Russia's Invasion of Ukraine (Official Thread)

[Voice of Reason]

GOddamn shyt is insane.

Spoiler that

 

[Voice of Reason]

This is turning into a death porn thread.


I know war is ugly but come on.

 

[☑︎#VoteDemocrat]

It took her one week

 

[Voice of Reason]

I worry about backlash from this Azov situation on par with the Taliban if not handled delicately. I know we're in the middle of something, but...

Yep I'm sure that white supremacist will use this opportunity to train up.

 

[Hood Critic]

Biden getting Russia out the paint. I can only imagine what Russia did in 2016 and continued to do that the public won't know.

Putin and Russia are vulnerable, have to strike when you have the opportunity. They'll never be able to get europe, global corporations and the vast majority of the rest of the world on the same page to rally against Russia again, they're taking advantage of that.

This is one of the few things I agree with Nap on, we as a country have to make up our minds on whether we want to continue to be at the top of the food chain or whether we want to acquiesce to moral outrage.

 

[Starski]

Not sure if material as it’s not like they would have been given it anyway

 

[the next guy]

Two schools of thought,

The economic impact and the impact on the climate. Either way we are looking at hard decisions.

Russia isn't a can we can kick down the road anymore. If people aren't seeing that now, their children will see it later.

I don't know what the options are. Regime Change? It took damn near 15 years for Iraq to stabilize. Serbia only now has a semi decent government (Keep an eye on Vucic)

Get putin out of the paints sure, but how do we prevent this for next time? Only unless all their nukes are destroyed.

people may lose interest in war but i assure you that war has not lost interest in people...

Sad but true.

 

[the next guy]

Not sure if material as it’s not like they would have been given it anyway

Ok time for Moscow to pull out.

What are we fighting for.

 

[MoneyTron]

Punish a dictator at the expense of your own citizens? American citizens have suffered enough. 2 years of covid, inflation, trash housing market, etc.

You really think average voters gonna say "Yeah I'm going to have to pay more but Putin must be stopped". Only those really invested in global politics might care enough. Most people don't give a damn about global politics. They care more about their self-interest.

Its easy for a US Senator to say something that dumb because he's rich. Average Americans are trying to make the most of a bad situation already.

Signal to the world and autocratic petrostates you’ll forgive any and everything for short-term gas prices brehs.

In the long term, its a much greater expense to have Russia continue to run roughshod through Europe with little to no consequence. Everyone went soft on Russia in 2014 and it was a mistake. Yeah, the average voter might not understand the nuances of the situation. I don’t should dictate your entire foreign agenda.

 

[Hood Critic]

Punish a dictator at the expense of your own citizens? American citizens have suffered enough. 2 years of covid, inflation, trash housing market, etc.

You really think average voters gonna say "Yeah I'm going to have to pay more but Putin must be stopped". Only those really invested in global politics might care enough. Most people don't give a damn about global politics. They care more about their self-interest.

Its easy for a US Senator to say something that dumb because he's rich. Average Americans are trying to make the most of a bad situation already.

The world is being punished not just the US and realistically, we're in a better position than a lot of other countries to weather the upcoming storm. The problem here is that this is the only effective way to punish said dictator when his only 2 weak points are his personal wealth and well being. You can't reasonably eliminate him at this point without starting a disastrous chain reaction, so you're left with his other weakness, his personal wealth.

Russians have been isolated and sanctioned for years, so the oligarchs are experts in shielding and diversifying assets to maintain their wealth. Thats why its not enough to seize property such as houses and boats because they only own those as assets to liquidate if necessary and they're diversified across all of the western economies that typically sanction them. So you have to go to the source of the wealth, energy.

 

[levitate]

China has already claimed HK without a peep from the West...

Where are you getting this rhetoric ?

What would the west “peep” about? HK is rightfully China’s property.

 

[CBalla]

Putin and Russia are vulnerable, have to strike when you have the opportunity. They'll never be able to get europe, global corporations and the vast majority of the rest of the world on the same page to rally against Russia again, they're taking advantage of that.

This is one of the few things I agree with Nap on, we as a country have to make up our minds on whether we want to continue to be at the top of the food chain or whether we want to acquiesce to moral outrage.

i agree as well, this will hurt is in the short run but put us way ahead of russia and to a lesser degree china in the long run

 

[Hood Critic]

Not sure if material as it’s not like they would have been given it anyway

I'd like to see confirmation of this.

It's not too farfetched to consider as a starting point for negotiations considering the assistance Ukraine has received over the last couple of weeks, I'm sure they have western assurances of future aid. They'll leverage those assurances in place of NATO membership. They'll bolster their military to offset the lack of personnel they miss out on by not being a NATO member.

 

[Leasy]

Ok time for Moscow to pull out.

What are we fighting for.

Putin want that president dead and his puppet back in power.

 

[GnauzBookOfRhymes]

What would you advocate we/they do about it?

Not dodging and this isn't meant at you personally but I hate questions like this where someone is asked how to address a situation that has exploded, when it has only reached this level bc the shyt those people have been advocating for years was ignored.

People have been talking about how the US/EU posture towards mollifying the Russians was fundamentally weakening the US/EU. Unfortunately we're now at the point that our options are severely limited.

I would continue going after property/assets here in the US even remotely connected to oligarchs. Real estate, stakes in large companies, manufacturing facilities owned by ppl like Deripaska. Then go one level beneath. For every oligarch with billions, there are countless other russians connected to their security establishment with assets that can be targeted. You have to make things uncomfortable for the foot soldiers as well, not just the guys at the top. There is an anchor baby industry here in the US - Russians coming here just to have babies. Most of these are people who could easily be connected to sanctioned companies/organizations. Eventually it will be discontent among this group that will potentially lead to putin being shoved aside.

Then you have to continue going after the organizations/institutions that russians use to exert influence. Anyplace that the Wagner Group is operating, the US should be there killing them. The US/EU should announce immediately its intention to no longer rely on Russian rockets etc for space travel. Also offer sweden, finland immediate NATO entry if they agree.