but you said all those groups were ranked higher. if they weren't bigger out west or down south, how is that the case?
Reasons Why Outkast Will Never Be Seen As GOAT Contenders By Most Real Heads
- Thread starter Wacky D
- Start date
I don't know who was more popular out west. I know kast was an offshoot of west coast groups.
but mobb was a bigger factor across the map - west coast included. plus they made the infamous.
similar reasons as to why I have westside connection in the top-tier, even tho they weren't particularly popular on the east.
and that's one of the biggest problems for outkast. they were never a factor. they easily could've never existed, and nothing would be different.
may I add
to retroactively place them in goat conversations is downright insulting.
they can be one of your favorites, but to place them in the mix with goats is downright deplorable.
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What's your point? If hard drums is required for a piece of music to be considered Hip Hop, how is Kast, Mr. DJ, or Organized Noize production not Hip Hop.
And by including other genres, Hip Hop itself is a fusion or amalgamtion.
OutKast was not an off shoot of West Coast groups. An off shoot is something that is or was a part of another, but becomes its own separate entity i.e. OutKast and Goodie Mob are off shoots of Dungeon Family. Kast was influenced heavily by Dr. Dre's The Chronic and Souls of Mischief, which is something they have stated.
Mobb Deep was not a bigger factor across the map.
OutKast not existing would make a difference. They are one of the pioneers in Southern rap and along with The Geto Boys and Scarface forged a level of respect for Southern Hip Hop that wasn't there. They also pushed boundaries in Hip Hop in terms of what could be done musically. Therefore OutKast was a factor because before them The South was the region of booty anthems and one hit/one albun wonders outside of Geto Boys and Face.
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Because they don't have hard drums/grooves, my dude. And the relatively few Kast/Mr. DJ/Organized Noize songs that do, hip hop fans legit fukk with those songs (e.g. So Fresh So Clean). This isnt rocket science.
fukk
Because they don't have hard drums/grooves, my dude. And the relatively few Kast/Mr. DJ/Organized Noize songs that do, hip hop fans legit fukk with those songs (e.g. So Fresh So Clean). This isnt rocket science.
fukk
The fact that you don't think Kast doesn't have drums/grooves tells me that:
1) You don't know what a hard drum or groove is. That or you have a skewed/limited view of what a hard drum/groove is
2) You've never listened to Kast
I mean, you can't tell me that the first five or six songs on the early Kast albums didn't have hard drums/grooves as opposed to songs lilke "Growing Old" or "Ms. Jackson".
you'll say anything to get a reply
as you were
Breh make a thread with your definition of Hip Hop and post Kast songs from their albums and ask if they fit the description. If the majority of the posters vote that its not Hip Hop according your definition of "hard drums/grooves", I will gladly drop the argument altogether.
Victorious Secret
5:55
1.) you obviously don't know what an opinion is.
you saying that they were amazing lyricists, had dope production, etc IS AN OPINION.
I'm saying that they weren't received on the level of a top-tier group in their prime.............FACTS!!!!!
them winning a source award is neither here nor there. they could've swept the whole show for all I care. that's just industry chit. it doesn't change their status.
also, you cant read. SMH. me saying that they were one of the better-promoted groups was not an argument. it was me saying that they had no excuse to not be top-tier. for example, jay-z wasn't a top-tier rapper star in the reasonable doubt days, but he was on an indie deal. u follow me now?
2.) here you go with more opinions.
lets be clear. outkast has fan classics. their fans think they have 3 classics. they don't have any albums that people who generally don't like them or don't care about them, will go to and say "THATS A CLASSIC'. jay-z has that, biggie has that, nas & cube have those.
3.) southern hip-hop sounds nothing like outkast. and lol @ you thinking outkast had anything to do with the south moving to the forefront. especially that "speech" at the source awards, which is overstated by people who weren't around
4.) what is their impact on the culture? influencing a crop of industry plants 20 years later is nothing to hang your hat on.
and theres a whole thread of people telling you the real deal concerning those SB/TLB sales.
youre better at trolling, but if you start doing your homework, you could turn into a good poster.
youre way off, but I appreciate the effort and respect you for having an actual debate.
dap + rep
this is all I ask folks.
1. They are received as a top-tier group, and if you ask any actual hip-hop head, Outkast is in their top 5 groups of all time. It seems to be only your opinion that they aren't.
2. Wait...so when I say they have classics, it's an opinion...but when you say they don't, it's a fact? Sounds like we have one of those stuck in their ways Internet arguers here, folks
Most people (even if they don't fukk with Outkast) will admit they have at LEAST 2 classics.3. Outkast largely influenced the sound of the South, whether you like it or not.
4. "Industry plants" - shyt, didn't know I was dealing with a 12 year old here. Hanging your hat on SB/TLB selling only 5 million vs. 10 million isn't a good look. Can you name another Southern album that went 5x platinum? Go ahead and research, I'll wait.
Magnum P.I.M.P.
Tumultuous Splendor
Magnum P.I.M.P.
Tumultuous Splendor
Correct. And West Coasters like myself and Midwesterners and Internationalers.
How is it deplorable? They ultimately made music that still resonates with a lot of people, real Hip Hop heads included. That's why they are in the discussion. There's nothing retroactive about it. Anybody that's ever been considered GOAT anything got there because the music resonated over time as opposed to being flash in the pan. On top of that no one comes out the gate being GOAT. It happens over time. There's no cut off.
1. They are received as a top-tier group, and if you ask any actual hip-hop head, Outkast is in their top 5 groups of all time. It seems to be only your opinion that they aren't.
2. Wait...so when I say they have classics, it's an opinion...but when you say they don't, it's a fact? Sounds like we have one of those stuck in their ways Internet arguers here, folks
3. Outkast largely influenced the sound of the South, whether you like it or not.
4. "Industry plants" - shyt, didn't know I was dealing with a 12 year old here. Hanging your hat on SB/TLB selling only 5 million vs. 10 million isn't a good look. Can you name another Southern album that went 5x platinum? Go ahead and research, I'll wait.
Point #1 is why this thread even exists. If they weren't received as a top tier group by real heads, then the OP wouldn't be going overboard to prove otherwise. I mean, if Kast is just message board fodder, there would be no need to attempt to convince posters on a board that Kast is some C level group that never mattered. The OP knows Kast is respected by real heads and the Internet is the only safe haven to rewrite history, discredit the legitimacy of a group as a Hip Hop act, downplay their accolades all while claiming to be a true head. What's funny is his credibility is even in question here. Instead of just stating he never liked Kast like that and doesn't get why people consider them greats, he hides behind the mask of so called real heads to attempt to make his opinion look like a fact. Adding insult to injury is attaching "most" to it.