illmatic: lyrical masterpiece or fraud?

[JayBaldacci]

hate now came after iww

nas changed his whole style after illmatic

The change was graduall and for the better. Nas going by escobar by early 95, on deja vu, eye for an eye, etc. This was before the purple tape dropped. He was even featured on g raps album. Nas was always an originator in the mafioso movement. On top of that, a lot of iww wasn't even mafioso, just regular hood shyt misunderstood.(street dreams being the main one). Nas escobar is basically a more focused nasty nas.

 

[intilectual recipricol]

But, based on what you're writing, you don't understand the lyrics. I get how you would think its garbage - but its because you don't understand what he's saying.

theres nothing to not get, its just incoherent...

there's no cohesiveness to it... so one line he's talkin about how he smokin, the next bar is totally unrelated talkin about how he blasted a bish...

I understand the first bar is about smokin and the second bar is about blastin a bish... but WTF is he tryin to get across? its incoherent rambling.

If I put on a Twista track.... Feels So Good... the first bar is related to the second is related to the third, is related to the fourth and so on... thus its coherent, the shyt makes sense together.

if I put on Lu's Failure there is no over riding theme of the song, segments of verse are related to each other, but it is overall incoherent, but the nicca flexed his exceptional wordplay... displayin LYRICISM

naS took the worst of both worlds and spit non lyrical incoherent bullshyt... if you disagree then show me where you were awed by that niccaz lyrical prowess. Show me where he was flexin his talent for wordplay... show me where he was using exquisite metaphors... show me where he had a great multi syllabic rhyme scheme... where is this lyricism people are talkin about?

 

[intilectual recipricol]

naS took the worst of both worlds and spit non lyrical incoherent bullshyt... if you disagree then show me where you were awed by that niccaz lyrical prowess. Show me where he was flexin his talent for wordplay... show me where he was using exquisite metaphors... show me where he had a great multi syllabic rhyme scheme... where is this lyricism people are talkin about?

and show me how its somethin that other niccaz werent doing then, let alone infinitely better today.

 

[blackslash]

Thread of the year

 

[The_Third_Man]

Pac calls naS a weak rapper

Nas - VH1 Behind the Music 2pac Part - YouTube

ok?
that has nothing to do with the fact that Nas is actually your favorite rapper's favorite rapper ever.

 

[up in here]

theres nothing to not get, its just incoherent...

there's no cohesiveness to it... so one line he's talkin about how he smokin, the next bar is totally unrelated talkin about how he blasted a bish...

I understand the first bar is about smokin and the second bar is about blastin a bish... but WTF is he tryin to get across? its incoherent rambling.

If I put on a Twista track.... Feels So Good... the first bar is related to the second is related to the third, is related to the fourth and so on... thus its coherent, the shyt makes sense together.

if I put on Lu's Failure there is no over riding theme of the song, segments of verse are related to each other, but it is overall incoherent, but the nicca flexed his exceptional wordplay... displayin LYRICISM

naS took the worst of both worlds and spit non lyrical incoherent bullshyt... if you disagree then show me where you were awed by that niccaz lyrical prowess. Show me where he was flexin his talent for wordplay... show me where he was using exquisite metaphors... show me where he had a great multi syllabic rhyme scheme... where is this lyricism people are talkin about?

to be clear, illmatic is not a set of narratives (outside of one love) it is a set of reflections. it doesn't follow stories, it follows themes. thats why you dont understand his rhymes, because you are expecting him to tell you stories with a start, middle and end, and a chronological flow, but illmatic is something different altogether and you cant seem to grasp that concept. thats what makes it so special, its like sitting with someone and they are sharing their inner most thoughts with you, offering their memories, reflections on day to day, comments of society in general, aspirations. its not contrived or concern with being catchy or fitting an image or following convention or being purposefully abstract or having all the answers, its just a raw honest reflection on his own life, offering his perspective. and each track carries a coherent theme representing a state of mind.


i never really believed that he was so far over peoples heads that they really couldn't follow what he was saying, i always thought he was kinda straight forward and folks could easily catch the theme/picture that he was painting, even if they didn't like it, it never crossed my mind that anyone would need his rhymes spelled out for them. but you have proved me wrong. to call it incoherent really just shows that you have a hard time comprehending basic themes.

 

[intilectual recipricol]

to be clear, illmatic is not a set of narratives (outside of one love) it is a set of reflections. it doesn't follow stories, it follows themes. thats why you dont understand his rhymes, because you are expecting him to tell you stories with a start, middle and end, and a chronological flow, but illmatic is something different altogether and you cant seem to grasp that concept. thats what makes it so special, its like sitting with someone and they are sharing their inner most thoughts with you, offering their memories, reflections on day to day, comments of society in general, aspirations. its not contrived or concern with being catchy or fitting an image or following convention or being purposefully abstract or having all the answers, its just a raw honest reflection on his own life, offering his perspective. and each track carries a coherent theme representing a state of mind.


i never really believed that he was so far over peoples heads that they really couldn't follow what he was saying, i always thought he was kinda straight forward and folks could easily catch the theme/picture that he was painting, even if they didn't like it, it never crossed my mind that anyone would need his rhymes spelled out for them. but you have proved me wrong. to call it incoherent really just shows that you have a hard time comprehending basic themes.

You basically said the album is not lyrical. Thank you. That was the point. I always said he was straight forward like Pac, nothing clever or cryptic in his bars. Maybe some imagery and metaphors here and there but nothing else. Pac did that. My argument is that naS IS NOT A LYRICIST like a Common, 3000, or Lupe is, like people hype him up to be.

but let me bust down your weak ass post. You say the album is a set of reflections so when naS picked up the mack and made a nicca back flip in his lyrics he was being reflective? And when in the same 'story' there were some children in the lobby "probably" he didnt just add "probably" in there to make it rhyme better? ie just to match?

So when he goes from talking about getting airplay in one line to drinin erk in the stairway in the next line, he's not being incoherent? Nicca you dumb as a rock.

Funny thing is your mark ass is just sayin what I said, except you that I said it. You admittin these songs arent coherent stories, and that the lines dont even go with each other. Ask yourself what that means, if they dont go with each other....

definition of incoherent: (of a person) Unable to speak intelligibly.
Synonyms
disjointed - rambling - desultory - disconnected

That described those verses perfectly... disjointed - rambling - disconnected


so again, when naS said he made that nicca back flip wit the mack, what was he reflectin on? Smart dumb nicca

 

[Dusty Bake Activate]

@intilectual recipricol when you create a thread and have 35 posts in it, most of them are long ass essays, and the thread still has a 2 star rating, it's time to walk away.

 

[intilectual recipricol]

@intilectual recipricol when you create a thread and have 35 posts in it, most of them are long ass essays, and the thread still has a 2 star rating, it's time to walk away.

I know you dumb niccaz cant read, but most if those "essays" are the dumb ass naS lyrics...

 

[Dusty Bake Activate]

I know you dumb niccaz cant read, but most if those "essays" are the dumb ass naS lyrics...

I haven't read one of your posts in this thread and don't plan to. Your stance is simply not respectable. It's like making a thread called "1996 Chicago Bulls: all time great team or fraud?" That's why your thread still has a 2 star rating. It's time to let it go.

 

[intilectual recipricol]

I haven't read one of your posts in this thread and don't plan to. Your stance is simply not respectable. It's like making a thread called "1996 Chicago Bulls: all time great team or fraud?" That's why your thread still has a 2 star rating. It's time to let it go.

see this is for morons like you who think illmatic is the 96 Bulls... The 96 Bulls werent garbage. illmatic is.

The lyrics prove it. But you already admitted youre a dikkrider that is posting in the thread, but not reading. Why are you posting?

 

[DStyles]

This legendary thread has a 2* rating because of the naus stans coalition.


I remember back in 2004 I got banned from a hip hop forum which was created by a naus stan for saying SD was just as wack as BP2

 

[Alexander Wiggin]

Let's say hehe lyrics are wacky, so are the beats and the flow to you?

 

[Dusty Bake Activate]

The op was green before he made this thread. Now he's red.

 

[up in here]

You basically said the album is not lyrical. Thank you. That was the point. I always said he was straight forward like Pac, nothing clever or cryptic in his bars. Maybe some imagery and metaphors here and there but nothing else. Pac did that. My argument is that naS IS NOT A LYRICIST like a Common, 3000, or Lupe is, like people hype him up to be.

but let me bust down your weak ass post. You say the album is a set of reflections so when naS picked up the mack and made a nicca back flip in his lyrics he was being reflective? And when in the same 'story' there were some children in the lobby "probably" he didnt just add "probably" in there to make it rhyme better? ie just to match?

So when he goes from talking about getting airplay in one line to drinin erk in the stairway in the next line, he's not being incoherent? Nicca you dumb as a rock.

Funny thing is your mark ass is just sayin what I said, except you that I said it. You admittin these songs arent coherent stories, and that the lines dont even go with each other. Ask yourself what that means, if they dont go with each other....

definition of incoherent: (of a person) Unable to speak intelligibly.
Synonyms
disjointed - rambling - desultory - disconnected

That described those verses perfectly... disjointed - rambling - disconnected


so again, when naS said he made that nicca back flip wit the mack, what was he reflectin on? Smart dumb nicca

firstly, Common is very straight forward too. he i my favorite rapper and one of his strongest points is his directness. secondly, nas, pac and common all have the ability to be poetic, which is a far greater lyrical feat than just having multi's, punchlines or wordplay.

as far as NY State Of Mind, it contains narrative instances but it doesn't follow a narrative/storyline it follows a theme, and the theme is the state of mind, which everything relates back to. how dense are you son? its even in the song title to make it all the more clear. everything is coherently related back to the theme, thats how the lines are connected.

Definition of POETIC : having or expressing the qualities of poetry (as though aesthetic or emotional impact) <her poetic beauty>

Definition of POETRY : writing that formulates a concentrated imaginative awareness of experience in language chosen and arranged to create a specific emotional response through meaning, sound, and rhythm

Definition of POEM : something suggesting a poem (as in expressiveness, lyricism, or formal grace)