Refuting the myth that Black American music/culture is "Europeanized".

[Bawon Samedi]

Bump...

 

[prime]

best thread on the coli hands down

 

[IllmaticDelta]

List Of Surviving Creole Languages Spoken By African-americans Today

Louisiana creole = French + Native American + African(Bambara, Wolof, Fon)
http://www.ethnologue.com/show_language.asp?code=lou

Gullah/Geechee = English + African(Mandinka, Wolof, Bambara, Fula, Mende, Vai, Akan, Ewe, Yoruba, Igbo, Hausa, Kongo, Umbundu, Kimbundu)
http://www.ethnologue.com/show_language.asp?code=gul

Afro-Seminole = Similar to Gullah, but less English, and no Mende influence.
http://www.ethnologue.com/show_language.asp?code=afs

And one of the many now extinct unique AA languages.

Negro/Jersey Dutch
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jersey_Dutch

This is thanks to a poster named "Supper" from Nairaland.

Repost of mine from another thread..

Are Black Americans the only blacks in the Americas questioned about not having "culture" ? Like u would never hear someone tell a Black Brazilian, Cuban, Jamaican, Trini, Black Mexican, etc that they have no culture cause of xyz.

Double standards and haters. It's funny how some will try to throw shade at AAVE (Black Dialect aka Ebonics) without understanding it's roots and not realizing that Creole/Pidgins/AAVE all came about the same way. For example...



Misconceptions About “Black Dialect”


I would like to shed some light on black dialect, which some individuals now call “Ebonics,” and how such came to be. It kinda irks me that people keep referring to it as being “made up” or some sort of street slang. They think it’s the same thing that you might hear from rappers which really isn’t the case. Black Dialect or Ebonics originated in the American south from slaves and eventually spread out when blacks began to leave the South. In fact, if you want to see or hear it in it’s true form just go find some old slave narratives or even old Blues lyrics. Rappers actually rap in a a combination of “Black Dialect” and street slang. Real black dialect has no slang. Black dialect is really Southern White American English with Africanisms. It formed the same way West African pidgins, Jamaican Patois and Creoles formed. Famous African American writers like Langston Hughes, Zora Neale Hurston and Paul Dunbar wrote many of their works in this dialect.

What people call "Ebonics" today used to be called "Black Dialect" or "Black English". A quick history comparing "Black Dialect or Ebonics" "Gullah" and West African Pidgins


Southern American English

Southern American English is a group of dialects of the English language spoken throughout the Southern region of the United States, from Virginia and central Kentucky to the Gulf Coast, and from the Atlantic coast to central Texas. Southern American English can be divided into different sub-dialects (see American English), with speech differing between regions. African American Vernacular English (AAVE) shares similarities with Southern dialect, unsurprising given African Americans' strong historical ties to the region.

The Southern American English dialects are often stigmatized (as are other American English dialects such as New York-New Jersey English). Therefore, speakers may code-switch or may eliminate more distinctive features from their personal idiolect in favor of "neutral-sounding" English (General American), though this involves more changes in phonetics than vocabulary. Well-known speakers of Southern dialect include United States Presidents Jimmy Carter, Bill Clinton and George W. Bush along with playwright Tennessee Williams and singer Elvis Presley.

The Gullah Creole and "black dialect" are related. The main difference is that "Black Dialect" is closer to Standard English while Gullah has more pure African influence. One can say that "Black Dialect" is watered down Gullah. Yall may not know this but an AfroAmerican Gullah speaker and a Jamaican Patois speaker can somewhat understand each other but speakers of "Black Dialect" can't understand either one. An article take from the Jamaican-Gleaner website...


God speaks Gullah

http://www.jamaica-gleaner.com/gleaner/20060128/mind/mind1.html

A NEW translation of the New Testament designed for persons who speak Gullah was unveiled last November. This translation bears strong resemblance to Jamaican Patois.

Gullah is the language that gave the world the song Kumbaya and words such as 'yam' and 'nanny'. It is spoken by about 250,000 African-Americans who inhabit the coastal areas between South Carolina and Florida.

The Gullah language according to www.wikipedia.com "is an English-based Creole, strongly influenced by West and Central African languages such as Vai, Mende, Twi, Ewe, Hausa, Yoruba, Igbo, and Kikongo.

"It strongly resembles the Krio language of Sierra Leone, a major West African English-based Creole. Some African-derived words attributed to Gullah are: cootuh (turtle), oonuh (pronoun 'you'), nyam (to eat), and buckruh (white man)".

The language originated in the slave trade that brought mainly West Africans to the Sea Islands off South Carolina. The slave traders, in an effort to thwart uprisings and escapees mixed slaves who spoke different languages. From this hybrid came Gullah. Some linguists believe that 10,000 African-Americans speak nothing but Gullah.

Gullah, also called Geechee, was developed as a way for slaves to communicate with one another without white slave owners knowing what was being said. After the American Civil War, the former slaves were able to retain their culture and language because many remained isolated on coastal islands.

Because the islands were isolated, Gullah never evolved into standard English.

Gullah many concur bears some resemblance to Ebonics, the modern African-American vernacular. But scholars insist it is a distinct language with its own grammar and vocabulary.

Bible translator Pat Sharpe and her husband, Claude, arrived in the Sea Islands all set to retire in the late 1970s. The couple decided to try a translation of the Bible into Gullah, beginning a process that would take nearly 30 years.

By the time the Sharpes had arrived, Gullah speakers had learned to be ashamed of their language. Some locals tried to persuade the Sharpes to drop the project. The couple refused to give up. They noted that Gullah had contributed to the English language such words as 'tote' (to carry), 'chigger' (flea) and 'biddy' (chicken). Other linguists joined the translation team as the project evolved.

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Jamaican website REGGAEmovement.com on Patois

http://debate.uvm.edu/dreadlibrary/sullivan.html

Jamaican Patois, otherwise known as Patwa, Afro. Jamaican, just plain Jamaican or, Creole, is a language that has been until quite recently referred to as "ungrammatical English." (Adams, 199 1, p . I 1)

Creole languages are actually not unique to Jamaica, they are found on every continent although their speakers often do not realize what they are. The rest of the terms refer strictly to Jamaican Creole. Creoles are languages that usually form as the result of some human upheaval which makes it impossible for people to use their own languages to communicate. What people often refer to as the 'bad' or 'broken-English' of Jamaica are actually local Creoles that usually come about through a situation of partial language learning (Sebba 1, 1996, p.50-1.)

The technical definition of the term Creole means-, a language which comes into being through contact between two or more languages. The most important part about this definition is that a new language comes about which was not there before, yet it has some characteristics of the original language(s) and also has some characteristics of its own. The Creole of Jamaica and the Caribbean is referred to as an 'English-lexicon' and this language came about when African slaves were forced into a situation where English, or at least a very reduced form of English, was the only common means of communication. The slave traders and owners spoke English while the slaves spoke a variety of African languages and the slaves had to assimilate by learning English which explains why much of the vocabulary is English in origin. Although there is much English vocabulary, many words were also adopted from African languages when no equivalent English word could be found such as, words for people, things, plants, animals, activities, and especially religious words (Sebba 1, 1996, 50-1.) The name Jamaica itself was derived from the Arawak word Xaymaca meaning "Island of springs," but no other known trace(s) of the Arawak, the indigenous inhabitants of Jamaica, exist today (Pryce, 1997, p-238.)

Despite all the debate surrounding Patois, the international prestige of Standard English which derives from political and economic factors, has made people everywhere around the world obtain the major life goal of speaking it; even in countries where English has never traditionally been spoken people are acquiring this goal. As stated before, in Jamaica, the overwhelming feeling of prestige surrounding English causes people who speak Creole to be regarded as socially and linguistically inferior. This causes Creole languages to be considered unacceptable for use for any official or formal purpose, including education, hence the previously mentioned problem of young Creole speaking children getting frustrated and discouraged by trying to read and write in "Standard" English, which to them is basically a foreign language (Sebba 1, 1996, p.52.) We have even seen some of this debate on educational uses of language occur in the U.S. on the issue of Ebonics. Ebonics has been referred to as "Black English" and it is the language of many inner cities and until now has been thought of as slang'. Ebonics and Jamaican Patios are similar in that they both have the same roots and parts of the language came out as a result of people being taken from Africa for slavery (citation #3, WWW.) Also, the primary similarity in the debate on Ebonics and Jamaican Patios is the fact that Standard English is the language that must be mastered to conduct most businesses and to be successful in any traditional occupation (Pryce, 1997, p.241.)

.....and for the record, "Ebonics" is not slang. Basically, Black Dialect/AAVE/Ebonics is decreolized, Pidgin/Creole and that is closer to standard English

Do You Speak American . Sea to Shining Sea . American Varieties . AAVE . Creole | PBS

Origins: Dialect or Creole?

There are two main hypotheses about the origin of African American Vernacular English or AAVE. The Dialectologist Hypothesis, a prevailing view in the 1940s, concentrates on the English origins of AAVE, to the exclusion of African influence.

The Creole Hypothesis, on the other hand, maintains that modern AAVE is the result of a creole derived from English and various West African Languages. (A creole is a language derived from other languages that becomes the primary language of the people who speak it.) Slaves who spoke many different West African languages were often thrown together during their passage to the New World. To be able to communicate in some fashion they developed a pidgin* by applying English and some West African vocabulary to the familiar grammar rules of their native tongue. This pidgin was passed onto future generations. As it became the primary language of its speakers, it was classified as a creole. Over the years AAVE has gone through the process of decreolization - a change in the creole that makes it more like the standard language of an area.

*A pidgin is language composed of two or more languages created for the purpose of communication, usually around trade centers, between people who do not speak a common language. It is never a person's primary language.

http://www.pbs.org/speak/seatosea/americanvarieties/AAVE/creole/#




Decreolization=steps closer to standard English=why many think it's just broken English w/o any Africanisms=why speakers of it can't understand Jamaican Patois and Gullah speakers even though they came about the same way

 

[IllmaticDelta]

cont..

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By the way, the Carib equivalent to what "Ebonics" or "Black Dialect" (decreolized Creole) are to Gullah (pure Creole) is what they call Caribbean English. It's closer to standard English than the purer Carib Creoles/Patois

Caribbean English

Caribbean English is a broad term for the dialects of the English language spoken in the Caribbean, most countries on the Caribbean coast of Central America, and Guyana. Caribbean English is influenced by the English-based Creole varieties spoken in the region, but they are not the same. In the Caribbean, there is a great deal of variation in the way English is spoken. Scholars generally agree that although the dialects themselves vary significantly in each of these countries, they all have roots in 17th-century English and African languages.

Caribbean English is a broad term for the dialects of the English language spoken in the Caribbean, most countries on the Caribbean coast of Central America, and Guyana. Caribbean English is influenced by the English-based Creole varieties spoken in the region, but they are not the same. In the Caribbean, there is a great deal of variation in the way English is spoken. Scholars generally agree that although the dialects themselves vary significantly in each of these countries, they all have roots in 17th-century English and African languages.

Standard English - Where is that boy? (pronounced /hwɛəɹ ɪz ðæt bɔɪ/)

* Barbados - 'Wherr dat boi?' ([hwer ɪz dæt bɔɪ]) (Spoken very quickly, is choppy, rhotic, and contains glottal stops; The most distinct accent)

* Jamaica, and Antigua and Barbuda- 'Whierr iz daht bwoy?' ([hweɪr ɪz dɑt bʷɔɪ]) (Distinctive, sporadic rhoticity; Irish and Scottish influence)

* Trinidad and Bahamas - 'Wey iz dat boy?' ([weɪ ɪz dæt bɔɪ]) (Very similar to the accents of south western England and Wales; Have no rhoticity)

* Guyana, Tobago, St. Vincent - 'Weyr iz daht bai?' ([weɪɹ ɪz dɑt baɪ]) (Many variations depending of Afro- or Indo- descent, and compentency in standard English; Sporadic rhoticity )

* Belize, Panama, Nicaragua, The Bay Islands, Limón, and the Virgin Islands - 'Wehr iz daht booy?' ([weɹ ɪz dɑt buɪ]) (Distinct, sporadic rhoticity, pronunciation becomes quite different from "Creole" pronunciation.)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caribbean_English


Go find some old slave narratives from the American South or the dialect infused poetry of Paul Dunbar based on Southern Black dialect and you'll see and read stuff just like that.

 

[The Odum of Ala Igbo]

Sad about this thread stopping

 

[cole phelps]

can you make a thread on 50s rock and roll?? your threads are really informative

 

[IllmaticDelta]

can you make a thread on 50s rock and roll?? your threads are really informative

What about it tough? I saw your thread

http://www.thecoli.com/threads/blac...ure-of-the-1950s.214989/page-12#post-14828021

I posted some stuff in there

 

[IllmaticDelta]

What the Slaves Ate: Recollections of African American Foods and Foodways from the Slave Narratives

Carefully documenting African American slave foods, this book reveals that slaves actively developed their own foodways-their customs involving family and food. The authors connect African foods and food preparation to the development during slavery of Southern cuisines having African influences, including Cajun, Creole, and what later became known as soul food, drawing on the recollections of ex-slaves recorded by Works Progress Administration interviewers. Valuable for its fascinating look into the very core of slave life, this book makes a unique contribution to our knowledge of slave culture and of the complex power relations encoded in both owners' manipulation of food as a method of slave control and slaves' efforts to evade and undermine that control.

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I originally posted this in the thread:

Do people still eat chitlins?

http://www.thecoli.com/threads/do-people-still-eat-chitlins.321083/

 

[Bawon Samedi]

Bump so people don't take that bait thread...

 

[IllmaticDelta]

time stamped



is the same concept you get in boogie woogie with the repeated riffing

 

[The Odum of Ala Igbo]

Reviving this thread.
@IllmaticDelta - When will you write an full encompassing book about the African root of Afro-American cultural manifestations?

 

[IllmaticDelta]

Reviving this thread.
@IllmaticDelta - When will you write an full encompassing book about the African root of Afro-American cultural manifestations?

 

[The Odum of Ala Igbo]

You have source material, you have something to say

 

[Yehuda]

Personally I never understood that logic. Knowing how Black people in America have been excluded from the white society since the 17th Century, can you really say their culture is "europeanized"?

 

[IllmaticDelta]

Personally I never understood that logic. Knowing how Black people in America have been excluded from the white society since the 17th Century, can you really say their culture is "europeanized"?

Every black ethnic group born in the new world has a level of Europeanization. I mean a even a people/nation such as Haiti who people incorrectly stereotype as "pure west african culture in the new world" correctly identify their culture as "Creole" which is a blend of africa and europe, which every black ethnic group in the new world also happens to be.