Science eventually leads back to God

[the cac mamba]

Actually, what you said isn't true.

Genesis 1:1 KJV
In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.

God is not subject to time, space or matter as He is outside of it.

If you choose to believe something came from nothing you would be a hypocrite. You believe the entire universe came spontaneously from nothing but you don't act as if something spontaneously pops into existence around you like a giraffe, tree or even a dodo bird.

but that's exactly what you believe about god i dont care how you dress up the language

you believe god was "always just there", and feel no need to explain it. it's the greatest copout in human history

so i just substitute the universe with god, in your bible verse. same exact shyt

 

[Marks]

Im not so sure

consider Atum. "The Complete One"

the mistake of today is people say "I am not complete" or "I lack" or better yet "I will be ____when___happens"

What happens when you start to say:

There is nothing to unveil, here I am not hidden but revealed. I am reborn and refreshed every day every second.

like the plucked chord of a strung instrument

I can rebound to my original disposition or break under tension...

yet i can be refashioned and restrung, a spirit indestructible God has fashioned me



What and where is lightland?

In the egyptian thought the "frog" is like a demiurge...so a plague of frogs is like a plague of creators. Whose light is brightest?

Spoiler

Unas - Wikipedia

Where the Wild Things Are - Wikipedia


Thoth | Age of Empires Series Wiki | Fandom
“ You have advanced to the Mythic Age through the Secrets of Thoth. ”


Unut - Wikipedia

We are living in a world of illusion


a burning bush can turn into a bush fire Helix (Final Fantasy VIII)

Bible Gateway passage: Isaiah 19:4 - King James Version

This is something I've contemplated and meditated on at various points in my life to good effect. No matter what circumstances is going on, resting in "I am whole now. I have everything I need" no matter if life kinda kicking my ass at the moment I have often found shyt will flow quickly back in my favor. Like always though, you forget, you slip out of the kingdom again lol.

 

[Thsnnor]

but that's exactly what you believe about god i dont care how you dress up the language

you believe god was "always just there", and feel no need to explain it. it's the greatest copout in human history

so i just substitute the universe with god, in your bible verse. same exact shyt

Based on what you just said you are the type of person to go to the Louvre, walk up to the Mona Lisa and yell at it till you see Da Vinci.

The Creator is in the creation but the Creator is NOT made up out of the creation.

 

[Tair]

Science doesn't prove anything so I doubt it leads anyone to G-d, and much less can prove or disprove G-d.

You'd need a more objective way to prove G-d which is mathematics. Kurt Godel's proof is a start but some philosophers have problems with a few of his premises (not that they've proven the premises to be unsound but still...). I am still learning about spirituality.

im not so sure

as the dialogue ive had with @Marks has indicated. Logic and reason are not something we are born with but when you are born you know you are alive because you breathe, you can feel your blood, you can feel sensation and you are because you are

however once you go down the path of saying "I am because I think" you might be mistaken. You are because the universe fashioned you, rather than you fashioning yourself

Consider the virgin birth of Jesus. God made union with the virgin mary as the holy spirit and she conceived and brought forth a child yet she remained a virgin after delivery...what does that mean? How can a virgin give birth yet remain a virgin?

To the bolded-red: Artificial insemination...

nothing indeed is its own infinity. But nothing cannot beget, but One can

but thats why the number 10 is special. Its as if 1 grabbed 0 and said, you shall be something!

We are living in a world of illusion

To the bolded-red: you are greater than nothing, yet you are finite.

 

[MMS]

This is something I've contemplated and meditated on at various points in my life to good effect. No matter what circumstances is going on, resting in "I am whole now. I have everything I need" no matter if life kinda kicking my ass at the moment I have often found shyt will flow quickly back in my favor. Like always though, you forget, you slip out of the kingdom again lol.

This is why I linked Unas specifically because he was one of the earliest pharoahs to deviate from their original beliefs, consider how he views words and understanding in the Cannibal hymn. He seeks to devour it. His function now becomes a devourer even though his action doesnt literally have to do with physical food.

It goes back to the purpose of knowledge and wisdom. There are people who live and die without most of the worlds wisdom, and noone bats an eye. There is no debate about could haves and maybes

this is the trap of knowledge, its a pit in itself, such that once you've tasted it you forget where it came from and that where it came from is indeed endless. So endless that simple concepts can spawn more endlessness

so the solution to me is to decide that some knowledge is not worth knowing, but the knowledge of God specifically the living God is all we need. The simplest answer is as youve said in the other thread:

I think everyone probably has an example or experience where you "gave up" or "surrendered" to a problem and just faced it and it just disappeared/evaporated almost. You were worried for nothing.

nothing doesnt exist right?

Science doesn't prove anything so I doubt it leads anyone to G-d, and much less can prove or disprove G-d.

You'd need a more objective way to prove G-d which is mathematics. Kurt Godel's proof is a start but some philosophers have problems with a few of his premises (not that they've proven the premises to be unsound but still...). I am still learning about spirituality


To the bolded-red: Artificial insemination...



To the bolded-red: you are greater than nothing, yet you are finite.

you dont know if thats true or not. If you zoomed in on your body, you might find that it goes forever. So to whatever is at the smallest end of the spectrum would look at you as some sort of ephemeral collossus.

regarding "artificial insemination"

you have to re-read the gospels deeper, to begin to understand the incarnation. Jesus was born. The very idea of God being born, whether in a book or from a womb is a deeper paradox than leads on.

Egypts understanding is the key to understanding this phenomena. In egyptian myth it is prophecied that "Nehebkau" would take over for Atum after a certain period. This Nehebkau represents the divine tongue, the sentient word of Horus that would eventually rule in pharoahs stead. Whether that has happened is subject for debate and up for interpretation....
Nehebkau - Wikipedia

Hu (authoritative speech) was believed to take on a life of its own, it represented the first word of Atum who was reported to be self generated upon speaking it. Which then gave rise to the ennead forming a pattern. This same idealogy is found in the christian understanding of the holy spirit and the virgin mary. The meaning of each character's names in both the Old and New testament is significant to understanding it (see Renenutet - Wikipedia )

Mnw and Jmnw (Amun) literally represent the spirit of "establishing" which ironically is the same as Thetis in greek mythology. As most of us know when we pray and say "Amen" we are saying "so be it" or "let it be so". Consider how many times mankind has said to God "so be it"?

Virgin birth of Jesus - Wikipedia

 

[the cac mamba]

Based on what you just said you are the type of person to go to the Louvre, walk up to the Mona Lisa and yell at it till you see Da Vinci.

The Creator is in the creation but the Creator is NOT made up out of the creation.

why do i have to explain where the universe came from, but you dont have to explain where god came from

 

[wastedmermaid]

My issues is not in believing that there can be a being out there greater than man. But, gods word the Bible has so many gaping holes in it and just the history of most man made religion as I get older just put me off from it all together

 

[Tair]

This is why I linked Unas specifically because he was one of the earliest pharoahs to deviate from their original beliefs, consider how he views words and understanding in the Cannibal hymn. He seeks to devour it. His function now becomes a devourer even though his action doesnt literally have to do with physical food.

It goes back to the purpose of knowledge and wisdom. There are people who live and die without most of the worlds wisdom, and noone bats an eye. There is no debate about could haves and maybes

this is the trap of knowledge, its a pit in itself, such that once you've tasted it you forget where it came from and that where it came from is indeed endless. So endless that simple concepts can spawn more endlessness

so the solution to me is to decide that some knowledge is not worth knowing, but the knowledge of God specifically the living God is all we need. The simplest answer is as youve said in the other thread:



nothing doesnt exist right?




you dont know if thats true or not. If you zoomed in on your body, you might find that it goes forever. So to whatever is at the smallest end of the spectrum would look at you as some sort of ephemeral collossus.

regarding "artificial insemination"

you have to re-read the gospels deeper, to begin to understand the incarnation. Jesus was born. The very idea of God being born, whether in a book or from a womb is a deeper paradox than leads on.

Egypts understanding is the key to understanding this phenomena. In egyptian myth it is prophecied that "Nehebkau" would take over for Atum after a certain period. This Nehebkau represents the divine tongue, the sentient word of Horus that would eventually rule in pharoahs stead. Whether that has happened is subject for debate and up for interpretation....
Nehebkau - Wikipedia

Hu the authoritative speech of pharaoh was believed to take on a life of its own, it represented the tongue of Min (Horus) who was considered the "bull" of his mother. This same idealogy is found in the christian understanding of the holy spirit and the virgin mary. The meaning of each character's names in both the Old and New testament is significant to understanding it (which is a carryover from Egypt - see Renenutet - Wikipedia )

Mnw and Jmnw (Amun) literally represent the spirit of "establishing" which ironically is the same as Thetis in greek mythology

Virgin birth of Jesus - Wikipedia

If I zoomed into my body I'd probably find many infinities, but I do know those infinities converge to me. Just as I know all of our countable numbers say 1, 2, 3.... also have infinities but the infinite sum of - for example - 1 (that is 1 + (1/2) + (1/3) + (1/4) and so on) converges to 2, thus making the infinite total finite.

-----

To the rest, 'Hu' is the authoritative speech of Pharaoh? I don't know much about Egypt, so I cannot say much regarding it.

I do find "Hu" to be interesting, does it relate in some way to the names Yahuah and Yahusha? If it does, could you explain more?

 

[MMS]

If I zoomed into my body I'd probably find many infinities, but I do know those infinities converge to me. Just as I know all of our countable numbers say 1, 2, 3.... also have infinities but the infinite sum of - for example - 1 (that is 1 + (1/2) + (1/3) + (1/4) and so on) converges to 2, thus making the infinite total finite.

-----

To the rest, 'Hu' is the authoritative speech of Pharaoh? I don't know much about Egypt, so I cannot say much regarding it.

I do find "Hu" to be interesting, does it relate in some way to the names Yahuah and Yahusha? If it does, could you explain more?

Iahw (pronounced Ya-khu) is just "Spirit of Authoritative Speech" or "Moon of Authoritative Speech"

Heh means infinity or enumerable forms

as I said in the curse of isaiah thread, I believe it reads: IAH HU HEH

Moons Authoritative Speech of Eternity or Divine Authoritative Speech of Eternity

if you were looking at it from Egypt that is. The deity Iwnt (Anat) represented the Moon.

That said...the secret to the divide between Lunar and Solar theology has to do with the priests who followed them.

Interestingly if you substitute Saa (Sia), It becomes Iahw-saas (divine speech of perception)

if you add a feminine ending (et)...
Iusaaset - Wikipedia

In egypt they believed all things divine came in Male Female pairs or consorts. Underneath the names in egypt they really only have 3 deities.

 

[Khadafi1982]

If you study the origins of the universe you will eventually reach the time before the big bang where they was nothingness. It is logically impossible for something ti come from nothing so there had to be a first mover that brougut the first particles into existence.

If you study evolutionn, you will eventually reach the complexity of molecular biology and the theory that it is driven by natural genetic engineering of a cellular intelligence. Where does this intelligence come from?

How did the first life spring into being from the inanimate material of the universe?

People delude themselves thinking that human observation of the universe can ever replace their creator.

I believe in God but saying that "It is logically impossible for something ti come from nothing", then I will ask you if you can imagine a 4,5 or 6 dimension shape? Your brain structure limits your comprehension of >3 dimensions. If you rejects that something cannot come out of nothing, then how did God came into existence. Either he was always there or arose out of nothing, if the second possibility is true (we will never know) then you must accept that life could arise from nothing over deep time.

 

[MMS]

@Tair @Marks

I have a theory regarding this Solar/Lunar divide that I believe can be explained by the character in the Bible "Zipporah" or Kushyte Woman

I theorize that the Kings of Egypt viewed their wives and subsequently their daughters (specifically the females) as the carriers of Pharaohs written word after his passing. Each pharoah appears to have a distinctly black wife.

I think this wife is actually symbolic at the least and a literal nubian woman at the other end of the spectrum. The daughter of Pharaoh represented the "House" that emerged from him, whereas his son represented the new bull or calf that would replace him

this is lost to history to me but I cant help but notice the care taken with the religious titles held by Pharoahs wife/daughter. They literally believed they were living deities entrusted with the kingdom so the lengths they went to make this seem so is hard to really put in words.

So the pharoah would represent Venus (Sopdu), and his mother and/or wife would represent Sirius, Atum-Re (Khnum) the Sun, and Daughter the Moon...and Osiris (the previous pharoah) as the constellation Orion thats just my take. I could be wrong

now personally I dont believe in all that, I think these are the lengths the egyptians went to trying to prove their divinity

This is why I still tend to side with Jewish understanding of God as a being/entity that transcends the created world. While clearly the sky and the constellations and sun/moon have affected religion, the one truth that cant be debated is the power is in the hand of the priests who make those connections in the first place (IE like chinese zodiacs etc)

@Koichos would probably understand specific old testament scripture that speaks of the ills of these mistakes.

 

[Mr. Jack Napier]

I believe in God. And I also believe & trust in science.

Faith/religious threads on here always get nasty on here. Peace.

 

[MMS]

I believe in God. And I also believe & trust in science.

Faith/religious threads on here always get nasty on here. Peace.

@Marks

"Green Lightsaberfish"


We are living in a world of illusion

Spoiler

Hatmehit - Wikipedia

The Little Known Biblical Curse of Egypt by Isaiah

Dedi - Wikipedia

Khufu becomes indignant: “But it's when the canal-of-two-Mugilidae[13] is cut off!? I would even work with my very own hands to enter them! And then I will visit that temple of Ra, lord of Sachebu.”[3] And Djedi says: “Then I will make the waters at the fordable spots of the canal-of-two-Mugilidae become four cubits in height for you.”

"So be it"

 

[Tair]

Iahw (pronounced Ya-khu) is just "Spirit of Authoritative Speech" or "Moon of Authoritative Speech"

Heh means infinity or enumerable forms

as I said in the curse of isaiah thread, I believe it reads: IAH HU HEH

Moons Authoritative Speech of Eternity or Divine Authoritative Speech of Eternity

if you were looking at it from Egypt that is. The deity Iwnt (Anat) represented the Moon.

That said...the secret to the divide between Lunar and Solar theology has to do with the priests who followed them.

Interestingly if you substitute Saa (Sia), It becomes Iahw-saas (divine speech of perception)

if you add a feminine ending (et)...
Iusaaset - Wikipedia

In egypt they believed all things divine came in Male Female pairs or consorts. Underneath the names in egypt they really only have 3 deities.

Father = G-d/Yahuah
Son = Yahusha
Bride/feminine = the Church = followers of Yahusha

what do you think?

 

[MMS]

Father = G-d/Yahuah
Son = Yahusha
Bride/feminine = the Church = followers of Yahusha

what do you think?

Just because egypt had its beliefs doesnt mean I have the same ones. Furthermore I dont even speak egyptian nor can i read their hieroglyphs. Im going purely off wikipedia

I'm personally an orthodox christian. I believe in the father the son and the holy spirit in an undivided trinity. The church is the body.
We are living in a world of illusion