Question: Why is it always held against Kobe that he played with Shaq when Magic had Kareem?

Professor Emeritus

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Rakim Allah said:
Duncan't couldn't defend any of his titles. Once that season/playoff long bullseye and media pressure was his and the Spurs back, after winning a title, he and the Spurs folded like usual.:mjlit:
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I swear ya'all just trolls and are just trying to come up with the most arbitrary talking points possible. :gucci:

In 2000 Duncan got knocked out with a season-ending injury.

In 2004 David Robinson had retired.

In 2006 the Spurs lost to the Mavs in an epic Game 7 overtime duel. Duncan had 41-15-6 in that game. If Ginobli hadn't stupidly fouled Dirk to give him a game-tying three-point play then they would have faced the Heat in the Finals.

In 2008 Ginobli got hurt, Horry retired, and most of the rest of the team (Bowen/Barry/Finley/Thomas) was 35+ and :flabbynsick: as hell.

In 2015 Duncan was 38yo and couldn't carry the team anymore.


Those just weren't their years. Which one of those years did Duncan fold under the pressure? :childplease:

He would have had back-to-back in 13/14 if Bosh hadn't gotten that rebound and Ray hadn't hit that shot...but that was his fault how?
 
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god shamgod said:
Kareem needed magic to sustain his career, lakers went to the finals as soon as magic arrived and went to the finals after kareem retired

magic won 3 league mvp's and 3 finals mvp's in that same span. kareem 1 league mvp 1 finals mvp kobe 00000000 anything

shaq and magic were the engines of the lakers dynasties you can't rewrite history sorry
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/thread

Kobe stans stop tryna rewrite history. Ur rapist, snitching father was a sidekick. Get over it
 
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Ya Sinning Mane

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magic won a chip as a rookie and fukked the west up in his first year
thats a clear difference.


thats a real GOAT:banderas:
 
Rakim Allah

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Rhakim said:
It's not inferior, it's arbitrary. Winning in 2003 and 2005 is EXACTLY as good as winning in 2003 and 2004. :dahell:

And now you're gonna pretend like winning in a small market is easier than winning in a big one when the VAST majority of titles are won by big market teams. :mjlol:

And let's bring up coaching. That's a great talking point! Duncan only won under Pop. Kobe only won under Phil.

Now remind me who LeBron carried to titles? :sas1:

You're the one who just brought up coaching quality like it was a hammer. So who is inferior now? :sas2:





I swear you're a troll just trying to set up the worst possible arguments for Kobe. :skip:

First you brought up market size, then you brought up coaching quality, and now you're gonna bring up FG%? :pachaha:

Against one of the best defensive teams assembled, Duncan shot 10-27 with steller defense anchoring the middle to help pull out an 81-74 series win.

His 37% shooting in that game was better than TP (27%), Rip (33%), Prince (31%), and almost as good as Chauncey (38%).

You know what other Finals games it was better than?

Kobe 2000 Game 2
Kobe 2000 Game 5
Kobe 2000 Game 6
Kobe 2001 Game 1
Kobe 2002 Game 1
Kobe 2004 Game 1
Kobe 2004 Game 3
Kobe 2004 Game 4
Kobe 2004 Game 5
Kobe 2008 Game 1
Kobe 2008 Game 4
Kobe 2008 Game 6
Kobe 2009 Game 4
Kobe 2010 Game 3
Kobe 2010 Game 7

Duncan's Game 7 against the Pistons was better than 80% of Kobe's performances in the Finals against the same team the year before. :pachaha:

But again, this is a fanbase that thinks that 37-38% is the same as 25%. :childplease:
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No it's not EXACTLY as good. Duncan't and the Spurs could only win playing under the radar. As evident by the lack of repeats.

Duncan't shot terribly, well below his normal shooting%. Yet no one EVER brings it up except for me and other unbias students of the game:mjgrin: Manu saved Duncan't and the Spurs in Game 7. But again, Bronsexuals think 37% is a good percentage for a big man who normally shoots over 50%. Both Kobe and Duncan't had terrible shooting games. One gets acknowledged heavily while the other, not at all.


Since you want to bring up 2004. Too bad Duncan't's performance wasn't better than Kobes in the 2004 West Semis. Where Duncan't and the Spurd choked off a 2-0 lead. Didn't the Spurs win the title year before? Choking on that pressure and media attention when defending a title. This would become a recurring theme in Duncan't's Hall of Fame career.
 
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NoHalfWay said:
I don’t see how any of that proves Kobe is that high on the hierarchy. Bean was a generational talent with longevity to match but he did not dominate on a top 5 all-time level. His peak doesn’t even come near some of these players y’all scoff at

You got nikkas in here legitimately confused as to why people have Olajuwon ahead of Kobe. :gucci:

The same dude that lead a team that booted out the dynastic Showtime Lakers in the WCF in his second year in the league. The dude that carried his squad to back to back titles, one of those years as a 6th seed, and still the only player in NBA history to win DPOY, MVP, and Finals MVP in a single season. :dwillhuh:

Kobe is an all time great but let’s not lose perspective
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He only did that because Jordan retired :francis:
 
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2Quik4UHoes said:
Now, this has always been a bullshyt talking point to begin with but I don’t think anyone ever bothered to ask this question.

Everyone in here would say that Magic and Kareem are top 5 and Mt. Rushmore level players. However, if you bring up Kobe you hear this shyt about three of his rings being practically worthless. But Kobe never played with a top 5 OAT player like Magic or Kareem got to.

What does that then say about Magic and Kareem’s titles? I mean shyt, for all of Kareem’s greatness he was blessed to play with not only Oscar Robertson who is a HOFer, but he then ended up playing with the GOAT point guard in history. And Magic? Well shyt he not only had Kareem, but he also had an amazing team around him with guys like James Worthy, B Scott, Coop, etc. But no one dare question either Magic or Kareem, and rightfully so.

Now call me crazy, but those are insane advantages that they each had. Plus I’m sure most in here would agree that Kareem and Magic were both better than Shaq. Who was whose sidekick there? Nobody right? So why y’all claim Kobe was a sidekick when he very clearly wasn’t?

Why the selective use of this all important talking point? Somebody’s rings shouldn’t count in this according to the prevailing logic which seeks to devalue Kobe’s three titles during the Shaq years. Maybe it’s just time that this dead horse get buried and Kobe is respected as the five time champion that he is without the long since debunked espn talking points about sidekick rings.
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Actually no one could dare say Magic was better than Prime Shaq...Magic made the difference for them but without Shaq, who is Kobe Bryant? He would of been loser anywhere else he went and Shaq would of been champion post Jordan no matter what. He was the MVP when it went to the Finals..not Kobe..Horry or the other sidekicks. Kareem wouldnt be the champion he is today if Shaq was in his era...Shaq changed the game of basketball basically. That's how dominant he was. Kobe at his best was never Shaq level....neither was Magic. Neither was Bird.
 
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Hakeem is great and he proved himself but he wouldnt be the champion he is today if Jordan's father never got killed. So I dont put him on the Shaq, Wilt level.
 
Rakim Allah

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Rhakim said:
I swear ya'all just trolls and are just trying to come up with the most arbitrary talking points possible. :gucci:

In 2000 Duncan got knocked out with a season-ending injury.

In 2004 David Robinson had retired.

In 2006 the Spurs lost to the Mavs in an epic Game 7 overtime duel. Duncan had 41-15-6 in that game. If Ginobli hadn't stupidly fouled Dirk to give him a game-tying three-point play then they would have faced the Heat in the Finals.

In 2008 Ginobli got hurt, Horry retired, and most of the rest of the team (Bowen/Barry/Finley/Thomas) was 35+ and :flabbynsick: as hell.

In 2015 Duncan was 38yo and couldn't carry the team anymore.


Those just weren't their years. Which one of those years did Duncan fold under the pressure? :childplease:

He would have had back-to-back in 13/14 if Bosh hadn't gotten that rebound and Ray hadn't hit that shot...but that was his fault how?
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2004 Duncan't and the Spurs had homecourt and 2-0 lead and choked away the lead to who? Kobe and the Lakers.:sas2:

2006 Duncan't and the Spurs won 63 games and had the #1 seed. Duncan't and the Spurs couldn't even get to the Finals, let alone defend their title. :mjlol:

BTW, Kobe has ALWAYS at least made the Finals as the #1 seed. As you can see above and losing to an 8 seed, Duncan't CAN'T say the same.:pachaha:

2008 Duncan't and Spurs lose once again to Kobe and the Lakers in the playoffs. - Spurs won one less game than the Lakers in the RS. Kobe 4-2 :sas1:

2015 The prior ring doesn't even count so what was he defending?:mjlit:

He folded everytime he couldn't defend his title. Damn B, he couldn't defend it at least once.:scust:
 
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Rhakim said:
How are those "excuses"? Those are the reasons that the Magic lost those years. If Shaq was better at that stage in his career he would have overcome them. What's the difference between an excuse and a reason to you?

How come shaq doesn’t have more rings than Kobe?


They weren't any luckier than the Lakers were in 2009 (barely beating Houston even after both McGrady and Yao got hurt and the bullshyt Artest ejection, not having to face Boston after Garnett got hurt, not having to face Cleveland after Orlando took them out) or 2010 (Pau had to put back Kobe's missed layin at the buzzer to keep the Thunder series from going 7, then they would have got it handed to them by the Celtics if Perkins doesn't get hurt, Ray doesn't have to play injured, and the Lakers don't get mad free throws in the last two games).

Boston was the clear best team in the NBA for the entire season in 2008 and they won the deciding game by 39 points. You don't have a great case that Bynum (a 20yo who was just finding himself that season and had never done shyt in the playoffs) or Ariza (the 10th man who only missed 1 Finals game) would have been the difference makers.

Cleveland came closer than the Lakers did, LeBron only lost Game 7 by five points and that's with a sudden lucky-ass scoring spree by fukking P.J. Brown.

I'm gonna bookmark this though, you actually made an excuse for the Lakers cause their 10th-man missed one game. :dead:



:snoop:


You're right that Tim Duncan was only a top-5 player until he was 32. Why is that the imaginary cut-off, rather than top-4 or top-7?

And Kobe dominated in 2008 because Ginobli got hurt and the rest of the Spurs' swing players were useless 40 year olds.


Here u go making more excuses smh. U will never just give Kobe his credit huh?
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