OFFICIAL Game of Holmes Season 8 Thread - A Dream of Flat Tops 4/14/19

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While this is a fair point I think it's also worth noting they got conned. I understand D&D wanted to move on, and I have no issue with the total season count. But the way they reduced the episode counts and rushed to the ending is unacceptable. You're right, HBO getting rid of them would have been a bad move. But there's a middle ground. Namely, writing a bigger check and demanding the last two seasons have 10 episodes. The show could have had the same wack story beats...but with an addition seven episodes (ie 3 more for S7, 4 more for S8) they could have at least set the table better.


But from all reports they DID try to write D&D a bigger check and did indeed push for more seasons and episodes. D&D STAUNCHLY refused, which if, had they not completely shytted the bed on the ending would have looked like the genius moves of two showrunners who refused to drag along the story for financial gains. Instead they look like two a$$holes who simply no longer gave a fukk.
 

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They should reshoot the last two seasons per GRRM direction. shyt would still do numbers and would be like Brotherhood was to Full Metal Alchemist.

In a perfect world.

Pretend that shyt never existed then double up with the payments for all the actors to come back and redo shyt. I know HBO got the bread. shyt, I take a animated version of newer versions of S6-S8.
 
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In a perfect world.

Pretend that shyt never existed then double up with the payments for all the actors to come back and redo shyt. I know HBO got the bread. shyt, I take a animated version of newer versions of S6-S8.


I HIGHLY doubt that they could get all the principle actors back to reshoot the 8th season. I don’t think Kit Harrington, Peter Dinklage, or the chick who played Arya (can’t remember her name) especially would want to return, as they’ve all moved on to other projects.


Besides that RR Martin isn’t even CLOSE to finishing the series so whats to stop this theoretically new series from being trash itself? Unless your going to pay GRRM ungodly amounts to essentially write every script it doesn’t make any sense to reshoot it
 
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Piff Perkins

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But from all reports they DID try to write D&D a bigger check and did indeed push for more seasons and episodes. D&D STAUNCHLY refused, which if, had they not completely shytted the bed on the ending would have looked like the genius moves of two showrunners who refused to drag along the story for financial gains. Instead they look like two a$$holes who simply no longer gave a fukk.

It's crazy man. I can at least respect the fact that running that show must be a life consuming HARD job that most people wouldn't want. But you signed up for this...and to be frank, if they had truly nailed the landing or even halfway nailed it...they go down as the GOAT showrunners, and any job they want would be laid at their feet. Instead they half assed it, thought they'd get away with it...and it's not turning out well for them. Disney halted their trilogy in part due to the negative fan reactions to the finale. HBO shytcanned their Confederate show because they had issues with the content.

Now they have a big Netflix deal but even that seems suspect. Their first project is...a stand up comedy with Leslie Jones. No disrespect to Leslie Jones but anyone could direct that. Why is that their first thing? Is it because Netflix is nervous? Is it because they wanted to do something low key first? I have a feeling this deal with fall thru just like the Disney one. These guys were GIVEN arguably the greatest fantasy series since LOTR, featuring some of the best written/thought out characters in the genre. Nearly every memorable plot beat or dialogue was taken directly from the books or George RR Martin. The idea that they can create something unique on their own now is laughable to me, given the unique plots they created for Game Of Thrones tended to be TERRIBLE (Ros the prostitute, everything about Dorne, completely remaking Jamie Lannister as a character, etc). These guys think they can just create some "grey" characters for a show and that will make it good. Nah.
 

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I do hope when GRRM gets the book out (....I know:francis:) that HBO will order a book faithful adaptation of the whole series. Might be wishful thinking, but HBO has shown to be serious about greenlighting a lot of series for HBO Max, including animation, and they did do limited animation for the GoT Blu Rays that proved to be popular with the fans. I think it would be well received and pull in decent ratings , especially if they got some of the actors back on board for voice work.
 
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hex

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It's crazy man. I can at least respect the fact that running that show must be a life consuming HARD job that most people wouldn't want. But you signed up for this...and to be frank, if they had truly nailed the landing or even halfway nailed it...they go down as the GOAT showrunners, and any job they want would be laid at their feet. Instead they half assed it, thought they'd get away with it...and it's not turning out well for them. Disney halted their trilogy in part due to the negative fan reactions to the finale. HBO shytcanned their Confederate show because they had issues with the content.

Now they have a big Netflix deal but even that seems suspect. Their first project is...a stand up comedy with Leslie Jones. No disrespect to Leslie Jones but anyone could direct that. Why is that their first thing? Is it because Netflix is nervous? Is it because they wanted to do something low key first? I have a feeling this deal with fall thru just like the Disney one. These guys were GIVEN arguably the greatest fantasy series since LOTR, featuring some of the best written/thought out characters in the genre. Nearly every memorable plot beat or dialogue was taken directly from the books or George RR Martin. The idea that they can create something unique on their own now is laughable to me, given the unique plots they created for Game Of Thrones tended to be TERRIBLE (Ros the prostitute, everything about Dorne, completely remaking Jamie Lannister as a character, etc). These guys think they can just create some "grey" characters for a show and that will make it good. Nah.

Even if they stuck the landing I wouldn't consider them the GOATs off one series. They'd have to do a couple more series, at least. They could be, top 5-10 probably.

The only person I'd say is the GOAT off one series is Rod Serling off "The Twilight Zone". Because he wrote most of the OG episodes.

Fred.
 
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It's crazy man. I can at least respect the fact that running that show must be a life consuming HARD job that most people wouldn't want. But you signed up for this...and to be frank, if they had truly nailed the landing or even halfway nailed it...they go down as the GOAT showrunners, and any job they want would be laid at their feet. Instead they half assed it, thought they'd get away with it...and it's not turning out well for them. Disney halted their trilogy in part due to the negative fan reactions to the finale. HBO shytcanned their Confederate show because they had issues with the content.

Now they have a big Netflix deal but even that seems suspect. Their first project is...a stand up comedy with Leslie Jones. No disrespect to Leslie Jones but anyone could direct that. Why is that their first thing? Is it because Netflix is nervous? Is it because they wanted to do something low key first? I have a feeling this deal with fall thru just like the Disney one. These guys were GIVEN arguably the greatest fantasy series since LOTR, featuring some of the best written/thought out characters in the genre. Nearly every memorable plot beat or dialogue was taken directly from the books or George RR Martin. The idea that they can create something unique on their own now is laughable to me, given the unique plots they created for Game Of Thrones tended to be TERRIBLE (Ros the prostitute, everything about Dorne, completely remaking Jamie Lannister as a character, etc). These guys think they can just create some "grey" characters for a show and that will make it good. Nah.


Agreed.


Except for one thing. Was Ros the prostitute the one who was from Winterfell who ended up in Kings Landing? I didn’t really mind her so much its not like she was a huge bearing on the plot
 

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Agreed.


Except for one thing. Was Ros the prostitute the one who was from Winterfell who ended up in Kings Landing? I didn’t really mind her so much its not like she was a huge bearing on the plot

I mention her because she was the first character/moment created for the "sexposition" thing they created, where they'd do plot/exposition dumps during sex scenes because they thought audiences were too stupid to scare without sex on screen. That was the first time I thought ok these guys are suspect. And then remember during the second season, the big battle at the end...the director admitted the showrunners forced him to add some nudity to scenes for similar reasons. These guys wanted titillation over substance, and in the end it killed them.

In terms of the GOAT thing...it wouldn't be my GOAT of course, I was just talking about it from a showrunner perspective. To properly end the biggest show (in terms of budget/size/etc) of all time and go out with a bang would have probably been the greatest showrunner feat, ever. Instead a year after the show, no one really talks about it unless they're complaining and people who missed out are being told straight up that the ending sucked. Similar to how Lost never really got that big syndication money due to how negative the reaction to the ending was.
 

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Agreed.


Except for one thing. Was Ros the prostitute the one who was from Winterfell who ended up in Kings Landing? I didn’t really mind her so much its not like she was a huge bearing on the plot


Wrong post. Rose wasn't a bad character.
 

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The Disney/Star Wars deal was officially announced February 2018....when they were in the middle of making season 8. Which means they probably knew about it long before production on season 8 began.

So it definitely impacted the last season. Not to mention they turned down a season 9 offer, due to the Disney deal.




Fred.

HBO announced that the show would end with with 2 shortened seasons in April of 2016, which means they knew even before then. That's a full 22 months minimum before their Star Wars project was announced. The two aren't related. They didn't turn down more seasons from HBO because of Star Wars. They turned down more seasons because they always viewed this as a 70-80 hour story. They've said as much since 2012.

People can take issues with the idea of viewing GoT as a 70-80 hour story and whether that was a wise story telling decision. But the notion that they suddenly came to the decision late in the process is factually not true.
 

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It's crazy man. I can at least respect the fact that running that show must be a life consuming HARD job that most people wouldn't want. But you signed up for this...and to be frank, if they had truly nailed the landing or even halfway nailed it...they go down as the GOAT showrunners, and any job they want would be laid at their feet. Instead they half assed it, thought they'd get away with it...and it's not turning out well for them. Disney halted their trilogy in part due to the negative fan reactions to the finale. HBO shytcanned their Confederate show because they had issues with the content.

Now they have a big Netflix deal but even that seems suspect. Their first project is...a stand up comedy with Leslie Jones. No disrespect to Leslie Jones but anyone could direct that. Why is that their first thing? Is it because Netflix is nervous? Is it because they wanted to do something low key first? I have a feeling this deal with fall thru just like the Disney one. These guys were GIVEN arguably the greatest fantasy series since LOTR, featuring some of the best written/thought out characters in the genre. Nearly every memorable plot beat or dialogue was taken directly from the books or George RR Martin. The idea that they can create something unique on their own now is laughable to me, given the unique plots they created for Game Of Thrones tended to be TERRIBLE (Ros the prostitute, everything about Dorne, completely remaking Jamie Lannister as a character, etc). These guys think they can just create some "grey" characters for a show and that will make it good. Nah.

These overall deals can take years to end up with anything on screen. Shonda signed her mega deal in 2017 and still hasn't aired anything on Netflix.
 

hex

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HBO announced that the show would end with with 2 shortened seasons in April of 2016, which means they knew even before then. That's a full 22 months minimum before their Star Wars project was announced. The two aren't related. They didn't turn down more seasons from HBO because of Star Wars. They turned down more seasons because they always viewed this as a 70-80 hour story. They've said as much since 2012.

People can take issues with the idea of viewing GoT as a 70-80 hour story and whether that was a wise story telling decision. But the notion that they suddenly came to the decision late in the process is factually not true.

Uh....no man.

Two shortened seasons =/= it's automatically a train wreck. "BB" had two shortened final seasons and they had no problem sticking the landing.

The "Star Wars" deal was officially announced half way through production of season 8. Meaning, they knew about it prior to season 8. So they had the prospects of a "Star Wars" project hanging over their heads as they were going into the final season. If you don't think that affected the quality of the final season....no offense, but you're nuts.

And the number of seasons/episodes was never etched in stone. Here's an article from 2014 where Weiss and Benioff wanted to end it after 7 seasons:

'Game of Thrones' team: 7 seasons is the plan

I guess this is the part where you say "but 7 seasons = 70 episodes"....but the final season (whatever number it was) was originally meant to be extended. Not shortened:

Game of Thrones: HBO wants more than 7 seasons

Perhaps the most likely outcome for the end of Thrones is having an extended, split-run seventh and final season — where more episodes are ordered than Thrones‘ usual 10, but half air one year and half air the next. This would get HBO another “season” without having to renegotiate with the cast since all the episodes are technically part of the seventh round they’re already optioned for. AMC employed this strategy with the final seasons of Breaking Bad and Mad Men, but HBO used this technique first with the sixth and final season of The Sopranos, which consisted of 21 episodes instead of the usual 13. Additionally distributing the final two hours beyond HBO with some sort of theatrical run for fans who want to see it in the theater wouldn’t be surprising, either.

Also, keep in mind "GOT" season 8 being pushed back to 2019 was announced two months prior to the "Star Wars" deal. Meaning, they knew about it when they made that decision:

Why 'Game of Thrones' Won't Return Until 2019

Lastly, all 6 episodes in season 8 were supposed to be longer than an hour:

Confirmed: All <em>Game of Thrones</em> Season 8 Episodes Will Be Over an Hour Long

In the end, only 4 were. Which again, would've been decided in editing after the "Star Wars" deal was announced.

So....yeah.

Fred.
 

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George RR Martin has thrown elements of cosmic horror into his story, and it can only aid to the bitter sweet ending that he has teased at. The irrelevance of man is a common theme of Lovecrafts work(lovecraft is an author who influenced GRRM)While we are so focused on who wins the iron throne, we may be thrown for a loop when none of it matters at all. :wow:

This is why you can’t shun(the show fans) or speed up(the show writers) the magical elements of the original work. It just leads to a crappy weird ending. Never forget, only the first book was called A Game Of Thrones. But the story of Ice And Fire in its entirety goes beyond the battle for the throne and goes beyond #StarkSet Vs #LannisterSet. The book really shows the horrors of war, and honor vs duty vs love, and it really fleshes our the characters. I became a devout book reader after the show ended. I am now a bigger fan of the books than the show, even though the show introduced me to the books. :wow:



 

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:ohhh:


George RR Martin has thrown elements of cosmic horror into his story, and it can only aid to the bitter sweet ending that he has teased at. The irrelevance of man is a common theme of Lovecrafts work(lovecraft is an author who influenced GRRM)While we are so focused on who wins the iron throne, we may be thrown for a loop when none of it matters at all. :wow:

This is why you can’t shun(the show fans) or speed up(the show writers) the magical elements of the original work. It just leads to a crappy weird ending. Never forget, only the first book was called A Game Of Thrones. But the story of Ice And Fire in its entirety goes beyond the battle for the throne and goes beyond #StarkSet Vs #LannisterSet. The book really shows the horrors of war, and honor vs duty vs love, and it really fleshes our the characters. I became a devout book reader after the show ended. I am now a bigger fan of the books than the show, even though the show introduced me to the books. :wow:


 
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