The AMC Stock Discussion Thread

[Master Teacher]

Yes and no.

Purposely selling naked shorts is illegal. But it’s perfectly legal to sell/loan a share before actually physical securing it.

You are supposed to secure the share within a certain amount of time but that’s a huge gray area that allows them to keep loaning/borrowing/selling shares over and over again without ever confirming or securing the original share.


Agreed. Am looking forward to how all these new rules play out.

Sell/loan a share is what margin is or option contracts, the are real shares somebody is lending out or a broker allowing you to use their money to buy a real share

naked shorting has always been illegal, the shares do not exist, they are borrowing shares they do not exist, what don't you understand

its always been an illegal practice

 

[MeachTheMonster]

Sell/loan a share is what margin is or option contracts, the are real shares somebody is lending out or a broker allowing you to use their money to buy a real share

naked shorting has always been illegal, the shares do not exist, they are borrowing shares they do not exist, what don't you understand

its always been an illegal practice

Again.

Selling a share before securing it is perfectly legal

Loaning a share before securing it is perfectly legal.

creating a share out of thin air in order to short a stock is illegal.

They use the gray area created by the first two points in order to “naked short” without it being illegal.

Ive used this analogy before.

It’s like the police.

We all know murder is illegal. But there’s enough wiggle room and gray area within the laws that they can pretty much murder with impunity.

The only way to actually charge them with murder is to prove intent, which is damn there impossible.

Same with Naked shorts, market Manipulation, etc.

SEC would have to prove intent. Which again is damn there impossible.

 

[Master Teacher]

Again.

Selling a share before securing it is perfectly legal

Loaning a share before securing it is perfectly legal.

creating a share out of thin air in order to short a stock is illegal.

They use the gray area created by the first two points in order to “naked short” without it being illegal.

Ive used this analogy before.

It’s like the police.

We all know murder is illegal. But there’s enough wiggle room and gray area within the laws that they can pretty much murder with impunity.

The only way to actually charge them with murder is to prove intent, which is damn there impossible.

Same with Naked shorts, market Manipulation, etc.

SEC would have to prove intent. Which again is damn there impossible.

That's exactly what Naked Shorting is lmao

Selling and Loaning real shares isn't illegal

Naked shorting has always been illegal why don't you just ask google lmao

 

[MeachTheMonster]

That's exactly what Naked Shorting is lmao

Selling and Loaning real shares isn't illegal

Naked shorting has always been illegal why don't you just ask google lmao

You are not understanding what I’m saying.

Say I’m a market maker.

I loan a share before I secure it.

The hedge fund that borrowed the share can now sell it into the market.

So that is effectively a “naked short” but it’s perfectly legal.

The market maker is supposed to secure the share within a set period of time. But they can also “borrow” a share in order to cover for the share they loaned out.

This goes on and on until there’s millions of shares on the market that shouldn’t exist, but these don’t qualify as “illegal naked shorts” unless the SEC or anyone else can prove this is what they intended to do in order to lower the stock price.

 

[Software]

You are not understanding what I’m saying.

Say I’m a market maker.

I loan a share before I secure it.

The hedge fund that borrowed the share can now sell it into the market.

So that is effectively a “naked short” but it’s perfectly legal.

The market maker is supposed to secure the share within a set period of time. But they can also “borrow” a share in order to cover for the share they loaned out.

This goes on and on until there’s millions of shares on the market that shouldn’t exist, but these don’t qualify as “illegal naked shorts” unless the SEC or anyone else can prove this is what they intended to do in order to lower the stock price.

Bruh it looks like you're arguing with yourself
Both y'all got that banner and no Avatar

 

[MeachTheMonster]

Bruh it looks like you're arguing with yourself
Both y'all got that banner and no Avatar

We get mixed up a lot

Ive had people @ Me for shyt he’s said

 

[Master Teacher]

You are not understanding what I’m saying.

Say I’m a market maker.

I loan a share before I secure it.

The hedge fund that borrowed the share can now sell it into the market.

So that is effectively a “naked short” but it’s perfectly legal.

The market maker is supposed to secure the share within a set period of time. But they can also “borrow” a share in order to cover for the share they loaned out.

This goes on and on until there’s millions of shares on the market that shouldn’t exist, but these don’t qualify as “illegal naked shorts” unless the SEC or anyone else can prove this is what they intended to do in order to lower the stock price.

That's not what a market maker does

they are just the middle man between buyers and sellers

all they do is these transactions

What Is Naked Shorting
Naked shorting is the illegal practice of short selling shares that have not been affirmatively determined to exist. Ordinarily, traders must borrow a stock or determine that it can be borrowed before they sell it short. So naked shorting refers to short pressure on a stock that may be larger than the tradable shares in the market.

this is the definition of naked shorting it is illegal

 

[Software]

Is there a general crypto thread on thecoli? ADA doubled over the past year

This is a good point breh
@Master Teacher I know you're pretty critical of crypto in general but what do you think will happen to those invested in those currencies once the short squeeze takes place?
Would crypto be undervalued again due to mass dumping for collateral to buy back shorts and set the stage for another pump like we saw during this pandemic?

 

[Master Teacher]

This is a good point breh
@Master Teacher I know you're pretty critical of crypto in general but what do you think will happen to those invested in those currencies once the short squeeze takes place?
Would crypto be undervalued again due to mass dumping for collateral to buy back shorts and set the stage for another pump like we saw during this pandemic?

I stop keeping up with crypto, it's too dangerous, the best time to get in was years ago, those people made out like bandits

right now it's just way too risky, after the squeeze I'm investing only real estate, because at the end of the day it's the only investment where diamond hands guarantee profits it's impossible to lose your money with property, because you can also ways leverage it, by taking out loan against it, then renting it out to debt service it, or selling it etc

Those people still in red after bitcoin has surged back up nearly 20k, lmao, as soon as they get their money back the smart ones will cash out and it will crash again, but things like ADA are still cheap enough to make a nice come up, and I think doge will eventually hit the dollar before it tanks for good, but I'm not investing energy in any of that shyt, it's a scam

once covid is contained and everything is back to normal crypto currency will be squashed by the governments, it's not a real currency

Adam Aron did a good thing saying he will accept bitcoin, so at least all those back holders will be able to enjoy great times at the theater with tehir worthless currency

 

[MeachTheMonster]

That's not what a market maker does

they are just the middle man between buyers and sellers

all they do is these transactions

What Is Naked Shorting
Naked shorting is the illegal practice of short selling shares that have not been affirmatively determined to exist. Ordinarily, traders must borrow a stock or determine that it can be borrowed before they sell it short. So naked shorting refers to short pressure on a stock that may be larger than the tradable shares in the market.

this is the definition of naked shorting it is illegal

I’m not gone keep going back and forth with you but what I said is true.

Selling or loaning a share without actually securing/confirming it is perfectly legal.

You can extrapolate from there how phantom shares can be sold short on the market and be legal.

 

[Master Teacher]

I’m not gone keep going back and forth with you but what I said is true.

Selling or loaning a share without actually securing/confirming it is perfectly legal.

You can extrapolate from there how phantom shares can be sold short on the market and be legal.

Stop being ignorant I just posted the definition of naked shortings its nothing what your describing which doesn't even make any sense

I mean you can use margin without having all the money to confirm the shares and buy options for without having the collateral for the shares, but that's why they can raise the margin requirements that's what a margin call is from whoever loaned you the money to secure the shares

Nobody even knows how naked shorting is even done that's the problem
its creating shares that don't exist

all this shyt happens when the banks are closed and nobody is around

 

[MeachTheMonster]

Stop being ignorant I just posted the definition of naked shortings its nothing what your describing which doesn't even make any sense

Nobody even knows how naked shorting is even done that's the problem

all this shyt happens when the banks are closed and nobody is around

I’m not the one being ignorant here.

You seem confused on what any of this means.

simply googling a definition won’t help you here. There’s too much gray area.

 

[Master Teacher]

I’m not the one being ignorant here.

You seem confused on what any of this means.

simply googling a definition won’t help you here. There’s too much gray area.

Just posted the legal definition of naked shorting

You talking about loaning shares, that's up to institution who holds the shares

Naked Shorting is creating shares that do not exist not being loaned shares

It's illegal

Lehman brothers got in trouble for naked shoring in 2008, this shyt is documented lmao

 

[Master Teacher]

@MeachTheMonster
Did Naked Shorting Do Lehman In? - The Big Picture (ritholtz.com) 2009 article

The biggest bankruptcy in history might have been avoided if Wall Street had been prevented from practicing one of its darkest arts.

As Lehman Brothers Holdings Inc. struggled to survive last year, as many as 32.8 million shares in the company were sold and not delivered to buyers on time as of Sept. 11, according to data compiled by the Securities and Exchange Commission and Bloomberg. That was a more than 57-fold increase over the prior year’s peak of 567,518 failed trades on July 30. The SEC has linked such so-called fails-to-deliver to naked short selling, a strategy that can be used to manipulate markets. A fail-to-deliver is a trade that doesn’t settle within three days.”

 

[MeachTheMonster]

Just posted the legal definition of naked shorting

You talking about loaning shares, that's up to institution who holds the shares

Naked Shorting is creating shares that do not exist not being loaned shares

It's illegal

Lehman brothers got in trouble for naked shoring in 2008, this shyt is documented lmao

Like I said it seems you don’t understand what any of this means.

In order to “short” a stock. It must be loaned/borrowed in the first place.

Since you like google so much read this.
Naked Shorting is Illegal So How the Hell was GameStop 140% Short