָָָשַַׁ֤ךְ הַַנָָָּחָָָשׁ֙ אֶֶֶת־אִִ֔ישׁ וְְהִִבִִּ֛יט אֶֶֶל־נְְחַַ֥שׁ הַַנְְּחֹֹ֖שֶֶֶׁת וָָָָחָָֽי׃
So Mοsheh made a copper snake [Hebrew: n'ħash n'ħοshet] and mounted it on a pole,
and if a snake bit anyone and he stared intently toward the copper snake [Hebrew: n'ħash han'ħοshet] he would recover.

could a helmet of "nahoshet" be confused as a "helmet of magic"? :jbhmm:
Well, it does not appear to have helped Gοlyat very much... As a matter of fact, Yοnatan ben ˁUzziyel (late first century BCE) translates Gοlyat’s copper headgear in Sh'muël Part I 17:5 derisively using the Aramaic קוֹֹלְְסָָָָא דִִּנְְחָָָָשָָָָׁא ḳοlsa dinħasha ('the lowest of metals').

could Goliath be defeated with food?

Standing at just over 10½ feet (Gοlyat's height is given in Sh'muël Part I 17:4), surely he could have been distracted by some food!
 
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Back to the sacrifices topic (which everyone seems afraid of) it’s clear that God purposely undermines what the devil/pagan religious tried to establish as “evil” and make it “good”.

He used the idea of a practice that is universally accepted and known the ultimate “offering” to God knowing what might seem taboo to “non religious” at the same time works to his own advantage so that people might understand and believe in the idea of TRUE sacrifice which is giving ones own life in a gesture or unconditional love

Plus it fulfilled prophecy and parallels many Old Testament scripture stories I’m sure @Koichos would understand

I still don’t know how @MMS still can’t see it this way (or just chooses to deny it) for whatever reason :why:

Yea it might not have to be a LITERAL sacrifice, but that how we understand the illusion of it don’t we :youngsabo:

Plus it’s just historically what happened and what Jesus himself said so….. your word vs his I guess :manny:

“just as the Son of Man did not come to be served, but to serve, and to give his life as a ransom for many.”

MATTHEW 20:28
 
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MMS

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“just as the Son of Man did not come to be served, but to serve, and to give his life as a ransom for many.”

MATTHEW 20:28
:jbhmm: what happens when you write this instead...would you interpret it the same?

“just as the Son of Woman did not come to be served, but to serve, and to give his life as a ransom for many.”

The Gospel According to Mark 16:1-8​

English Ελληνικά Print
jclifegv.jpg


When the Sabbath was past, Mary Magdalene, and Mary the mother of James and Salome, bought spices, so that they might go and anoint Jesus. And very early on the first day of the week they went to the tomb when the sun had risen. And they were saying to one another, "Who will roll away the stone for us from the door of the tomb?" And looking up, they saw that the stone was rolled back - it was very large. And entering the tomb, they saw a young man sitting on the right side, dressed in a white robe; and they were amazed. And he said to them, "Do not be amazed; you seek Jesus of Nazareth, who was crucified. He has risen, He is not here; see the place where they laid Him. But go, tell His disciples and Peter that He is going before you to Galilee; there you will see Him, as He told you." And they went out and fled from the tomb, for trembling and astonishment had come upon them; and they said nothing to anyone, for they were afraid.

Genesis 45:1-3

1 Then Joseph could not refrain himself before all them that stood by him; and he cried, Cause every man to go out from me. And there stood no man with him, while Joseph made himself known unto his brethren.

2 And he wept aloud: and the Egyptians and the house of Pharaoh heard.

3 And Joseph said unto his brethren, I am Joseph; doth my father yet live? And his brethren could not answer him; for they were troubled at his presence.

RighteousJosephSmall__64861.1669659757.jpg

 

DoubleClutch

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:jbhmm: what happens when you write this instead...would you interpret it the same?

“just as the Son of Woman did not come to be served, but to serve, and to give his life as a ransom for many.”



Genesis 45:1-3



RighteousJosephSmall__64861.1669659757.jpg


come on breh, you know exactly what the “son of man” is referring to. Why troll :snoop:

I’m convinced the gospel is undefeated

I can’t even get any challenge on these forums anymore why try? :manny:
 

Koichos

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Back to the sacrifices topic (which everyone seems afraid of) it’s clear that God purposely undermines what the devil/pagan religious tried to establish as “evil” and make it “good”.

He used the idea of a practice that is universally accepted and known the ultimate “offering” to God knowing what might seem taboo to “non religious” at the same time works to his own advantage so that people might understand and believe in the idea of TRUE sacrifice which is giving ones own life in a gesture or unconditional love

Plus it fulfilled prophecy and parallels many Old Testament scripture stories I’m sure @Koichos would understand
There is not a single instance in the Tana"ch even indicating that He would consider accepting such an abomination (human sacrifice).
 
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DoubleClutch

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There is not a single instance in the Tana"ch even indicating that He would consider accepting such an abomination (human sacrifice).

I think you are missing the point

Why then did God insinuate Issac being sacrificed?

Why was Israel caught up into pagan practices even though they knew better?

Ultimately it’s a test of faith and if you pass the test you understand God better

You can agree with Gods plan of forgiveness or not but if you read the Bible you will understand the concept regardless if you take it literally or not.

Jesus is real historical. The Torah are made up of stories which we don’t necessarily need to take literally to learn the message

After all you as a practicing Jew believe in sacrifices as it’s presented throughout your scriptures but you DONT perform sacrifices today

Am I right? I could be wrong about how you see things :yeshrug:
 

MMS

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I think you are missing the point

Why then did God insinuate Issac being sacrificed?

Why was Israel caught up into pagan practices even though they knew better?

Ultimately it’s a test of faith and if you pass the test you understand God better

You can agree with Gods plan of forgiveness or not but if you read the Bible you will understand the concept regardless if you take it literally or not.

Jesus is real historical. The Torah are made up of stories which we don’t necessarily need to take literally to learn the message

After all you as a practicing Jew believe in sacrifices as it’s presented throughout your scriptures but you DONT perform sacrifices today

Am I right? I could be wrong about how you see things :yeshrug:
you must have missed it the first time

Genesis 21:9-14

9 And Sarah saw the son of Hagar the Egyptian, which she had born unto Abraham, mocking.

10 Wherefore she said unto Abraham, Cast out this bondwoman and her son: for the son of this bondwoman shall not be heir with my son, even with Isaac.

11 And the thing was very grievous in Abraham's sight because of his son.

12 And God said unto Abraham, Let it not be grievous in thy sight because of the lad, and because of thy bondwoman; in all that Sarah hath said unto thee, hearken unto her voice; for in Isaac shall thy seed be called.

13 And also of the son of the bondwoman will I make a nation, because he is thy seed.

14 And Abraham rose up early in the morning, and took bread, and a bottle of water, and gave it unto Hagar, putting it on her shoulder, and the child, and sent her away: and she departed, and wandered in the wilderness of Beersheba.

Genesis 22:1-17

1 And it came to pass after these things, that God did tempt Abraham, and said unto him, Abraham: and he said, Behold, here I am.

2 And he said, Take now thy son, thine only son Isaac, whom thou lovest, and get thee into the land of Moriah; and offer him there for a burnt offering upon one of the mountains which I will tell thee of.

3 And Abraham rose up early in the morning, and saddled his ass, and took two of his young men with him, and Isaac his son, and clave the wood for the burnt offering, and rose up, and went unto the place of which God had told him.

4 Then on the third day Abraham lifted up his eyes, and saw the place afar off.

5 And Abraham said unto his young men, Abide ye here with the ass; and I and the lad will go yonder and worship, and come again to you.

6 And Abraham took the wood of the burnt offering, and laid it upon Isaac his son; and he took the fire in his hand, and a knife; and they went both of them together.

7 And Isaac spake unto Abraham his father, and said, My father: and he said, Here am I, my son. And he said, Behold the fire and the wood: but where is the lamb for a burnt offering?

8 And Abraham said, My son, God will provide himself a lamb for a burnt offering: so they went both of them together.

9 And they came to the place which God had told him of; and Abraham built an altar there, and laid the wood in order, and bound Isaac his son, and laid him on the altar upon the wood.

10 And Abraham stretched forth his hand, and took the knife to slay his son.

11 And the angel of the Lord called unto him out of heaven, and said, Abraham, Abraham: and he said, Here am I.

12 And he said, Lay not thine hand upon the lad, neither do thou any thing unto him: for now I know that thou fearest God, seeing thou hast not withheld thy son, thine only son from me.

13 And Abraham lifted up his eyes, and looked, and behold behind him a ram caught in a thicket by his horns: and Abraham went and took the ram, and offered him up for a burnt offering in the stead of his son.

14 And Abraham called the name of that place Jehovahjireh: as it is said to this day, In the mount of the Lord it shall be seen.

15 And the angel of the Lord called unto Abraham out of heaven the second time,

16 And said, By myself have I sworn, saith the Lord, for because thou hast done this thing, and hast not withheld thy son, thine only son:

17 That in blessing I will bless thee, and in multiplying I will multiply thy seed as the stars of the heaven, and as the sand which is upon the sea shore; and thy seed shall possess the gate of his enemies;

is Ishmael the firstborn son of Abraham? :jbhmm: and if not who?
 
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Koichos

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I think you are missing the point

Why then did God insinuate Issac being sacrificed?
i. God does not say זְְבָָָחֵֵֽהוּ z'vaħehu ('sacrifice him') or שְְׁחָָָטֵֵֽהוּ sh'ħaṭehu ('slaughter him'), but הַַעֲֲֲלֵֵֽהוּ haˁalehu ('take him up'); and
ii. as you yourself acknowledge, and as ParashatVayyera’ 22:1 explicitly states (refer also to 22:12), God נִִסָָָּה nissah ('tested him').

In fact, Avraham knew Yitz'ħaḳ would be returning with him, hence the reason he tells his two servants who had accompanied them to
שְְׁבֽוּ־לָָָכֶ֥ם פֹֹּה֙ עִִם־הַַֽחֲֲמ֔וֹֹר וַַֽאֲֲֲנִ֣י וְְהַַנַַּ֔עַַר נֵֵֽלְְכָ֖ה עַַד־כֹֹּ֑ה וְְנִשְְׁתַַּֽחֲֲוֶ֖ה וְְנָשׁ֥וּבָָָה אֲֲלֵֵיכֶֽם׃...
...stay here with the donkey while Yitz'ħaḳ and I go over there; once we have worshiped, we will come back to you. (ibid., 22:5)

Why was Israel caught up into pagan practices even though they knew better?

Ultimately it’s a test of faith and if you pass the test you understand God better

You can agree with Gods plan of forgiveness or not but if you read the Bible you will understand the concept regardless if you take it literally or not.

Jesus is real historical. The Torah are made up of stories which we don’t necessarily need to take literally to learn the message

After all you as a practicing Jew believe in sacrifices as it’s presented throughout your scriptures but you DONT perform sacrifices today

Am I right? I could be wrong about how you see things :yeshrug:
Yes, the mitzvah is not to do the sacrifices if there is no Temple (ParashatAħarei Mοt’ 17:1-4). We do, however, recite prayers such as
כֵֵּן יְְיָָָ אֱֱֱלֹקֵֵֽינוּ יַַגִִּיעֵֵֽנוּ לְְמוֹֹעֲֲדִִים וְְלִִרְְגָָָלִִים אֲֲחֵֵרִִים הַַבָָָּאִִים לִִקְְרָָָאתֵֵֽנוּ לְְשָָׁלוֹֹם, שְְׂמֵֵחִִים בְְּבִִנְְיַַן עִִירֶֶֽךָָ וְְשָָָׂשִִׂים בַַּעֲֲבוֹֹדָָתֶֶֽךָָ—וְְנֹֹאכַַל שָָׁם מִִן הַַזְְּבָָחִִים וּמִִן הַַפְְּסָָחִִים אֲֲשֶֶֶׁר יַַגִִּֽיעַַ דָָָּמָָם עַַל קִִיר מִִזְְבַַּחֲֲךָָ לְְרָָָצוֹֹן
So Adοnai, our God, will bring us to other holy days and pilgrimage festivals that are coming in the future, rejoicing at the rebuilding of Your city and being happy in Your service—and there we shall eat from the festive offerings and the Pesaħ animals whose blood will be splashed against the panels of Your altar for Your favor...
during the Haggadah-ceremonial for Pesaħ Eve in anticipation of the Temple ritual's restoration, of which the sacrificial system is part.
 
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