I never saw Michael Jordan play in his prime....

[#1 pick]

Kobe just did not dominate his peers like Jordan did. That's all there is to it.

How the fukk are you suppose to compare 1 MVP to 5 ?

Or 10 scoring titles to 2 ?

Or even 6 Finals MVP's to 2 ?

Come on man, this shyt is not fair.

We already seen what the best looks like, are we suppose to be impressed by the bootleg version ?

That's ass backwards.

MVP are voted by the media. Bonds is the best Baseball player I have ever seen but he won't get into Hall because of the bytchass voters who are mainly media.

The rest can be earned. All NBA. I respect that. All Defensive team. I respect that.

 

[#1 pick]

It's not fair to compare him to Jordan, who just won't come out victorious

Blame the blatant copying and dikk riding of MJ's game

So is Mike Thompson and Julius Erving GOAT's since MJ jack their game.

 

[filial_piety]

Kobe has been a great player, top 15 player, the big problem for Kobe when we compare him to players like Lebron or Michael is he played with the most dominant guy ever in Shaq, a guy who would routinely get triple teamed. I personally just don't think Kobe was as good as fans thought/think he was during that period, he really came into his game in 2006. It seems fans of Kobe forget just how good Shaq was, there has never been a force like him, never!! Kobe skill wise is right there with Jordan, but as a teammate, he just doesn't compare, that team Kobe fans always complain about in 2005 and 2006 was basically the same team Jordan was winning the early titles and the last one with, a little better because of Pippen (early Pippen, the great Pippen we think of didn't appear till the Phoenix series), that 1998 team Jordan won with included a second best player that had a bad back and was totally ineffective. Kobe is really a great scorer, hence the reason he has only won one MVP, but I would still put him in the top 15

THis is quoted for biblical purposes. This is the truth and then some.

Anyone old enough to remember knows that Shaq was just too dominant back in the day. The man was his own center of gravity (no pun intended). He OWNED that team, and everyone knew it including Kobe. Jordan was the "shaq" of his team. I'd even argue that although they are different positions, Shaq is more comparable to Jordan in terms of what he meant to his team than Kobe was.

And to keep it 100%....I ALWAYS though AI was better in his prime by comparison. Around 96-05 I don't think anyone could honestly convince me that Kobe was better than AI.

I only began to really see Kobe as a top 3 elite player around 06' when he dropped that 81, and then eventually won 2 on his own. He definitely began to stand out individually and shaprened his game tremendously after that.

 

[Po pimp]

Kobe had better handles and MAYBE a better long range jumper. MJ was better at everything else.

 

[#1 pick]

THis is quoted for biblical purposes. This is the truth and then some.

Anyone old enough to remember knows that Shaq was just too dominant back in the day. The man was his own center of gravity (no pun intended). He OWNED that team, and everyone knew it including Kobe. Jordan was the "shaq" of his team. I'd even argue that although they are different positions, Shaq is more comparable to Jordan in terms of what he meant to his team than Kobe was.

And to keep it 100%....I ALWAYS though AI was better in his prime by comparison. Around 96-05 I don't think anyone could honestly convince me that Kobe was better than AI.

I only began to really see Kobe as a top 3 elite player around 06' when he dropped that 81, and then eventually won 2 on his own. He definitely began to stand out individually and shaprened his game tremendously after that.

MJ was never as good as Shaq tho in his prime

There is a reason Chicago losses MJ and they only lose two more games than the year before. Shaq was much better just because of his position is much more valuable than MJ. MJ position is good for ticket sales, ESPN, and the media but Shaq position is more important in terms of Hoops.

 

[filial_piety]

MJ was never as good as Shaq tho in his prime

There is a reason Chicago losses MJ and they only lose two more games than the year before. Shaq was much better just because of his position is much more valuable than MJ. MJ position is good for ticket sales, ESPN, and the media but Shaq position is more important in terms of Hoops.

MJ and Shaq were their own forces of nature at the height of their games. MJ earned every ounce of his "hype" and then some. MJ crippled ALOT of cats careers who should have earned rings. There are plenty of players who are walking around with bare hands because of Jordan who would have otherwise would have solidified their names forever if he were never born.

But Shaq was not "better" at his position than Jordan was at his. I hate to say this, but everyone knows it...Shaq lacked competition at the "big man" position in 99-03 (his best years). Everyone who schooled him early on were gone...anyone from David Robinson, to Akeem Olajuwan to Patrick Ewing and Alonzo Morning or Ric Smits (yeah I said it lol). The only cat who could challenge him was Dikembe Mutumbo and he got manhandled in 01'. Other than that, who was there in his prime? Vlade Divac?

Jordan without a doubt just owned everbody in the late 80s and 90s regardless of your position. It didn't matter what position you played or how good you were, he owned the game on the floor. It is what it is.

But back to my original point...Kobe was the Scottie Pippen of his team until his 9th year. Shaq and Jordan are comparable. Kobe and Pippen are comparable. Shaq and MJ are clearly better than Kobe and Pippen were.

 

[TheProfessor]

On offense, MJ and Kobe are about equal. The reason why I place MJ higher is because he was a far better defender for much of his career and his "clutch" factor is in another stratosphere. Both are living legends and all-time greats.

 

[god shamgod]

So is Mike Thompson and Julius Erving GOAT's since MJ jack their game.

It's david thompson and show me footage of david thompson and dr j posting people up and shooting fadeaways

Kobe had better handles and MAYBE a better long range jumper. MJ was better at everything else.

It aint maybe kobe's long range j is much better

 

[Illeye buckmatic]

While Kobe is king now,mj is still my goat for a couple reasons.
He played against better competition. When he won his first 3 rings,you had 3 less teams making the benches deeper than the teams kobe played against. The centers in that era were way better than Kobe's era making it much tougher to penetrate. Plus Kobe got rings playing with one of the goat centers while Jordan won with combinations of Cartwright,longley,perdue,Williams,dele,etc... He never had a dominant low post presence to balance the attack. Grant was the closest thing and he shot a lot of jumpers. After shaq,Kobe didn't win until he got gasol in the posts.
Also Kobe quit in a playoff game to prove a point. Jordan would've been like fukk yall haters,I'm still shooting He was just mentally tougher. He had teams beat before they took the court
Also I give Jordan's post up game the edge too. Especially during the last three rings. And that post up,turn around jumper was
And lets not forget,the Zen master himself said mj is better.
Everything else is just about even. Kobe is the closest thing we got to Jordan so I say lets enjoy him while we can. While there are other greats currently in the game,who knows whens the next time we'll see a player in that mold

 

[Po pimp]

It's david thompson and show me footage of david thompson and dr j posting people up and shooting fadeaways



It aint maybe kobe's long range j is much better

MJ didn't take many 3s so it's a small sample size. I mean, he did go 6-6 from three in the Finals in the 1st half against Portland.

 

[Sunalmighty]

MJ had the advantage in physique . Kobe makes up the difference with dedication

where do you niccas get this stuff? MJ was the ULTIMATE competitor. He got as good as he was because of PRACTICE and DEDICATION. So mike had a better body shape? That's what your saying? You dudes is in your early 20s more than likely, that's the dumbest thing I've ever heard

 

[Illeye buckmatic]

MJ didn't take many 3s so it's a small sample size. I mean, he did go 6-6 from three in the Finals in the 1st half against Portland.

I loved when he looked at Portland's bench and went

 

[filial_piety]

I honeslty don't think anyone believes that if Kobe played eaxcatly in the same years as MJ did, and played exactly on the same team as MJ had...that he could replicate what MJ accomplished.

Kobe in the 80s and 90s would not have been "great", but just another very good player. To be 1000% honest, Kobe is just an upgraded Pippen.

 

[Cynical Thoughts]

The Utah jazz were not that great

I don't know about that breh. I remember them being the highest scoring team in the L one of those years and the bulls held them to the lowest scoring output in the finals history maybe even the playoff.

69 points I believe it was, with two hof'ers and a hof coach.

I'll never understand how nikkas downplay how important KObe was to that Laker squad from 00-03. He routinely shytted on the big teams in the west especially the Spurs..he had a game where he dropped 48,15,7..avg damn near 35 in 5 games against them and that was in 2000 if im not mistaken. Shaq was the man in the Finals of course (look at the East teams they beat) but Kobe was a top 5 player even back then.

Im really pressed to see list of 14 guys you would pick over Kobe, 5 rings,2 finals MVPs, career avg of over 28 as a starter..27/6/5 in the 17th year..I just can't

Because I think that any all star guard could have stepped in and performed and won titles with Shaq. No knock on kobe. You don't think Vince, tmac, grant hill etc. wouldn't have won without Shaq. For that matter even second teir players like finely, ray allen, arenas ect have won with Shaq. Again, not a knock in Kobe but more of a props to Shaq.

Name a championship team that won without an all star caliber bigs/post man? Its not many other than those bulls teams and they did it going up against hof big men.

Essentially in the those later chips he was the post man. Which is why it's so special. And we all know Kobe has never don anything without a top 5 big.

I never understand the argument that he won without Shaq. Stans would make it seem like he didn't have a big at all. When in actuality he got a to 5 big in Gasol and a pretty good second serviceable big in Bynum. You could never confuse Jordan's bigs with those players.

 

[Sunalmighty]

Im not arguing Kobe was better we all know Jordan was better but the gap isn't as big as many make it out to be.

If you never saw MJ play in his prime, how would you know