Intermittent Fasting is by far most overrated fad in the fitness community right now

[TRBM]

One of the Hodge twins take your main.....mane?

 

[TLR Is Mental Poison]

Supporters of IF in this thread went from, "Intermittent Fasting burns more fat than any other dieting protocol" to "hey man it works for me." But I'm back peddling?

Sigh....

Spliff didnt backpedal, I didnt backpedal, nobody else really engaged you

Bad day at work? Stress at home? Where the fukk is this coming from?

 

[dj-method-x]

Spliff didnt backpedal, I didnt backpedal, nobody else really engaged you

Bad day at work? Stress at home? Where the fukk is this coming from?

Nah, I honestly just need to get to 50 posts so I can download stuff from big business's profile, and figured that arguing with IF zealots would help me get my posts up.



For those who think that IF is good for bulking I cede to Dr. Layne Norton

“One problem with IF for people who are looking to optimize muscle mass is that fasting decreases protein synthesis significantly and you cannot simply make up for a lack of protein throughout the day by overconsuming it at a few others. There is a cap on the effective dose of protein to stimulate muscle anabolism and above that you are really getting no added benefit. One of the experiments we did for my PhD thesis (which we are currently in the process of attempting to publish) actually examined protein distribution and found exactly what we suspected… that eating low protein early in the day could not be made up for by eating a very large protein meal later in the day. After 11 weeks the subjects eating unevenly distributed protein intake actually had smaller muscles than subjects fed relatively equal doses of protein. ”

 

[Carolina Slim]

I figured this nikka wasn't THAT serious about it, when nobody here is really on that "IF IS THE HOLY GRAIL". From what I've seen, most nikkas (myself included) is like "hey, it works for me... "

 

[Spliff]

Did you even read what the paper said? Did you even read what Martin said about it? He pointed out that the paper did not mention what kind of exercise was used in the different groups. Even HE (the man who brought IF to popularity) says that that is a major weakness of that paper and it's conclusion.

Even Martin Berkham knows that study is useless. There is not a credible figure in the fitness community that will agree that Intermittent Fasting allows for more fat to be burned in comparison to good old regular calorie restriction except for people who are trying to get paid pimping IF, like Martin Berkham. Why is this? Because the science jury is still out on IF.

Useless?

The path of research often goes from generalized to specific. It's bad enough bodybuilding is rarely studied in the context of fit individuals with proper resistance training. Tossing in intermittent fasting only lessens relevant research.

You said "calories in vs calories out" will result in equal fat loss in the context of identical caloric deficits. I said that statement couldn't be argued had you have said "weight" in the place of "fat," but that wasn't the case. If we both set the same deficit and both lost 10 pounds, the ratio of fat:lean-mass lost can vary depending on how we went about it. The better fat utilization, the better lean mass retention. This is what I mean when I suggest IF may have superior fat loss abilities. I briefly glanced over why the best IF protocols can have a physiological advantage to fat loss versus eating throughout the day. You have to understand how fat is mobilized, transported, and oxidized, as well as understand how adrenoreceptors greatly affects these processes, to see how IF can have an advantage. Here's 101 pages on exactly that. among other aspects.

After all that, you wanted a study that supports what I initially said about the possible differences in fat loss. Is it perfect? Of course not, few are. This is expected in the current state of increasing interest of intermittent fasting for body composition in lean individuals. It's very suggestive though, and will certainly lead into more specific/relevant research.

The theoretical understandings are there, the anecdotal evidences are there, the suggestive researches are there. Only thing left is definitive studies to put an end to speculation. At this time you either hold belief future studies will boast IF advantages, or believe future studies will show no difference. Credible figures want to remain credible (translation: unbiased) and will always wait for definitive research before speaking in exacts. It's just a waiting game now.

Again, none of this matters outside of approaching extreme leanness.

Alan Aragon also breaks down multiple studies on IF and why most of them are crud.

An Objective Look at Intermittent Fasting - AlanAragon.com - Fitness Based on Science & Experience

Alan Aragon pretty much sums up my response to your last statement perfectly.

Alan loosened up on his IF stance since 2007. He acknowledges IF's ability to excel at retaining muscle mass during a deficit.

Spoiler

2010

My thoughts in IF, briefly, are that it's a highly understudied area.

The more research I review, the more I've come to find out how well-adapted the human species is to prolonged periods of zero food. There are several variants of IF, some are less conducive to typical recomp goals than others. I have come to appreciate many of the virtues of the incarnation of IF that Martin Berkhan has developed. In the past I have been highly critical of lower meal frequency, but much of that was a product of being stuck in the dogma of the mainstream curriculum. None of the 'stoking of the metabolic fire' stuff has been solidly supported by research. Now, whether IF has any *special* effects remains anecdotal. I will concede that I was incorrect about my former negatively slanted stance towards IF.

Alan Aragon On Intermittent Fasting | Intermittent fasting diet for fat loss, muscle gain and health

Spoiler

2012

At the same time that IF has vindicated science, it also created its own over-zealous following who preaches its universal necessity for optimizing body composition and health. Viewed more objectively, IF presents an effective option for those who prefer the convenience and luxury of larger meals – not to mention, less preparation & transportation of meals through the day. Any special or superior metabolic effects of IF compared to conventional meal patterns are speculative at this point. While IF has consistently shined in the department of lean mass retention while dieting, its comparison to conventional meal frequency on gains in muscular strength & hypertrophy is uncharted ground, at least in formal research. There are plenty of hypotheses flying around this area, but nothing demonstrated under controlled conditions. For the time being, meal frequency for optimal size & strength gain remains mysterious. This mystery is likely to begin unfolding with short-term data that one camp will excitedly embrace. If history means anything, the acute data will be followed by long-term data that shakes the confidence in former beliefs. Either way it goes, I’ve got my popcorn ready.

workout911.com » Interview with Nutrition Expert Alan Aragon

Nah, I honestly just need to get to 50 posts so I can download stuff from big business's profile, and figured that arguing with IF zealots would help me get my posts up.

*exits thread*

 

[semtex]

OP is a phaggot

 

[The_King_of_Everything]

Works for me
I'm in the best shape of my life

Op your a fakkit

 

[krackdagawd]

 

[dj-method-x]

Checkmate:

From Martin Berkhan, author of leangains.com

It's very important to understand this:

Leangains drove the popularity of intermittent fasting, not the other way around. An "intermittent fasting diet" is just an easy way to characterise an approach that includes several other distinct characteristics that make Leangains into what it is.

Leangains is also an approach formed by the correct use of scientific research, based on context specific human studies of acceptable validity, with the understanding that the practical application, and the outcome thereof, remains theoretical - e.g. we cannot say for certain how much of a difference intermittent fasting really does.

In fact, I couldn't care less about intermittent fasting if it wasn't for the fact that it's the superior decision for diet compliance. For me, it happened to be the magic bullet, just like it's been proven to be for many others.

The Leangains story is perhaps best summarized by Sam Fuller. Fundamentally, Leangains is just another strategy that allowed me to have the cake, and eat it - and so it happened to be for many others.

But to cling to intermittent fasting, or to hop on the fasting bandwagon and fast for 16+ hours with the naive expectation of a magic trick - to willingly fast for fasting in itself, even if it's not really for you - is very foolish.

Remember. That's what people did in the mid-2000's - what we all did. We subjected us to rules that proved to be incompatible with long-term success, balance in life, and peace of mind. The role I played was in opening up your eyes to the alternative - to give you more options, and improve your decision making skills on dietary aspects that are of critical importance (i.e. the choice of meal frequency).

Back then, we ate every 2-3rd hour for the sake of eating every 2-3rd hours, we ate breakfast for the sake of eating breakfast, and we didn't eat much in the evening. But now, I see this might be happening again - in reverse.

See, now everyone's riding the fasting bandwagon. Perhaps best exemplified by the "The 8-Hour Diet", this the result of a marketing engine fueled by false promises, bull****tery and the disingenous make believe-science that impresses the lay man, pleases the crowds, and disgusts the one who sees right through it.

This is what corrodes this industry. This is what keeps people confused. This is what obfuscates success, and makes you forget the critical importance of personal preferences - not slavery under rules that doesn't really make sense for you.

full story, he's quitting the industry
Consequence and Clarity | Intermittent fasting diet for fat loss, muscle gain and health

 

[jalamanta]

Checkmate:

From Martin Berkhan, author of leangains.com



full story, he's quitting the industry
Consequence and Clarity | Intermittent fasting diet for fat loss, muscle gain and health

so much bullshyt, articles, countless forum topics, placebo reports

and now tha Gawd himself claims he doesn't exist

everything is a gimmick nowadays

he milked a lot of money from his clients though

 

[Tha Snowman]

I'm not condoning fasting or speaking against it. However, your body does change in response to periods of low/no caloric intake. Especially over time. Gene expression changes. Some get turned on, others off. My point being, your body changes the way certain biochemical pathways work in response to how and when you eat. It's entirely possible fasting is good for some people.

One thing that has been proven, unequivocally in animal studies, is that caloric restriction lengthens lifespan. This is separate from the inherent benefits of maintaining an ideal weight. The aging process actually slows down.

 

[Carolina Slim]

Checkmate:

From Martin Berkhan, author of leangains.com



full story, he's quitting the industry
Consequence and Clarity | Intermittent fasting diet for fat loss, muscle gain and health

How is this checkmate? Basically what I got from this was that he was tired of nikkas using his material to put together their own ideas and ...

Unless you've been living under a rock for the last few years, you've probably seen the explosive growth of interest in fasting/intermittent fasting type diets, along with its poorly written Leangains ripoffs. "Ripoff" is the understatement of the century.The 8-Hour Diet is the latest abomination, and it's no doubt the most impressive thus far. Impressive only due to the sheer idiocy and the sizeable marketing engine that drives it. If my advice is worth anything to you, I'd tell you to stay the Hell away from it. Many won't - and that's the problem. Bad PR is good PR in this wretched industry.

They say that imitation is the sincerest form of flattery. I can't say that I agree. I don't want to be part of this circus. Actually, I think it's downright insulting when people expect me to be excited about it. It suggests that people have an ass backwards understanding of my values, my principles and my character. I can take a lot of shyt and still remain unfazed by it. But when I get lumped together with the inferior and the fake, that's when I say 'fukk it.'

Still. The 8-Hour Diet is just a drop in the ocean and it's hardly the cause of any real grief on my part. It takes a lot more than the fad diet treatment of fasting to piss me off. It takes...Well. I guess this is where I run into problems. The 'explaining' part.

If he's against the concept, why did he endorse Brad Pilon's latest edition of Eat Stop Eat?

In fact, Brad Pilon's book is quite possibly the best ebook across the board when it comes to metabolic/physiological theory, i.e. he covers these quite well and doesn't make shyt up.

Eat Stop Eat Expanded 5th Edition is still a good book, heavily referenced, and remains a rarity in an industry where the standard is shyt. My standards seems to be different, but this is still one of the few books I can recommend with a straight face. I would never recommend a product or compromise my integrity by promoting something that I considered to be of poor quality.

 

[The_King_of_Everything]

Still fasting still makin gains you still mad

 

[dj-method-x]

How is this checkmate? Basically what I got from this was that he was tired of nikkas using his material to put together their own ideas and ...

If he's against the concept, why did he endorse Brad Pilon's latest edition of Eat Stop Eat?

did u even attempt to read the part I quoted and bolded, or do you still have your blinders on?

The point of this thread was to say that IF is overrated and is no magic bullet. Martin Berkhan, the man responsible for IF's popularity comes out an says the EXACT SAME THING verbatim and y'all still arguing with me. IF zealots are almost as bad as paleo zealots at this point .

 

[dj-method-x]

Still fasting still makin gains you still mad

u can make gains doing all kinds of stupid shyt as long as your net calorie balance is aligned with whatever your goal is (ie gaining or losing)