LIVE from Detroit ... the 2024 Official NFL Draft Thread (April 25-27) 6PM EST, ABC/ESPN/NFL Network

[Samori Toure]

41 for 415 is not a "good season" therefore both his good seasons were with Penix, like I said

41 catches for a redshirt freshman is not a good season. Thank you Mel McShay.

 

[Samori Toure]

Did you really just reference a year in which cuh started 1 game (a bowl game at that) and was like WR4-5 on the depth chart like it's to be taken serious?

I mentioned that he was in school for 3 years and listed his stats. No one really expects anything from a freshman anyway so the fact that they even see the field is an accomplishment.

 

[KingsnBucs1987]

Lets...not compare arm strength to these people when the guy hasn't launched it like that in games.

Show me that jaw dropping arm strength in a game because many of those guys there are actually clips that prove it's not a fluke.

Furthest I've ever seen dude throw was 60 indoors.

Not saying dude is gonna be other-worldly but he has some good zip on the ball and can make the window tight throws.

 

[MrSpook]

If these mfs don’t draft a CB I know something…

But if they wanna snatch adoni Mitchell I wouldn’t be mad

 

[Eye Cue DA COLI GAWD]

41 catches for a redshirt freshman is not a good season. Thank you Mel McShay.

I'm better than McShay. I'm official in the streets

 

[Eye Cue DA COLI GAWD]

Not saying dude is gonna be other-worldly but he has some good zip on the ball and can make the window tight throws.

Crossing Route McCarthy. No one does it better @Trust Me

 

[Braman]

For me, game manager isn't an indicator of physical ability. JJ has an arm, but his ceiling as a QB is not the same as the others. If we're talking about all of the QBs both good and bad.

• Caleb is Black Manziel. His fans start with the stats and highlights, but if you watch him he is not consistent and is a bit of front runner.
• Jayden is RG3 2.0. He is a track body, with speed, who can really throw, but he doesn't know how to protect his body while playing.
• Drake Maye is Trubisky with better PR and less pressure. I would bet money I could pass off a Trubisky highlight tape as a Maye highlight tape. They went to the same college and even had the same number. Luckily for him he's going to NE where they're going to slow play him. If they don't he'll be another Mitch. (Mitch's biggest issue was he got drafted ahead of Mahomes and Watson and they couldn't slow play him. Maye got drafted behind Caleb and Jayden)
• Penix is Culpepper. He's not as big, but he's athletic enough to run yet he won't and he is going to throw BOMBS. His main problem is his brain short circuits when you force him to play intermediate to short. He shines when he can play deep to intermediate.
• Bo Nix is a bigger Brock Purdy with more pedigree. He'll be fine with a bit of talent surrounding him and he won't make dumb plays.

JJ is Josh Freeman.

Solid breakdowns (except for JJ). I’d add a few counters/modifications:

- Manzel failed largely bc of off field stuff, lack of prep. I’d say Baker mayfield is Manziel actualized. So if Caleb is baker with better arm talent that’s a great floor.

-Agree on Maye, expect him going to NE is TERRIBLE bc forget the development they have no weapons .

-Commanders fan here so RG3 failed not only bc of injury but also he wasn’t liked, he thought he knew everything. Jaden is the opposite. So being RG3 w/ better locker room presence & more league protections for QBs = scary

Back to JJ. I’d disagree that game manager isn’t tied to arm strength. Typically that’s what that implies. But ok let’s look at another barometer: yards per attempt. That speaks directly to what a QB is asked to do. Is he just dink and dunk., can he push downfield. Typically 8 is average. 9 and up is noteworthy. Career YPA:

Caleb- 9.2
Daniels- 8.9 (11.7 this year 2nd all time)
Maye- 8.4
Nix- 8.5 (11.3 this year)
Penix- 8.2 (8.8 this year)
McCarthy- 8.7 (9 this year)

So he’s got the arm, he WASNT just dunk n dunk he was airing it out the same as others just less volume. And for reference, Josh freeman was at 7ypa

So JJ is unique. Usually the big arm guy is seen as a gunslinger , upside play, etc. But JJ has the intangibles and IQ but ALSO the arm talent. Doesn’t come across often.The name that comes to mind as a comp is Deshaun Watson.

 

[Eye Cue DA COLI GAWD]

Solid breakdowns (except for JJ). I’d add a few counters/modifications:

- Manzel failed largely bc of off field stuff, lack of prep. I’d say Baker mayfield is Manziel actualized. So if Caleb is baker with better arm talent that’s a great floor.

-Agree on Maye, expect him going to NE is TERRIBLE bc forget the development they have no weapons .

-Commanders fan here so RG3 failed not only bc of injury but also he wasn’t liked, he thought he knew everything. Jaden is the opposite. So being RG3 w/ better locker room presence & more league protections for QBs = scary

Back to JJ. I’d disagree that game manager isn’t tied to arm strength. Typically that’s what that implies. But ok let’s look at another barometer: yards per attempt. That speaks directly to what a QB is asked to do. Is he just dink and dunk. Typically 8 is average. 9 and up is noteworthy. Career YPA:

Caleb- 9.2
Daniels- 8.9 (11.7 this year 2nd all time)
Maye- 8.4
Nix- 8.5 (11.3 this year)
Penix- 8.2 (8.8 this year)
McCarthy- 8.7 (9 this year)

So he’s got the arm, he WASNT just dunk n dunk he was airing it out the same as others just less volume. And for reference, Josh freeman was at 7ypa

So JJ is unique. Usually the big arm guy is seen as a gunslinger , upside play, etc. But JJ has the intangibles and IQ but ALSO the arm talent. Doesn’t come across often.The name that comes to mind as a comp is Deshaun Watson.

 

[IIVI]

Not saying dude is gonna be other-worldly but he has some good zip on the ball and can make the window tight throws.

See, given the footage then I think it's fair to say given what we've seen on camera/films/drills he's about in that tier with a Trevor Lawrence rather than a Joe Milton/Herbert/Caleb/Mahomes/Josh Allen/Zach Wilson/Anthony Richardson (honestly Joe Milton is probably his own tier).

Not a bad arms by any means, but not quite in that tier the throw velocity numbers indicate. The mph, especially with the NFL players doesn't quite have as much context: some of those numbers were during the pro day with players not as warmed up, not going as hard, etc. We also don't know how much Joe Milton was really putting into those throws because he can be chill with it sometimes.

I want to clarify that I don't think he has a noodle arm, but I do think it's closer to average vs what the speedometer indicates.

 

[Eye Cue DA COLI GAWD]

McCarthy never threw for 3000 yards.

Watson threw for 4000+ TWICE.

Watson has 90 career TDs passes

McCarthy has HALF THAT.

McCarthy was a system QB.

Watson was the system at Clemson.

This nikka just said Watson is his comp

 

[KingsnBucs1987]

See, given the footage then I think it's fair to say given what we've seen on camera/films/drills he's about in that tier with a Trevor Lawrence than a Joe Milton/Herbert/Caleb/Mahomes/Josh Allen/Zach Wilson.

Not a bad arms by any means, but not quite in that tier the throw velocity numbers indicate. The mph, especially with the NFL players doesn't quite have as much context: some of those numbers were during the pro day with players not as warmed up, not going as hard, etc. We also don't know how much Joe Milton was really putting into those throws because he can be chill with it sometimes.

Yeah I'd say he has the improv of Baker with the run through you of Josh Allen, not saying he's the same tier as Allen, but a tier below Josh Allen ain't bad cause Allen was raw when he came out of North Dakota.

 

[Braman]

Smart, IQ, cerebral, safe, winning pedigree….but can be every bit the gunslinger when needed. Even the cherry on top they both got hyperbolic co-signs from their coach.

So yep. Thats the comp

 

[Eye Cue DA COLI GAWD]

Smart, IQ, cerebral, safe, winning pedigree….but can be every bit the gunslinger when needed. Even the cherry on top they both got hyperbolic co-signs from their coach.

So yep. Thats the comp

He has never proven he can be a gunslinger on any level. He has three career 300+ yard games. Two came against Purdue and Indiana and the other was a LOSS against TCU

Even @Trust Me doesn't trust the sh*t you're saying right now

 

[Braman]

He has never proven he can be a gunslinger on any level. He has three career 300+ yard games. Two came against Purdue and Indiana and the other was a LOSS against TCU

Even @Trust Me doesn't trust the sh*t you're saying right now

Why do you keep bringing up game stats you do know that’s more a function of scheme and # of pass attempts right?? You do know that’s the whole point of bringing up yards per attempt right?

Also air yards per attempt give you an even greater snapshot of how capable he is of pushing the ball

Caleb: 10.3
Daniels: 13.7

Maye 8.7

Penix 9.2

Stroud 10.9

Deshaun Watson 8.0

McCarthy 9.8

None of McCarthy advanced numbers signal game manager. All signs point to he just so happened to play in a conservative system but when asked to turn up, he did. But keep bringing up game stats like a casual

 

[Braman]

Crossing Route McCarthy. No one does it better @Trust Me

One of the worst things you can say about a QB is ‘he can’t throw in the middle of the field’, yet now you’re minimizing that as ‘crossing route McCarthy ’