Idris Elba Drags Samuel Jackson For Attempting To Divide Black Actors

[David_TheMan]

they arent better is the point. americans are just as classically trained as brits are. you have people from all over the world going to usc school of theater, julliard and yale. and yet you have cats in this thread going "they cant do accents so theyre worse actors" as if will smith doing a poor south african accent speaks for all actors in the united states

Yet they never hold Brit actors to the same standard, disqualifying all of them if one british star does a poor accent in a movie.

I articulated my point very clearly: around the turn of the century Tyler Perry was HUGE so were those "My Momma said Don't Date bad men" plays around that time <<<FACTS.

My theory (I put that in all caps for a reason) is that the explosion in popularity of those plays and that culture, affected the culture of black american actors.

an 18/19 year old around that time is probably not going to juliard or NYU when they can just do some traveling church plays and get $$$

in fact, the creator of the play TOP DOG/UNDERDOG criticized the rise of these types of plays in black culture when i was in college....

so I didn't see any "LIST" you made in this thread, but I did see the New Edition Story (loved it), I see EMPIRE, if you want to argue that those actors are on the same level as John Boyega go right ahead

Tyler perry was successful with his string of community theater.
Tyler Perry's plays affected black american acting culture? There is literally no support for that contention at all.
Why would an 18/19 year old forgoe juliard, Tyler Perry didn't make Juliard or Yale irrelvant. Also you don't need to go to Juliard or NYU or USC to get acting training.
The creator of a play criticizing Tyler Perry or black community theater, means nothing in the grand scheme of things, just like Spike Lee criticizing them as well.
If you want to participate in a thread read the posts, as for New Edition Story and Empire they have classically trained actors in those tv movies and shows.

That said your argument is extremely flawed in that you have a premise that you claim is true without offering a shred of concrete support for, and the support you do add is based on personal annecdotes speaking of a specific person, and not of the state of acting or training in the US for actors, let alone the avenues of training for black actors in the US, which you seem to think is limited to NYU or Juliard.

 

[Booker T Garvey]

No and I've never said as much.
I literally have said repeatedly its a money issue, brits or all races are willing to take less than SAG allows US actors to take

question: was jordan peele wrong for casting a brit lead to play an american in GET OUT? should he have cast an african american? yes or no please.

 

[Booker T Garvey]

Tyler perry was successful with his string of community theater.
Tyler Perry's plays affected black american acting culture? There is literally no support for that contention at all..

that's why it's called a THEORY.


also the words juliard or NYU haven't come from my at all in this thread. yet you lecture me on reading through the forum? stop it.

no wonder your negs are in the -1K...you do know you only get docked 10 points per neg right? jeez.

 

[parallax]

well, you have black people working in hollywood that clearly disagree.

was Ava Duverney wrong for casting David Oyewelo (a brit) as DR KING? a yes or no will do.

she could cast whoever she likes, but it still doesnt denote that one group of actors is better. and you can bring out all the random sources you like, but unless said director or actor has scoured the us to prove said theory, thats all it is.

 

[David_TheMan]

question: was jordan peele wrong for casting a brit lead to play an american in GET OUT? should he have cast an african american? yes or no please.

Jordan Peele isn't wrong for casting whoever he wants.
That said you are trying to shift the goalpost, from us saying your attack on black actors as being untrained is incorrect and divorced from reality, to now trying to talk about if it is right or wrong for Peele to cast someone who is british.
Again try to stay on the subject that is being discussed.
And again you have refused to answer my question.
Why do you insist on talking down and presenting black americans as inferior and untrained, when that clearly isn't true?

 

[Booker T Garvey]

she could cast whoever she likes

Jordan Peele isn't wrong for casting whoever he wants.

ah, finally. people addressing black directors casting black brits to play african americans...it was like pulling teeth.

and blindly shouting "they're trained in theater!" doesn't mean shyt

here you two go...white people saying it, you'll understand it better now:

http://avanthropology.blogspot.com/2010/06/on-acting-classical-v-method-or-how-we.html

British actors are just better at pretending

UK vs US: how is drama training different?

 

[David_TheMan]

that's why it's called a THEORY.


also the words juliard or NYU haven't come from my at all in this thread. yet you lecture me on reading through the forum? stop it.

no wonder your negs are in the -1K...you do know you only get docked 10 points per neg right? jeez.

You do know that if you present a theory, it is perfectly acceptable to evaluate said theory and test it to show if it holds up to scrutiny or not.

You literally wrote this

I articulated my point very clearly: around the turn of the century Tyler Perry was HUGE so were those "My Momma said Don't Date bad men" traveling plays around that time <<<FACTS.

My theory (I put that in all caps for a reason) is that the explosion in popularity of those plays and that culture, affected the culture of black american actors.

an 18/19 year old around that time is probably not going to juliard or NYU when they can just do some traveling church plays and get $$$

in fact, the creator of the play TOP DOG/UNDERDOG criticized the rise of these types of plays in black culture when i was in college (look it up, fact check me)....

so I didn't see any "LIST" you made in this thread, but I did see the New Edition Story (loved it), I see EMPIRE, if you want to argue that those actors are on the same level as John Boyega go right ahead

So why claim you didn't mention juliard or NYU when you clearly did?
If your claim is that these are the only schools we have mentioned you would be wrong as well, so what game or you trying to run?
Then you finish it off with another attempt at deflection at attacking me, rather than supporting your own argument.

 

[Booker T Garvey]

You do know that if you present a theory, it is perfectly acceptable to evaluate said theory and test it to show if it holds up to scrutiny or not.

You literally wrote this


So why claim you didn't mention juliard or NYU when you clearly did?
If your claim is that these are the only schools we have mentioned you would be wrong as well, so what game or you trying to run?
Then you finish it off with another attempt at deflection at attacking me, rather than supporting your own argument.

I did mention those schools I stand corrected but it was to illustrate my point

and yes, debunk my theory but not by saying "oh that's just ignorant!!"

you don't think tyler perry's success had ANY impact on african american theater? actors? NONE!?!

brittish actors tend to be classically trained, I can tell you now that chitlin circuit actors have not

all of those actors tyler perry brought in hollywood are chitlin trained actors...are they not!?!

 

[parallax]

ah, finally. people addressing black directors casting black brits to play african americans...it was like pulling teeth.

and blindly shouting "they're trained in theater!" doesn't mean shyt

here you two go...white people saying it, you'll understand it better now:

http://avanthropology.blogspot.com/2010/06/on-acting-classical-v-method-or-how-we.html

British actors are just better at pretending



UK vs US: how is drama training different?

the problem comes from the blind mention that british actors are better, not black directors hiring british talent. and even in that article you posted, you have someone thats been on this side of the pond picking it apart.

 

[David_TheMan]

ah, finally. people addressing black directors casting black brits to play african americans...it was like pulling teeth.

and blindly shouting "they're trained in theater!" doesn't mean shyt

here you two go...white people saying it, you'll understand it better now:

http://avanthropology.blogspot.com/2010/06/on-acting-classical-v-method-or-how-we.html

British actors are just better at pretending



UK vs US: how is drama training different?

You are presenting a strawman, none of us Black Americans never said there was anything wrong with black directors or white directors casting black brits.
You have created an argument out of thin air.

No one has blindly shouted they are trained to play theater either.
Its you anti-black americans that have come in initially claimed that black actors aren't trained, to that you were refuted with the fact that black american actors are indeed formally trained in theater just like brit actors are.

AS for you links you are grasping at straws, classical training vs the method has nothing to do with what we are discussing and The Method is a specific type of training that only one actor listed has, Jamie Hector aka Marlo from the Wire has, the rest are trained again in the classical method in their universities.

Your second link is a blog's opinon.

Your third a reddit post, is opinion.

Your last post is ignorant because it thinks Lee Stausberg and his "The Method" is the basis for formal education and that tv/film acting is the base for drama university/college programs when it isn't, stage acting is in the majority of the schools.

Again you can you tell me why you feel the need to try to cast black americans and black american actors as inferior or untrained when it clearly is not the case?

 

[Booker T Garvey]

the problem comes from the blind mention that british actors are better, not black directors hiring british talent. and even in that article you posted, you have someone thats been on this side of the pond picking it apart.

bruh. I'm not arguing in absolutes. there is room for DEBATE/DISCUSSION absolutely. you saw me begging for discussion a few pages back

but there **IS** a difference. this is not debatable.

and for the third time - you dudes think Yazz the Greatest is just as good or better an actor than John Boyega?

there is a depth classical training gives actors that standard training simply does not.

 

[Booker T Garvey]

You are presenting a strawman, none of us Black Americans never said there was anything wrong with black directors or white directors casting black brits.

first of all, this entire discussion is about opinion. even sam jacksons. so you're not being deep by repeating that.

brittish actors can't play black american characters without movies and roles right?

so it's a straw man to ask "what about the people giving them the jobs in the first place?"

stop it.

 

[David_TheMan]

I did mention those schools I stand corrected but it was to illustrate my point

and yes, debunk my theory but not by saying "oh that's just ignorant!!"

you don't think tyler perry's success had ANY impact on african american theater? actors? NONE!?!

brittish actors tend to be classically trained, I can tell you now that chitlin circuit actors have not

all of those actors tyler perry brought in hollywood are chitlin trained actors...are they not!?!

Your arguments have been debunked literally by showing you your contentions are false.
Your theory was just debunked because you literally just posted it to be analyzed.
Again though you go off track instead of even trying to defend what you actually argue.
Black community theater is black community theater, its completely seperate from Hollywood, just like local white community theater is seperate from hollywood. So did tyler perry revitalize it, sure. Can this revitalization point to changes in potential actors and the methods they used to enter the field? No. No studies have been done so any guess is just a blind guess.

British actors being classically trained is nice, british community theater actors are most likely not trained. That said you look at broadway, off broadway, theater in Chicago or LA and you have hundreds of classically trained black actors. Again though, that you seem to think the entirety of black actors are on the chitlin circuit is a strange unsupported view and shows your ignorance of black american actors and where they work.

What actors did tyler perry bring to hollywood? Tyler Perry films in his own studio in atlanta, with his own acting company. When he has made movies geared toward hollywood, he has paid the money to bring in HOllywood talent.

Again it seems you don't really have a knowledge of what you are talking about at all.

 

[parallax]

bruh. I'm not arguing in absolutes. there is room for DEBATE/DISCUSSION absolutely. you saw me begging for discussion a few pages back

but there **IS** a difference. this is not debatable.

and for the third time - you dudes think Yazz the Greatest is just as good or better an actor than John Boyega?

there is a depth classical training gives actors that standard training simply does not.

i dont know who yazz the greatest is. but i can tell you john boyega isnt the black brit you should hang your flag on. hes got a way to go, but hes not some high pinnacle of acting.

 

[David_TheMan]

first of all, this entire discussion is about opinion. even sam jacksons. so you're not being deep by repeating that.

brittish actors can't play black american characters without movies and roles right?

so it's a straw man to ask "what about the people giving them the jobs in the first place?"

stop it.

Another strawman, the argument isn't about whether you can have an opinion, its about the attack on black american actors being called untrained and unfit for roles.
No one in this thread said black brits can't play black american roles.

You literally have no idea what you are talking about, its is like you refer to each post in a vacuum, sometimes even forgetting what you just wrote in another post so you can continue to argue for the sake of argument.