steph_harden
Superstar
Not prime Bron
That was post prime Bron. Where he could only play defense in stretches. In his Heatle era he was a first team all defense, DPOY candidate level.
Tatum never played against that guy
Is Jayson Tatum really THAT much better than Jaylen Brown?
- Thread starter Po pimp
- Start date
Not prime Bron
That was post prime Bron. Where he could only play defense in stretches. In his Heatle era he was a first team all defense, DPOY candidate level.
Tatum never played against that guy
UpAndComing
Veteran
Not prime Bron
That was post prime Bron. Where he could only play defense in stretches. In his Heatle era he was a first team all defense, DPOY candidate level.
Tatum never played against that guy
2018 is prime Lebron
Just admit you're a casual fan
GOAT
The bubble was fraudulent
1. Oh okay, so they both conveniently fell off a cliff defensively right before JT torched them
Doesn’t change the fact that JT torches athletic wing defenders with regularity.
2. I said he’s a plus NBA athlete. He absolutely does have great speed/explosiveness. Which he routinely uses to blow by defenders on the wing and posterize bigs at the rim. He’s significantly more explosive than Booker, who you inserted into this discussion for some reason.
3. Okay cool, so just say you don’t watch/count anything other than the Finals. Don’t make shyt up and say he struggles against players he’s torched routinely throughout his career
4. You’re the one who brought Booker into this and claimed he “has no issue” with the Warriors while JT struggles. The numbers don’t bear that out. Don’t make shyt up if you don’t want to be fact checked
steph_harden
Superstar
The irony.
Lebron was 34 years old in 2018. As amazing as he was that was not his prime. Did you see him play by chance when he was with the Heat? Did you see his 2012 and 2013 seasons?
Did you know that he finished 2nd in DPOY voting for 3 out of 4 years? Anchored an elite defense?
If you think that Lebron and 2018 Lebron are the same guy then imma need you to admit your casual status first.
UpAndComing
Veteran
The irony.
Lebron was 34 years old in 2018. As amazing as he was that was not his prime. Did you see him play by chance when he was with the Heat? Did you see his 2012 and 2013 seasons?
Did you know that he finished 2nd in DPOY voting for 3 out of 4 years? Anchored an elite defense?
If you think that Lebron and 2018 Lebron are the same guy then imma need you to admit your casual status first.
Micheal Jordan was 35 years old when he won his 6th championship and was a NBA Finals MVP
Any more baseless comments casual?
Devil Plisken…CMS
Veteran
Mike’s peak was like 91-93 tho
steph_harden
Superstar
1. Oh okay, so they both conveniently fell off a cliff defensively right before JT torched them
Unfortunately...yes.
That's all relative to other nba athletes. For instance his JB his own teammate is an example of an elite athlete...and he's a lot faster/explosive than Tatum is. Tatum just isn't on that tier. He's a good athlete but he's not blowing by guys like he's Donovan Mitchell. It's his combination of size, skill, shooting, strength, footwork and mobility that makes him who he is. His biggest comp was Paul George but would you say he's a better athlete than a 24 year old PG? I don't think you would.
lol at you wanting to put more stock into meaningless regular season games than a championship basketball series. Wonder why Tatum couldn't replicate that 40 piece on Wiggins with a championship on the line...3. Okay cool, so just say you don’t watch/count anything other than the Finals. Don’t make shyt up and say he struggles against players he’s torched routinely throughout his career
steph_harden
Superstar
Does that mean he was prime Michael Jordan?
No he wasn't....stop digging this hole and making yourself look dumb breh. That was literally the worst statistical season of his career
GOAT
The bubble was fraudulent
Now you're moving the goal post. First he's not athletic enough to get by defenders, now he's not as athletic as Donovan Mitchell, Paul George or Jaylen Brown. Sure, he isn't in the top 1% of NBA athletes, but he's still blowing by dudes with his first step and dunking over bigs with his explosiveness. His athleticism has never inhibited him at any point in his career like you suggested. It's an advantage for him.Okay, cool. So nothing matters but the NBA Finals. Your evaluation of JT as a player is strictly based on those 6 games. Just say that. That is awful, casual ass logic, but okay. That's like evaluating Bron strictly off the '11 Finals, or Kobe off the '04 Finals. Great players have had bad series "with a championship on the line" since the beginning of time. Especially young players.
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steph_harden
Superstar
Okay, cool. So nothing matters but the NBA Finals. Your evaluation of JT as a player is strictly based on those 6 games. Just say that. That is awful, casual ass logic, but okay. That's like evaluating Bron strictly off the '11 Finals, or Kobe off the '04 Finals. Great players have had bad series "with a championship on the line" since the beginning of time. Especially young players.
Never said that. I said he was not particularly explosive or athletic…which he isn’t. Doesn’t mean he isn’t a good athlete at all…because he is but when I list guys like Mitchell, JB and PG those guys are examples of “particularly explosive and athletic players” And Tatum is clearly not in that tier. That’s all I meant. You’re twisting things like I’m saying Tatum isn’t athletic at all.
And seeing as you watch Tatum all the time and I’m the casual then you would know that he doesn’t really rely on his athleticism to get buckets. He uses a combination of his size, mobility and skill. He’s not going over the top of nikkas like Ja Morant.
Those 6 finals games>>>>>>any regular season matchups. Sure they matter but are insignificant compared to an NBA Finals series…seems like that regular season 40 piece has more meaning to you than what Tatum did in the finals…
Kobe caught heat in 04 but he was already a 3 time champ. He already did it on the highest level . Bron caught the most amount of vitriol ever given to a player after 11 he basically had to come back and prove himself all over again. He fell apart in the finals because he got schemed out…not because of a particular defensive matchup like Tatum
GOAT
The bubble was fraudulent
You most definitely suggested he struggles to beat defenders off the dribble because of lack of athleticism. Don't try to flip it now. Again, he absolutely blows by defenders and gets to the rim at well. This is literally not even disputable, the numbers back it up.Me watching Tatum all the time is EXACTLY why I know the athleticism argument is casual nonsense. He doesn't "rely" on athleticism but he absolutely benefits from it on drives and finishes at the rim. Which like I said, he's statistically elite in those categories. He's finished over the top of bigs throughout his entire career. Dude catches bodies more regularly than most superstars.
Okay cool, so your argument is no basketball JT has played matters outside of those 6 Finals game. Got it. That's a stupid argument, but I'm glad you're taking ownership over it. That "regular season 40 piece" was one of MANY performances of the like. I'm not even kidding when I say it might not even be a top 20 game of his career. He's dominated games in that fashion many times, often against great defensive/athletic teams.
Kobe also played pretty poorly (by his standards) in the '00 and '01 Finals. I was just using that as one of the many examples of a great player having a bad Finals series. Bird in the '81 Finals, Magic in the '84 Finals, Steph in the '16 Finals, Bron in the '07 Finals, etc. People criticized Bron for his performance in '11 (and they criticized JT as well) but nobody with any knowledge of the NBA said that those games defined who he was as a player. It was a player playing well below his standards, just like JT.
Now I know you didn't watch those NBA Finals. The Warriors absolutely schemed their whole defense around stopping JT. Packed the paint and converged on him with multiple defenders when he put the ball on the floor. And even still, JT's biggest issues were he wasn't finishing at the rim like he normally does (broken wrist played a part in that) and he wasn't making the right reads/turned the ball over when the help came. Not because Wiggins took him out of the game by himself.
mastermind
Rest In Power Kobe
