Lebron really looks old now

[jaydawg08]

Tbf there is a huge gap between winning the final or 3 peating with MJ Vs getting almost getting to the ECF without him.

Lebrons teams went from perennial contender to worst team in the NBA without him

MJs teams went from champion to contender without him

They are not the same

 

[Ukbrotha]

Lebrons teams went from perennial contender to worst team in the NBA without him

MJs teams went from champion to contender without him

They are not the same

Semis of the ECF is not a contender. Im not arguing for Bron or MJ but nearly getting to the ECF and winning a chip or 3 peat are leagues apart.

 

[lib123]

Prime Lebron was a better basketball player than prime MJ
bigger, faster, stronger, smarter

not his fault his competition was much better too

Prime LeBron was only bigger than Jordan and a better playmaker. Other than that, no. And even if LeBron’s competition was better, he also was surrounded by more talented teammates.

 

[Osmosis]

Thats what happens when you have a great coach that installs a system where players are put into position to play towards THEIR strengths and not simply put in position to play towards LEBRONS strengths.

The next season explains that it was a fluke season where they played above their heads. They gained Ron Harper but somehow went from a 50+ win team to under 500 at Allstar break? Making the argument that they "lost Horace Grant" is even more pathetic because that means you're arguing that a 1 time all star was a bigger loss than a 5/6 time MVP lol

Thats no different than the Grizzlies going 22-1 without Ja that one year with the difference being the Bulls were a veteran team led by a veteran coach that just won the championship the year before. Once that high of winning the season before and wanting to prove themselves without MJ wore off, they became a sub 500 team with their best player looking into a camera begging Jordan to come back...

Once again, deflecting to another season and desperately throwing Lebron's name out there. Of course Lebron's team wouldn't win the same number of games without him, he's far too important to the team. But guess what? No other all-time great could be replaced by a scrub named Pete Myers and watch their team contend without them. That was the perfect confluence of a stacked team and a shytty expansion diluted era. You're forced to refence another season and a different team to make your point. You know there's no defending the Bulls success in 1994 without MJ.

The Grizzlies played well without a young JA because they had a starting level PG off the bench to replace him. The Bulls didn't have a starting level SG without Jordan. But sure, that's the company you want to put the GOAT in so be it. A young JA Morant and MJ have the same impact on winning?

If you're going to use any other stat be sure to explain (in your own words) why someone making 42% of every FG they shot is not better than a person making 41% of every shot they took.

Oh and a 40 year old averaging more pts, assists, rebs, stls AND LESS TURNOVERS than a player smack dab in the middle of their prime is says it all. Yet you're trying to make the argument that Stack was better using a stat I know damn well you don't know how to explain without googling

Raw FG% is a relic that doesn't account for point value of the shot a player is taking (3s vs. 2s) or free throws. True shooting is the stat that most accurately measures efficiency. MJ was below league average in efficiency in both of those seasons and less efficient than a mediocre SG like Stackhouse.

I say MJ guarded TMac, Paul Pierce and Vince Carter and you show me Jamal Murray. And that same Jamal Murray averaged 32 6 and 5 that series like he was MJ himself


I said show me this year and you show me last year and for some reason think that's good defense Lebron was playing on Jokic where he missed a shot he usually makes, made another, and made two dumb mistakes that led to a charge call.


He aint guarding Ant? Tatum/Brown? You know, the next generation that we have video evidence of MJ doing? Im not even talking about being successful at it, Im talking about him taking the challenge to do it. Cant find it because he's too busy hiding so he conserve energy for offense so he can say "check the stats" when people point out how his stacked teams fall short time and time again..

You really are a simpleton

You think it's more impressive watching Lebron guard Jaylen Brown in a random regular season game than watching him bang in the post in the playoffs with the best player in the world that happens to be 3 inches taller than him and 35 pounds heavier?

 

[Road20]

Prime LeBron was only bigger than Jordan and a better playmaker. Other than that, no. And even if LeBron’s competition was better, he also was surrounded by more talented teammates.

False. Other than Wade which one of Bron teammates are you taking over a prime Pippen?

 

[lib123]

False. Other than Wade which one of Bron teammates are you taking over a prime Pippen?

The collective of Bron’s teammates were much better shooters than Jordan’s teammates. Those teammates provided way more spacing for Bron to operate. If you give Jordan that type of spacing with shooters in his prime he’s on another level.

 

[Osmosis]

Semis of the ECF is not a contender. Im not arguing for Bron or MJ but nearly getting to the ECF and winning a chip or 3 peat are leagues apart.

The 1993 Bulls won 58 games with an Armstrong/MJ/Pippen/Grant/Cartwright starting lineup.
The 1994 Bulls won 55 games with an Armstrong/Myers/Pippen/Grant/Cartwright starting lineup.

They won a playoff series and went 7 against the eventual conference champs (lost due to a blown call) with a scrub and a few role players off the bench replacing MJ. It's not like they traded MJ for a lesser or comparable all-star and achieved this success, they simply lost him a month before the season and were still one of the better teams in the league.

MJ had Scottie, a top 5-10 player in the league while Scottie had the same team MJ had MINUS the best player in the league. How are you gonna diminish their success when MJ had another all-NBA player with him and Scottie was dolo?

Quite frankly, they shouldn't have even been a .500 team. Take Jokic off the Nuggets, Giannis off the Bucks, Curry off the Warriors, and replace all of them with spare parts and you'd be hard pressed to see any of those teams make the playoffs let alone win upwards to 60 games, a playoff series, and nearly knock off the conference champs.

 

[Road20]

The collective of Bron’s teammates were much better shooters than Jordan’s teammates. Those teammates provided way more spacing for Bron to operate. If you give Jordan that type of spacing with shooters in his prime he’s on another level.

I agree but he did have shooters for that time in the NBA. He had Kerr, Pax and Craig. Plus the Triangle doesn't create a lot of three point opportunities.

 

[fifth column]

Prime Lebron was a better basketball player than prime MJ
bigger, faster, stronger, smarter

not his fault his competition was much better too

Stop the cap, LeBron is the cowardly Lion with little to no competitive spirit. All that running, jumping and minding the game but still getting stomped in the majority of his finals runs. Save the propaganda for y’all inner circle of blind witnesses

 

[Spliff]

It’s so haaaaaarrrddddd

To say goodbyyyyeeeeee


To yesterdaaaa aaaaaayy eeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee

 

[MooseMouthMthafuga]

This guy is like the Final Boss for the pro LeBron GOAT crowd.They should study his videos thoroughly.If y'all can defeat this mthfkka, y'all win the war

 

[fifth column]

Lebron was the dynasty

MJs team was a bad call away from going back to the ECF without him lol

It’d be like the Cavs still being elite and a 55 win team right after he left. Jordan never faced any elite finals competition, and lost consistently without the help of Pippen

Don’t care about the counting stats.. he’s 1-9 in the playoffs without his “Robin”. Lebron made it to the finals twice with an MIA 2nd fiddle

So with that Le-logic Bron is a Ray Allen 3 pointer, A Kyrie clutch 3 and a global pandemic from being 1-10 in the finals. The 1 finals he did win in 2012 came in a lockout year. Nasty

 

[Ukbrotha]

The 1993 Bulls won 58 games with an Armstrong/MJ/Pippen/Grant/Cartwright starting lineup.
The 1994 Bulls won 55 games with an Armstrong/Myers/Pippen/Grant/Cartwright starting lineup.

They won a playoff series and went 7 against the eventual conference champs (lost due to a blown call) with a scrub and a few role players off the bench replacing MJ. It's not like they traded MJ for a lesser or comparable all-star and achieved this success, they simply lost him a month before the season and were still one of the better teams in the league.

MJ had Scottie, a top 5-10 player in the league while Scottie had the same team MJ had MINUS the best player in the league. How are you gonna diminish their success when MJ had another all-NBA player with him and Scottie was dolo?

Quite frankly, they shouldn't have even been a .500 team. Take Jokic off the Nuggets, Giannis off the Bucks, Curry off the Warriors, and replace all of them with spare parts and you'd be hard pressed to see any of those teams make the playoffs let alone win upwards to 60 games, a playoff series, and nearly knock off the conference champs.

Saying getting to the semis of the ECF is not comparable to winning a title/3 peat is not diminishing anyone. That Bulls team was good and they were obviously well coached. But let's not act like winning a chip especially a 3peat is in the same realm as getting to the ECF semis. its not in the same league.

 

[lib123]

I agree but he did have shooters for that time in the NBA. He had Kerr, Pax and Craig. Plus the Triangle doesn't create a lot of three point opportunities.

Jordan still never had as many shooters on the court with him at the same time. That makes a big difference.

 

[Osmosis]

Saying getting to the semis of the ECF is not comparable to winning a title/3 peat is not diminishing anyone. That Bulls team was good and they were obviously well coached. But let's not act like winning a chip especially a 3peat is in the same realm as getting to the ECF semis. its not in the same league.

So you expect a team to lose their star player, receive zero value back, and win a championship? Would you have expected the Bulls to win in 1993 if Scottie was released a month before the season?

Of course they're not the same. The point is that the Bulls were legitimate championship contenders with bench talent replacing the best player in the league. That indicates either A. The league is really weak or B. The team is really strong.

In this case, it's both.