Russia's Invasion of Ukraine (Official Thread)

[GhostoftheMan]

so I'm beginning to think that prig wasn't expecting to get to moscow so quickly and was expecting more push back; him calling his people from africa seemed to be him realizing he'd need more to take on russia or he enacted his plan too soon. I think with enough bloodshed, he ends up getting what he wants because the threat of what he would do once he got to moscow, which i assume would lead to more money in his pockets. he would be causing problems but not directly to moscow but once he got there so quickly, he probably was a bit in over his head.

 

[Neo. The Only. The One.]

Did he though?

American had a bunch of rebellions early on and they didn’t work. You usually need the military’s support to overthrow. Putin wasn’t his direct target. He was trying to oust some military ministers. Which is actually a lot harder in terms of not toppling a government fully.

They were getting soldiers to lay down arms and let them go and avoiding other bases but they didn’t join in. So we don’t really know what would happen when they actually got resistance. He had no plan of act to actually go into Moscow and Putin and his cronies probably weren’t even there.

You're right, they weren't there. But if Prigozhin had gone into Moscow, he could have taken the Kremlin and effectively installed himself as the new leader or installed someone else.

Putin and his side would have declared it illegitimate, but he would have been declaring it somewhere other than the official seat of the government.

The official seat of the government would have been taken by the rebellion. And then that's when the civil war would have popped off. And I believe in that situation, a lot of people join on Prigozhin's side. How many? We will never know.

 

[ill]

He planned all this himself and was OK with losing a few attack helicopters and pilots in the process?

Just wait until you find out that Putin allowed 300 school children to get slaughtered so he could launch his Chechen war.

A few helicopters?

 

[Json]

You're right, they weren't there. But if Prigozhin had gone into Moscow, he could have taken the Kremlin and effectively installed himself as the new leader or installed someone else.

Putin and his side would have declared it illegitimate, but he would have been declaring it somewhere other than the official seat of the government.

The official seat of the government would have been taken by the rebellion. And then that's when the civil war would have popped off. And I believe in that situation, a lot of people join on Prigozhin's side. How many? We will never know.

There’s nothing to suggest he wasn’t a Putin loyalist. Maybe I’m wrong but he’s consistently attacked the MOD for its handling of the war and not Putin.

Civil Wars are usually started by people who either want out of the ruling government’s control or install themselves. Neither fits what this dude was talking about. He still wants to fight in Ukraine. He didn’t say anything is wrong with the country. He just hated a handful of people.


I don’t think he wanted anyone else so marching into Moscow would effectively neuter Putin against his wishes. Holding that base at Rostov hostage would have effectively destroyed Russia’s war and could have gotten him what he wanted.


My assumption is once he realized Putin wasn’t going to hand over his MOD, he no longer had the stomach to actually attack Putin.

 

[[Something Cool]]

How does Ukraine not just go “fukk it” and send “Partisans” to cross the lines over into Russia now? There’s nobody back there. Escalation? Sure. But you’re fighting for your life anyway. This is too much of a shyt show.

 

[987654321]

How does Ukraine not just go “fukk it” and send “Partisans” to cross the lines over into Russia now? There’s nobody back there. Escalation? Sure. But you’re fighting for your life anyway. This is too much of a shyt show.

They’ve been doing it the entire time. It’s easier for them to pass for Russians than it is for Russians to pass as Ukrainians. They’ve been crossing the border, burning, and blowing up shyt since it started. The Russian units that are friendly to Ukraine just did a few cross border raids around Belogrod last month.

 

[[Something Cool]]

They’ve been doing it the entire time. It’s easier for them to pass for Russians than it is for Russians to pass as Ukrainians. They’ve been crossing the border, burning, and blowing up shyt since it started. The Russian units that are friendly to Ukraine just did a few cross border raids around Belogrod last month.

Fair. It seems like Russia has been in an “Emperor has no clothes” moment - how long can you sustain that?

 

[Orbital-Fetus]

Fair. It seems like Russia has been in an “Emperor has no clothes” moment - how long can you sustain that?

They're gonna try to walk it off taking continuous L's the entire time. We are all familiar with the phrase "Death by a thousand cuts". The thing is that Russia is big enough to survive broadsword strikes to the chest. Yesterday was def a broadsword strike to the chest and Russia felt it felt it. How many more of these sized L's can Russia take? We gonna find out.

 

[[Something Cool]]

They're gonna try to walk it off taking continuous L's the entire time. We are all familiar with the phrase "Death by a thousand cuts". The thing is that Russia is big enough to survive broadsword strikes to the chest. Yesterday was def a broadsword strike to the chest and Russia felt it felt it. How many more of these sized L's can Russia take? We gonna find out.

Right. Their bullshyt got other people involved. It’s time to step away.

Putin’s existential crisis doesn’t need to affect countless lives. He, and whatever system he is propping up, needs to go.

 

[Neo. The Only. The One.]

There’s nothing to suggest he wasn’t a Putin loyalist. Maybe I’m wrong but he’s consistently attacked the MOD for its handling of the war and not Putin.

Civil Wars are usually started by people who either want out of the ruling government’s control or install themselves. Neither fits what this dude was talking about. He still wants to fight in Ukraine. He didn’t say anything is wrong with the country. He just hated a handful of people.


I don’t think he wanted anyone else so marching into Moscow would effectively neuter Putin against his wishes. Holding that base at Rostov hostage would have effectively destroyed Russia’s war and could have gotten him what he wanted.


My assumption is once he realized Putin wasn’t going to hand over his MOD, he no longer had the stomach to actually attack Putin.

I agree. I was merely speculating on what would have happened had Prigozhin really wanted to get Putin out of the paint, and had continued his advance to Moscow.

He obviously didn't really want to go against Putin, which is why he stopped. The damage to Putin has been done though. This is probably the worst thing that could have happened to his presidency aside from an actual real coup or being assassinated.

I truly believe this spells the beginning of the end for him.

 

[Json]

Fair. It seems like Russia has been in an “Emperor has no clothes” moment - how long can you sustain that?

He’s still a dictator.

Iran’s government has taken L for 30 years but can’t get them out the paint.

Dictatorships usually fall because of succession problems.

 

[Orbital-Fetus]

Dictatorships usually fall because of succession problems.

Ehhh.... I dunno aboot that.

 

[[Something Cool]]

He’s still a dictator.

Iran’s government has taken L for 30 years but can’t get them out the paint.

Dictatorships usually fall because of succession problems.

Agreed. It’s just we know so little about how Russia is actually run, so their statements for public consumption don’t make any sense. You have to take take notice of that.

I’d hope that those who need to know in our intelligence apparatus know more.

Iran being a theocracy has a different element to it, but I get your point.

 

[Neo. The Only. The One.]

He’s still a dictator.

Iran’s government has taken L for 30 years but can’t get them out the paint.

Dictatorships usually fall because of succession problems.

He's a dictator compared to America but Russia does have an existing somewhat democratic system. Putin just doesn't follow it. Putin isn't a dictator in the way that Bashar Al Assad of Syria is or King Salman of Saudi Arabia.

Those dictatorships follow the father to son succession. Or in Saudi Arabia's case, brother to brother. Salman's successor MBS will be the first time the crown has passed to a son since the original King Ibn Saud passed it to his son.

My point being, once Putin is dead, nobody is expecting his children to take over.

 

[987654321]

Agreed. It’s just we know so little about how Russia is actually run, so their statements for public consumption don’t make any sense. You have to take take notice of that.

I’d hope that those who need to know in our intelligence apparatus know more.

Iran being a theocracy has a different element to it, but I get your point.

It’s essentially a mob state blended with old mongol and Roman culture. There isn’t too much to figure out, they pretty much show us who they are.

Most of what they say in public is meant for their own people. They are just as stupid as we think they are.

People have just been listening to them, and watching the facade; that made us overestimate them in the past.