Holy Cannoli! We’re On The Strive For Five! The Dynasty Rolls On! Golden State Warriors 2022-23 Season Thread

[Bay Area]

That’ll happen when you play nearly ALL your mins with wiseman

If we’re being unbiased, they didn’t really play at the same time yesterday. Wiseman was +9 and Kuminga was -2. Kuminga was given extended playing time with starters and played 6 more minutes than Wiseman.

 

[lib123]

That’ll happen when you play nearly ALL your mins with wiseman

Nah that's no excuse for Kuminga's individual performance to be this bad.

 

[FaTaL]

That’ll happen when you play nearly ALL your mins with wiseman

kuminga barely plays, he needs to goto sc and get 30 mins a night

 

[Gil Scott-Heroin]

Nah that's no excuse for Kuminga's individual performance to be this bad.

I wouldn't say his individual performance has been bad. He barely gets minutes and when he does he's not in the frame of the possession. A stark contrast to what happened last season.

 

[Don Homer]

If we’re being unbiased, they didn’t really play at the same time yesterday. Wiseman was +9 and Kuminga was -2. Kuminga was given extended playing time with starters and played 6 more minutes than Wiseman.

wiseman was +9 bc he was on the court when poole went on a personal 15-0 run in the 3rd and left the game soon after that and never came back. he was a -6 before poole's explosion. he wouldve been a bigger negative if he got kuminga's mins, ESPECIALLY if Isaiah Stewart was on his ass

 

[Bay Area]

wiseman was +9 bc he was on the court when poole went on a personal 15-0 run in the 3rd and left the game soon after that and never came back. he was a -6 before poole's explosion

I’m Not focusing on the impact of the plus minus, my point is that they didn’t play together much last game. Kumingas performance had nothing to do with Wiseman.

 

[Don Homer]

I’m Not focusing on the impact of the plus minus, my point is that they didn’t play together much last game. Kumingas performance had nothing to do with Wiseman.

u brought up plus/minus tho....

that was last game. before that game, the overwhelming majority of Kuminga's mins are glued with wiseman. no one has a positive rating next to wiseman, not even steph. Kuminga cant even get minutes cuz they gotta see something outta wiseman with extension time coming soon for him. So the warriors can't even play their switching style. they gotta play drop coverage and run 50 PnR's and completely change their offensive and defensive schemes to accommodate him

 

[Bay Area]

u brought up plus/minus tho....

that was last game. before that game, the overwhelming majority of Kuminga's mins are glued with wiseman. no one has a positive rating next to wiseman, not even steph. Kuminga cant even get minutes cuz they gotta see something outta wiseman with extension time coming soon for him. So the warriors can't even play their switching style. they gotta play drop coverage and run 50 PnR's and completely change their offensive and defensive schemes to accommodate him

Yeah my guy…. I brought up plus minus as an example of two players not being on the court at the same time…. You say Wiseman is stopping Kuminga from getting minutes yet Kuminga played six more minutes than him last game and the game before that Wiseman only played 5 total minutes.

Everything is Wiseman’s fault.

Kuminga still struggles in non wiseman lineups #BlameWiseman

Wiseman plays like 10 total minutes in the entire game and Kerr still doesn’t sub in Kuminga #BlameWiseman

 

[Don Homer]

Yeah my guy…. I brought up plus minus as an example of two players not being on the court at the same time…. You say Wiseman is stopping Kuminga from getting minutes yet Kuminga played six more minutes than him last game and the game before that Wiseman only played 5 total minutes.

Everything is Wiseman’s fault.

Kuminga still struggles in non wiseman lineups #BlameWiseman

Wiseman plays like 10 total minutes in the entire game and Kerr still doesn’t sub in Kuminga #BlameWiseman

Kuminga struggles bc he never gets consistent play time. he's not allowed to play through mistakes. Kerr been putting him in the dog house. Same reason why Brad Wannamaker and Nico Mannion were getting minutes over Poole, or why Steph was getting benched for Acie Law. Wiseman has the offense and defense catered to him and still cant hack it.

Everything aint wiseman fault, but he has no dog in him in the slightest. he's easily moved off his spots and he has zero instincts. everything has to be taught to him. at the end of the day, the Warriors will have to choose between him or Kuminga, and seeing how it's a wing's league and one guy has shown to be useful in the warriors system and doesnt require them to play like the Harden rockets or Snyder Jazz, i'd go with kuminga. That, and unless your Jokic or Embiid, building around a big is nonsense

 

[Bay Area]

Kuminga struggles bc he never gets consistent play time. he's not allowed to play through mistakes. Kerr been putting him in the dog house. Same reason why Brad Wannamaker and Nico Mannion were getting minutes over Poole, or why Steph was getting benched for Acie Law. Wiseman has the offense and defense catered to him and still cant hack it.

Everything aint wiseman fault, but he has no dog in him in the slightest. he's easily moved off his spots and he has zero instincts. everything has to be taught to him. at the end of the day, the Warriors will have to choose between him or Kuminga, and seeing how it's a wing's league and one guy has shown to be useful in the warriors system and doesnt require them to play like the Harden rockets or Snyder Jazz, i'd go with kuminga. That, and unless your Jokic or Embiid, building around a big is nonsense

We are less than ten games into the season, Kerr is going to be experimenting with lineups all season. Moody doesn’t get consistent minutes either but that’s not affecting his performance, granted they have different roles. Kuminga will have plenty of opportunities to prove himself. My only point in this discussion is it’s crazy to push a narrative that Kuminga is ALWAYS on the court with Wiseman just because that lineup happened like the first 2 games.

 

[Don Homer]

We are less than ten games into the season, Kerr is going to be experimenting with lineups all season. Moody doesn’t get consistent minutes either but that’s not affecting his performance, granted they have different roles. Kuminga will have plenty of opportunities to prove himself. My only point in this discussion is it’s crazy to push a narrative that Kuminga is ALWAYS on the court with Wiseman just because that lineup happened like the first 2 games.

first FIVE games. 5/7 games

 

[Bay Area]

first FIVE games. 5/7 games

I need to see some type of proof of this because I watch Kuminga and pay specific attention to the lineups he’s in just because of the narratives in this thread

 

[Don Homer]

I need to see some type of proof of this because I watch Kuminga and pay specific attention to the lineups he’s in just because of the narratives in this thread

5 Games:
Lakers
Denver
Sac
Suns

Pistons - literally yesterday


that's 5 games. in those 5 games, Kuminga has played most of his minutes with wiseman. Especially in the first 4 games (Lakers - Suns).The very first time kuminga got minutes without wiseman was during the closing mins of the Suns blowout game. Kuminga was taken out the rotation pretty much in Miami and Charlotte


LIKE I SAID WHEN THE SEASON STARTED, and y’all were acting like I was dooming, I said that it’s gonna be hard for Kuminga to have a role on this team with wiseman clogging the lane constantly. And here we are. I said before the season started that they can’t play together, and here we are

 

[Don Homer]

And another thing:

Now if u wanna act like we said Wiseman is the source of all our problems, continue to do so. Just know that it’s a straw man argument. I've already talked about ALL warriors players when players aren't playing well. I do it all the time. @Gil Scott-Heroin and I have been saying that Wiseman contributes NOTHING to this team, and the team has to bend over backwards to accommodate him to the point that the warriors change how they play on BOTH ends of the floor.

Agree or disagree: When Wiseman is on the court, Warriors basketball is not being played. When Wiseman is on the court, do we not play 100% drop coverage. Do we run 50 PnR's like a great value D'antoni?


Just so you know, Poole is a terrible defender, yes. Clearly. But you can hide a guard. What you CANNOT do is hide a center on defense. What's even MORE troubling is the Warriors are playing DROP COVERAGE with Wiseman. That means he drops on every single drive, so he can theoretically guard the paint. It's THE defense for centers in this league.

1. The warriors can't switch as well like they were doing last season, because Wiseman has slow feet and cant guard the perimeter
2. HE DOESNT DEFEND THE PAINT WELL AT ALL! When the Warriors had bogut, they could funnel the opposing player to him, and Bogut would help and clean the shyt up and rebound. WISEMAN CANT HELP DEFEND, AND HE CANT REBOUND
3. Drop Coverages for bigs who suck on defense, ruins the entire scheme. All the opposing team has to do is call for a screen -->Wiseman's man moves up to screen --> the opposing big screens the initial perimeter defender (BOOM, RIGHT HERE IS A BIG REASON WHY THE WARRIORS ARENT DEFENDING WELL) --> the opposing ballhandler gets his initial defender out the way bc of the screen, so now the ballhandler can drive --> wiseman cant defend the drive so the coverage is blown. Bigs who can ONLY do drop (and wiseman isnt even good at it) will get blown up by nearly every screening action. Not to mention he drops so far that he's out of position to rebound, which is pathetic that he can't play drop correctly


So what exactly is the hope here? I've seen people say he is supposed to play the Javale McGee role on the warriors. OK, but u do realize Javale only average 9 minutes per game for the Warriors, and was completely unplayable vs the 2018 Rockets, and barely played past the 1st round in 2018?

So we are doing all this so a guy can give us 9 mpg? Meanwhile we have 2 wings, one of which needs reps because he plays a position that is at a premium in the league. Clearly the smart money says we should spend more time on Kuminga and less on wiseman. Not to mention one is costing us 88million in luxury tax, which is money that could be used to extend draymond.

 

[Bay Area]

5 Games:
Lakers
Denver
Sac
Suns

Pistons - literally yesterday


that's 5 games. in those 5 games, Kuminga has played most of his minutes with wiseman. Especially in the first 4 games (Lakers - Suns).The very first time kuminga got minutes without wiseman was during the closing mins of the Suns blowout game. Kuminga was taken out the rotation pretty much in Miami and Charlotte


LIKE I SAID WHEN THE SEASON STARTED, and y’all were acting like I was dooming, I said that it’s gonna be hard for Kuminga to have a role on this team with wiseman clogging the lane constantly. And here we are. I said before the season started that they can’t play together, and here we are

The fact that you used the pistons game as an example of Kuminga and Wiseman playing together makes me not trust your evidence that they played together heavy minutes in all four of the other games. Wiseman and Kumingas minutes against the Pistons only overlapped each other for a couple of minutes. If my memory is correct, Wiseman and MOODY were the first subs at the center and forward positions.


My argument isn’t that they are NEVER on the court together at ANY point. I’m saying it’s not a hockey substitution of the exact same minutes. Kuminga gets plenty of opportunities when Wiseman is in the bench. There will eventually be games where Wiseman gets absolutely no minutes, the same way Kuminga was benched for like 2 games.