Shedeur Sanders vs Caleb Williams as NFL prospects

[Rekkapryde]

Caleb is better but we know how usc qb’s get down in the league.

Is there something we don't know about

 

[premier58]

Yes, every once in awhile, there are exceptions to the rule of "frauds" (who aren't really frauds, I mean their job is to win college football games and execute the system, not run Green Bay Packers offense)

But in the system I named, RG3 was the only one ever to have minimal NFL success. And he had freakish arm talent and was an Olympic-level track athlete.

And Patrick Mahomes could have be one of the top 3 arm-talents to ever play football, already at this stage in his career.

Are you suggesting Sanders is in that realm?

Frauds is not me speaking, its what the general consensus was of those who came from TTU. Ppl wanted to avoid those dudes like the plague, same as Penn State RB's. Hell I remember ppl were skeptical about Braylon Edwards because of how much David Terrell disappointed in the NFL, although Derrick Alexander and Amani Toomer were very good NFL WR's from Michigan right before Terrell. You from VA, right? You have any stories about David Terrell, btw? Do I think Sanders has Mahomes level talent? Of course not, but assuming hes gonna fail because every Qb played well in that system is not accurate. I have another scenario. The Jeff Tedford offense. Akili Smith, Joey Harrington and Kyle Boller all became high 1st rounders in his offense and they all were disappointments/busts in the NFL. So by your coach friends' logic, Aaron Rodgers(who dominated in that same offenas)wouldnt be a success, based on their failure? Is Shedeur the exception? Thats yet to.be seen, but thats not 100 percent accurate analysis. Coaches and GMs are wrong about players all the time. Bill Belichick thought that Jonathan Baldwin was a better prospect than Julio Jones. And traded out of a pick in the 95 draft when Kyle Brady was taken, although Warren Sapp was sitting right there.

 

[KateFabersBoyfriend]

Is there something we don't know about

They bust.

 

[Rekkapryde]

I do not see the differenc between Kylar, Baker and Caleb other than Kylar speed

this nikka the best

 

[Left.A1]

Frauds is not me speaking, its what the general consensus was of those who came from TTU. Ppl wanted to avoid those dudes like the plague, same as Penn State RB's. Hell I remember ppl were skeptical about Braylon Edwards because of how much David Terrell disappointed in the NFL, although Derrick Alexander and Amani Toomer were very good NFL WR's from Michigan right before Terrell. You from VA, right? You have any stories about David Terrell, btw? Do I think Sanders has Mahomes level talent? Of course not, but assuming hes gonna fail because every Qb played well in that system is not accurate. I have another scenario. The Jeff Tedford offense. Akili Smith, Joey Harrington and Kyle Boller all became high 1st rounders in his offense and they all were disappointments/busts in the NFL. So by your coach friends' logic, Aaron Rodgers(who dominated in that same offenas)wouldnt be a success, based on their failure? Is Shedeur the exception? Thats yet to.be seen, but thats not 100 percent accurate analysis. Coaches and GMs are wrong about players all the time. Bill Belichick thought that Jonathan Baldwin was a better prospect than Julio Jones. And traded out of a pick in the 95 draft when Kyle Brady was taken, although Warren Sapp was sitting right there.

It’s a pretty amateur sounding criteria for player evaluation for a supposedly high level big time scout …. any seasoned rep should no and understand the basic concept of correlation not equaling causation …. instead of measuring a prospect on his actual tools your talking about what someone else’s incompetencies where?

Silly, If we don’t even know who this guy is we have no way of evaluating whether or not he’s even good at his alleged job anyways …just having a title in the NFL doesn’t make you competent …NFL personnel get fired all the time because of that

 

[Rekkapryde]

Kliff Kingsbury, B.J. Symons, Graham Harrell, Patrick Mahomes. There is always an exception to the rule. Prior to the dominance of Mahomes, all Texas Tech QBs were considered frauds who were products of a system which made every QB look good. He changed that.

shyt is all a crapshoot at the end of the day.

also people discount the situation QBs come into big time. That shyt is arguably the most important thing.

 

[premier58]

It’s a pretty amateur sounding criteria for player evaluation for a supposedly high level big time scout …. any seasoned rep should no and understand the basic concept of correlation not equaling causation …. instead of measuring a prospect on his actual tools your talking about what someone else’s incompetencies where?

Silly, If we don’t even know who this guy is we have no way of evaluating whether or not he’s even good at his alleged job anyways …just having a title in the NFL doesn’t make you competent …NFL personnel get fired all the time because of that

Exactly. GOAT.coaches with SB rings have made boneheaded decisions and evaluations, but we are supposed to believe that this "NFL Coach" is beyond reproach? We watched Andy Reid select Edwards Helaire over Jonathan Taylor, Mecole Hardman over DK Metcalf. Etc..

 

[Big Boss]

Kliff Kingsbury, B.J. Symons, Graham Harrell, Patrick Mahomes. There is always an exception to the rule. Prior to the dominance of Mahomes, all Texas Tech QBs were considered frauds who were products of a system which made every QB look good. He changed that.

Or maybe Andy Reid changed that

 

[premier58]

shyt is all a crapshoot at the end of the day.

also people discount the situation QBs come into big time. That shyt is arguably the most important thing.

Where you go to mattere, but if you can play, it eventually will show. Aikman went to a terrible Dallas team and he survived and showed flashes, mental toughness and physical toughness, until he got reinforcements.

 

[Rekkapryde]

Where you go to mattere, but if you can play, it eventually will show. Aikman went to a terrible Dallas team and he survived and showed flashes, mental toughness and physical toughness, until he got reinforcements.

Indeed, but you also got a lot of players who don't get the chance to work through their struggles even when you can see the talent. shyt is weird. But you definitely take the chance on the guys with the all of the tools first.

 

[premier58]

Indeed, but you also got a lot of players who don't get the chance to work through their struggles even when you can see the talent. shyt is weird. But you definitely take the chance on the guys with the all of the tools first.

I can agree with that. Most of that is based on preconceived notions. High draft picks generally get infinite amount of time to figure it out

 

[DropTopDoc]

No he wasn't. Your team was running the same defense from beginning to end. Same blitzes. Same stunts. Same everything. Uncreative ass defense.

Watch the damn snaps. What Shedeur is doing is harder. That doesn't change the fact that Caleb has tremendous and rare talent but what he's doing isn't all that hard. What Sanders is doing translates to the NFL

Bruh, your love for Deion, got you out here saying what Caleb is doing isn’t hard…. Tf playing qb is hard, being a really good one is even harder, and it’s not like he’s a runner first, he’s doing what he does from the pocket. I think lil Deion is a good to great qb and no reason he doesn’t deserve his shot, but you not being objective in your analysis

 

[CrimsonTider]

this nikka the best

How are they different?

They all play the exact same way in the exact same system

 

[Apprentice]

How are they different?

They all play the exact same way in the exact same system

Lol naw

I’ll break it down simple and this is as NFL prospects not players

In the pocket - Caleb > Baker = Kyler

Off platform throws - Caleb > Kyler > Baker

Scrambling ability - Kyler > Caleb > Baker

Size - Caleb > Baker > Kyler

Caleb hits pretty much every box, and you can make the argument he scrambles as well as Kyler he just chooses not to

Also Caleb been elite since his freshman year, can’t say the same about the other 2

 

[Hov]

It’s a pretty amateur sounding criteria for player evaluation for a supposedly high level big time scout …. any seasoned rep should no and understand the basic concept of correlation not equaling causation …. instead of measuring a prospect on his actual tools your talking about what someone else’s incompetencies where?

Silly, If we don’t even know who this guy is we have no way of evaluating whether or not he’s even good at his alleged job anyways …just having a title in the NFL doesn’t make you competent …NFL personnel get fired all the time because of that

Comprehension is super fukking key to reading like an adult lol

The analysis in my short post (we can get super detailed if you want to) was basically “these numbers are not impressive. This is the system that causes those numbers to look the way they do, so those are disregarded at this juncture in time” because the media is pretty much hyping his numbers.

So if the numbers are system produced and every other guy does basically the same thing to varying levels, we have to go with physical tools - arm talent, etc.

Sanders isn’t exceptional at any of those things. Average athlete, decent arm.

Exceptional pedigree and intangibles (as stated by the same coach) and I believe that as well. He’s going to do the right thing and he’s going to work hard.

We both agreed that the prime example of a guy like that playing right now is Jalen Hurts.

I would say Rus Wilson as well but he checked me on that and said Rus has superior arm talent and could’ve been a good baseball player as well.

This ain’t hating on the kid, it’s just he ain’t no super QB top 2-3 guy kinda player, and if he didn’t have the Deion name we wouldn’t be having a debate up there with a Caleb Williams, Penix or other guys