My Posse's On Broadway: Official NY Knicks 2016-2017 Season Thread

[storyteller]

Barton might be a place for value. Obviously, at the moment, our prospect outlook has shifted from great, to alright.

We went from top 3 or 4 to Mudiay/Stanley Johnson/Vonleh/ Trey Burke territory.

That does not mean there are NO good players, it just means the likelihood of picking a really good one has diminished, greatly.

Due to the quality in this draft, I wouldn't call the 5-9 Mudiay, Burke, Johnson (though I still have hope for him) territory really. The likelihood of the pick being really good is still pretty solid when the choices are gonna be between Isaac, Frank and Monk...but chances of grabbing a true franchise changer are definitely diminished significantly. It's just lucky for us that it's such a deep draft.

Free agency money should be focussed on younger/high upside players who the initial market overlooks. Take a look at some similar options from abroad.

My Teodosic obsession is well documented here so you know I'm on board with looking overseas. I don't see many good options in the FA young/high upside market, at least not guys that we can get on smart contracts. That's why I've shifted gears, I think auctioning our cap space off for assets to teams that want more room to sign players will be more prudent in collecting future pieces (and this is obviously pure speculation so I'm not mad at anyone who disagrees as there are dangers when you eat contracts).

Yeah, but MOST of that flexibility has come from an increased cap. He doesn't get credit for that. He blew a significant chunk of money on Joakim, which is a total and complete disaster.

I don't even hate phil, I just wish he was better.

I'd argue that many of Phil's moves were made with knowledge that he could afford to make them because of the cap increases. Again, speculation here but I think without the increases, his decision making changes dramatically. To point out why I think he's made moves with specific cap ideas; Robin Lopez's contract counted for the same percentage of the cap this past offseason as Noah's would have had the projected cap increases held (they dipped a few million so it's worse off now though). That Noah contract is ugly, godawful and we're stuck with it; but I do feel it was signed with an eye on the increase. Same with Lee and Lance. Had things held, the Knicks would be sitting on over 20 mil in space even after the cap holds. Also notable is that the big acquisition, the true homerun swing, was on an expiring player (aka it would have been a low risk decision if not for the Noah follow-up). Now none of this is to say Phil's been particularly good; but that the balancing act he has accomplished these three seasons in keeping Melo happy but also bulking up the rotation with smart contracts on long term pieces slowly but surely isn't so bad. If you look at the roster each season, there's a ton of turnover but it's also slowly but sure becoming a stable roster. Next season a lot of face will be familiar and besides Noah, the returning guys should all be on movable contracts. Again, that's not a huge complement, it's just saying "the captain hasn't steered us into an iceberg yet" which places him head and shoulders above every Knicks GM since Y2K (we've moved up from piles of crap to dirt).

 

[Frump]

His motto is 'Stay Melo,' but Carmelo Anthony more likely to go

In a season littered with low points, the 2016-17 New York Knicks appeared to find rock bottom on March 12.

In Brooklyn, the 11-win Nets sank 14 3-pointers in the first half against the Knicks, effectively ending New York's playoff hopes in 24 painful minutes. And head coach Jeff Hornacek wasn't happy.


Hornacek lit into the Knicks in the visitors locker room of the Barclays Center, and according to people familiar with the matter, Hornacek's diatribe was expletive-filled and delivered at a high decibel level.

It's not uncommon for a coach to go off on his players after a pathetic showing. But what happened next was a bit surprising.

Carmelo Anthony, whose default demeanor is relaxed and easygoing, responded with anger and expletives of his own. For those accustomed to seeing Anthony live by his oft-used idiom, "Stay Melo," it was jarring.

Anthony's R-rated rant essentially questioned the direction of the entire organization, according to sources. Associate head coach Kurt Rambis fired back, calling out Anthony's effort on defense.

Anthony responded again, but before things could devolve further, one Knick suggested that the players head back to the court and start warming up.

So they did.

......

The back-and-forth between Anthony, Hornacek and Rambis in March was but one example of the instability that plagued the 2016-17 Knicks. It typified a divide caused by some players' lack of faith in the defensive game plan under associate head coach Rambis and Hornacek's use of the triangle offense, according to sources.

Of course, the counterargument is that this year's team could have fought for a playoff spot if players gave consistent effort on both ends of the floor. Some in the organization felt that the defensive habits of Derrick Rose and Anthony had a negative influence on the club's young players. Both veterans finished among the bottom 15 at their respective positions in ESPN's defensive Real Plus-Minus, a measure of a player's contribution to his team's defense.

Get em outta here

 

[ISO]

the bucks could use someone like him. a vet that has good shooting and plays defense....he's better than their other options at the 2 for sure.
kris middleton is a 3
new orleans as well.....they need consistent role players to surround ad and cousins badly...they need as much spacing as they can get for those two big men...and he does that.

Milwaukee plays positionless basketball they want a team of versatile and lengthy players that's what they're trying to do with their core (Giannis, Middleton, Parker, Maker). Middleton can defend 2's and is an above average playmaker and shooter.

If they move Khris to the 3, that means Giannis is what? A PG? He'll never be a full-time PG.

 

[ikbm]

Milwaukee plays positionless basketball they want a team of versatile and lengthy players that's what they're trying to do with their core (Giannis, Middleton, Parker, Maker). Middleton can defend 2's and is an above average playmaker and shooter.

If they move Khris to the 3, that means Giannis is what? A PG? He'll never be a full-time PG.

problem is....i purposely left out parker...you cant rely on soomeone who blew their knee out twice.
lee is a 6'5 shooting guard and offers a bit more versatility than you give him credit for....he can guard wings and guards.
i disagree about middletons playmaking skills but thats me
i mean shyt...they got jason terry old ass giving minutes ina combo guard scenario...and hell snell getting 30 minutes a night. he's an upgrade over that.

 

[ISO]

problem is....i purposely left out parker...you cant rely on soomeone who blew their knee out twice.
lee is a 6'5 shooting guard and offers a bit more versatility than you give him credit for.

The thing is despite blowing his knee out twice, Parker is still considered a core piece of the team and was having a great year before the tear (20/6/3). His ACL got stronger after his first tear and he came back in his best shape and improved his shooting to 36% from 3. He won't be back till the new year and will likely be restricted so maybe a Lee acquisition is logical for them. Also, Lee can be a really valuable bench piece when that Milwaukee team hit its prime.



Who would you want back?

 

[ikbm]

The thing is despite blowing his knee out twice, Parker is still considered a core piece of the team and was having a great year before the tear (20/6/3). He won't be back till the new year and will likely be restricted so maybe a Lee acquisition is logical for them. Also, Lee can be a really valuable bench piece when that Milwaukee team hit its prime.



Who would you want back?

peep the edit.
i never quite thought of what i'd take back from them...considering his question is who would he be valuable too.
i'd take a second rounder or two
at some point im assuming milwaukee wont value picks as much in the not so distant future.
there's no one on their current roster that interests me...beyond the untouchables they have

 

[Montez]

̶P̶h̶i̶l̶'̶s̶ Charlie Rosen's assessment on the season

— Let’s start with Carmelo Anthony.

It’s no secret that he’s always been a sticky-handed, shoot-first player who plays minimal defense.

Why then did Phil Jackson sign him to a lengthy, expensive and, most importantly, no-trade clause contract?

Because the triangle requires a go-to scorer who can create his own makeable shots when the offense is stymied and the shot clock is about to expire. While Anthony is not at the level of Michael Jordan or Kobe Bryant, he certainly fills the bill here.

It was also expected that Melo’s scoring could take the pressure off some of the young players whom Jackson had hoped to obtain and develop.

And granting Anthony that no-trade clause was the only way to get him to return to his home town.

But there’s another reason why Jackson was forced to lure Melo back to New York: Knicks fans in the Big Apple are averse to any suggestion that their beloved team might be undertaking a rebuilding process. However, their reluctance to accept such a program can be entirely mitigated if a superstar player can be the focus of whatever enthusiasm they can muster.

In whatever the arena — political, entertainment, and athletic — New York absolutely loves stars!

However, primarily because of his reluctance to triangularize his game, Melo simply became a ball-stopping, motion-freezing individual whose selfishness severely curtailed the development of the Knicks’ younger players.

Even so, the star-crazed Knick fans still cheered his every move.

Rosen | Reviewing The Knicks' Dismal 2016-17 Season

Not like we have two baseball teams who have done or going through rebuilds...or a team in Brooklyn rebuilding or the Jets.

 

[Miles Davis]

̶P̶h̶i̶l̶'̶s̶ Charlie Rosen's assessment on the season



Rosen | Reviewing The Knicks' Dismal 2016-17 Season

Not like we have two baseball teams who have done or going through rebuilds...or a team in Brooklyn rebuilding or the Jets.

Dude trying to take all the heat off Phil

 

[ISO]

peep the edit.
i never quite thought of what i'd take back from them...considering his question is who would he be valuable too.
i'd take a second rounder or two
at some point im assuming milwaukee wont value picks as much in the not so distant future.

I peeped you're underrating Middleton's passing he's averaged 4 assists per 36 minutes the last two years.

 

[Captain Crunch]

Some of the guys in the Heat thread think Melo might go to Miami. I don't think he wants to go there since none of his boys play in Miami anymore. Do you guys think there's any chance Melo would agree to a Heat trade?

 

[storyteller]

Some of the guys in the Heat thread think Melo might go to Miami. I don't think he wants to go there since none of his boys play in Miami anymore. Do you guys think there's any chance Melo would agree to a Heat trade?

I figured that was gone with D-Wade too, especially since those weren't great circumstances for Wade or Bosh at the end. But I have a feeling Melo's gonna add at least a few more teams to the Clips/Cavs list after all the drama with Phil.

 

[I.V.]

Now none of this is to say Phil's been particularly good; but that the balancing act he has accomplished these three seasons in keeping Melo happy but also bulking up the rotation with smart contracts on long term pieces slowly but surely isn't so bad.

The team has been trash. AND melo is miserable. And Noah's deal is a fukking albatross, and we gave up the best player, and a low-tier prospect to trade for cap space -- which is now eaten by the horrible deal he signed noah to.

That Noah deal is an iceberg, b. It's an anchor. It's almost 20% of the cap for a guy who can't play anymore. Good teams and GMs don't do shyt like that. Or at least have enough big wins around, that you can drown out the losses.

 

[Wargames]

I wonder if Phil absorbs bad contracts this offseason for future picks/young prospects

 

[seemorecizzy]

̶P̶h̶i̶l̶'̶s̶ Charlie Rosen's assessment on the season



Rosen | Reviewing The Knicks' Dismal 2016-17 Season

Not like we have two baseball teams who have done or going through rebuilds...or a team in Brooklyn rebuilding or the Jets.

WHe is this guy always writing articles about us starting shyt

Never heard of him until phil showed up
He has shyt on damn near every player

 

[Cognito]

Jauwan Evans and Caleb Swanigan are my sleepers. Evans the fastest player in draft and a great playmaker. Swanigab great rebound,inside scorer,passer, has some range too. If Evans can improve his finishing and shoots more threes he can be a all-star. Swanigan is the closest thing to Zach Randolph I've seen. He needs to continue to change his body