Hip Hop was the 1st time in America where stereotypes of Blackfolks were self inflicted

[Pit Bull]

Typical smart dumb nikka shyt. I see why y'all nikkas hate militants now .

 

[IllmaticDelta]

Hip hops success is hugely based on fetishizing blacks. Controversial but it's true.

yes and no...yes because there is "cool" factor but no because then you would have to explain how something like ragtime or jazz which are now grouped in with european art music/classical got so popular and accepted as a type of "art music"

If US was like Canada or the UK whites wouldn't fukk with it, they wanna see violent ignorant nikkaz, they are in short supply in those countries. Theres millions of vlad's out there. They'll watch the video recite the song but still leave racist comments.

explain why House music took over the UK when it had no association to violence/ignorance. same for Soul music

 

[BlackDiBiase]

I dont know why posters are trying to call OP george c00ney, because his dead ass. the bravado was one thing but it went way too much especially around 03 till now hen the south began to take over. 2003 was even the last time hiphop set trends since then they been dumb copying and madly dangerous.

gucci is that dude, but in chichago he is the god. check chicago crime stats, dont know why you are trying to knock the OP for making a bold and truthful claim, in the words of macklemore 'no freedoom till we equal, damn right i support it'.

 

[Retrofuture]

....Social Media is fast becoming the second but Hip Hop is the first..

...and it all started when Gangster rap invaded the mainstream in 1993.

When Jazz was the "in" thing...Blackmen wore suits, hell you couldnt even get in a Jazz club without a suit. All the way up to 70's R&B we sang about love and Blackmen dressed like grown men, they even had a term for it, "Dressing /looking sharp." When Superfly (which was directed by a Black man) came out it was countered by a soundtrack denouning drug dealing and drug using. Minstrel shows where out of our control...The way the news and Hollywood portrayed us was out of our control.

But Hip Hop was in our control and look at where we took in since the emergence of gangster/drug dealer rap in the early 90's.

- Black men bragging about killing other Blackmen
- Black Men bragging about selling drugs in their community
- Black men refering to Blackwomen as bytches and hoes
- Blackwomen accepting being called a bytch and a ho(Prior to Hip Hop the only time a woman accepted this on an open level was if she was in the nightlife of the underworld)
- Blackmen bragging about sleeping with other Blackmens wives
- Blackmen making light of hurting/killing children
- Blackmen boasting of their financial status to an audience of people who aren't rich as if to shove it in their faces like snobs.
Blackmen condoning illegal activity and boasting after the illegal activity is complete
- Grown Blackmen dressing like teens and acting like teens
- Blackmen proudly speaking ignorant.


All of the above was self inflicted....No one outside of our race created these images...we(Hip Hop) did...Notice how I dont exclude myself because I cant. I am a contributing factor to all of this as well because I supported it for years, as with so many others. In the late 80's the music of NWA and 2 Live Crew were distributed independently...they weren't pushed by a "machine" so all that conspiracy theory nonsense goes right out the window. No one forces rappers to flash guns or speak on camera about beef with other Blackmen.(I remember Kid Capri saying he refused to ever talk about anyone he ever had beef with openly...Different times different era I guess)


My thing is this....Now that we are here and we are in so deep....what do we do to counter it all?? This self inflicted image has been in effect for around 23 years....Thats 23 years of damage that needs to be reversed and replaced with an alternative...But how the hell is that going to happen? In all of Americas history we never experienced this type of self inflicted damage.

Have you seen the thread of ktt where a unknown rapper in the 90s speaks on the il

....Social Media is fast becoming the second but Hip Hop is the first..

...and it all started when Gangster rap invaded the mainstream in 1993.

When Jazz was the "in" thing...Blackmen wore suits, hell you couldnt even get in a Jazz club without a suit. All the way up to 70's R&B we sang about love and Blackmen dressed like grown men, they even had a term for it, "Dressing /looking sharp." When Superfly (which was directed by a Black man) came out it was countered by a soundtrack denouning drug dealing and drug using. Minstrel shows where out of our control...The way the news and Hollywood portrayed us was out of our control.

But Hip Hop was in our control and look at where we took in since the emergence of gangster/drug dealer rap in the early 90's.

- Black men bragging about killing other Blackmen
- Black Men bragging about selling drugs in their community
- Black men refering to Blackwomen as bytches and hoes
- Blackwomen accepting being called a bytch and a ho(Prior to Hip Hop the only time a woman accepted this on an open level was if she was in the nightlife of the underworld)
- Blackmen bragging about sleeping with other Blackmens wives
- Blackmen making light of hurting/killing children
- Blackmen boasting of their financial status to an audience of people who aren't rich as if to shove it in their faces like snobs.
Blackmen condoning illegal activity and boasting after the illegal activity is complete
- Grown Blackmen dressing like teens and acting like teens
- Blackmen proudly speaking ignorant.


All of the above was self inflicted....No one outside of our race created these images...we(Hip Hop) did...Notice how I dont exclude myself because I cant. I am a contributing factor to all of this as well because I supported it for years, as with so many others. In the late 80's the music of NWA and 2 Live Crew were distributed independently...they weren't pushed by a "machine" so all that conspiracy theory nonsense goes right out the window. No one forces rappers to flash guns or speak on camera about beef with other Blackmen.(I remember Kid Capri saying he refused to ever talk about anyone he ever had beef with openly...Different times different era I guess)


My thing is this....Now that we are here and we are in so deep....what do we do to counter it all?? This self inflicted image has been in effect for around 23 years....Thats 23 years of damage that needs to be reversed and replaced with an alternative...But how the hell is that going to happen? In all of Americas history we never experienced this type of self inflicted damage.

check out "the secret hip hop meeting" that was set up to make black look bad


"The Secret Meeting that Changed Rap Music and Destroyed a Generation" | Hip Hop Is Read

 

[Nintendough]

* shoulder leans, fukks hoes raw, plays migos in front of funerals, gets into arguments at clubs, cusses out cashier's, keeps it real*

 

[IllmaticDelta]

If this wasn't an example of self inflicted stereotyping, I don't know what is and it predates HipHop....so let me someone spin this

An undated photo of vaudevillian Bert Williams, who started his career in the 1890s and began recording in 1901. Williams became a star after donning blackface onstage.

Bert Williams was a Broadway star who had to demean himself to get onstage. A new play gives voice to the man behind the blackface.

Bert Williams had one of the strangest careers in the history of American show business.

He was a Broadway star in the early 20th century, headlining in one of the first African-American musicals, In Dahomey. For eight years, he appeared in the Ziegfeld Follies, his singing, dancing and pantomime often outshining the likes of W.C. Fields, Fanny Brice, Will Rogers and Eddie Cantor. With his partner, George Walker, Williams was the first African-American artist to make a recording on disc, in 1901, and his comic monologue, Elder Eatmore's Sermon, sold 500,000 copies.

At the peak of his popularity, Williams made as much money as the president of the United States by playing a character that is often described as the black counterpart to Charlie Chaplin's Little Tramp.

Yet there was a tragic ambiguity to Williams, who performed at a time when white actors in minstrel shows donned blackface to sing and dance as ignorant, shiftless, watermelon-eating fools.

At the age of 22, struggling to make his way on the vaudeville circuit, Williams, who was from the West Indies, decided to do his own "impersonation of a negro" by darkening his relatively fair skin with burnt cork.

This seemed to liberate him artistically, and in just a few years, he and Walker were the first African-American



stars, billing themselves as "The Two Real c00ns" to distinguish themselves from white performers in blackface. Knowing there was no other way they could get onstage, they played the buffoonish stereotypes so degrading to black people, complete with exaggerated lips, popping eyeballs and a shuffling gait.

Williams, an intelligent, dignified man, achieved his success at a high emotional cost. Fields, his Follies colleague, called him "the funniest man I ever saw, and the saddest man I ever knew."

Now a new play about this largely forgotten figure, Nobody: The Bert Williams Story by Frank Jenkins, is being premiered by the West Coast Black Theatre Troupe in Sarasota. There's also a new novel, Dancing in the Dark by Caryl Phillips, that imagines what it was like to be Williams.

"Bert always fascinated me because he was so successful at a time of such high racism in America," said Jenkins, speaking from his home in Los Angeles. "There he was, one of the highest paid entertainers in the world, but he still couldn't get a room in a hotel in a lot of places, couldn't eat in a lot of places. And the only way he could go onstage was as a minstrel man. He wanted to be a Shakespearean, but that was not allowed."

In Phillips' novel, there is an artful account of when Williams first put on blackface in Detroit in 1896:

"And the first time he looked at himself in the mirror he thought of the embarrassment and distress that this would cause his father and his heart sank. Down through his body like a stone, down through those long, oversized boots that announced him as a clown. How could a West Indian do such a thing to himself? The first time he looked in the mirror he was ashamed, but he understood that his job was to make people laugh so they did not have time to ridicule or hurt him. And so he made the people of Detroit laugh."

Nate Jacobs, 46, the founding artistic director of the black theater company in Sarasota, plays Williams in Nobody. When asked what it felt like to put on blackface, he paused before answering.

"That's not a happy thing," Jacobs said. "It feels like I'm sure he felt. It feels degrading. Why do I have to do this? What is the purpose of me disguising my person? Who am I really? As I play the character of Bert Williams, he detested it because Bert was proud of who he was."

Jacobs said he prepares for a performance of Nobody by going off by himself for a minute. "I have to get into this mood because I am dealing with a man who had a lot of challenges before him, a lot of pain."

Williams died in 1922, after collapsing onstage in a show called Under the Bamboo Tree. His legacy is complex. He influenced comedians such as Richard Pryor and Bill Cosby. Intellectuals discuss his blackface "mask" in the same terms as the issues explored in Ralph Ellison's classic novel of black identity, Invisible Man. He had a sophisticated comedic philosophy.

"All the jokes in the world are based on a few elemental ideas," Williams wrote in a 1918 magazine article. "Troubles are funny only when you pin them down to one particular individual. And that individual, the fellow who is the goat, must be the man who is singing the song or telling the story . . . It was not until I could see myself as another person that my sense of humor developed."

Still, for all his artistic gifts, Williams will forever be associated with the odious stereotypes he portrayed, and made a handsome living from, a tradition carried on by black performers like Stepin Fetchit. This aspect of his legacy was savagely evoked in Spike Lee's 2000 movie, Bamboozled, in which Savion Glover and Tommy Davidson star in "Mantan: the New Millennium Minstrel Show," a TV variety show featuring African-American performers in blackface.

For many modern-day viewers of Lee's movie, unacquainted with the Williams story, the idea of black actors in blackface must have seemed like richly inspired, over-the-top satire - not a slice of show business history from not so long ago.

For Jacobs, it is history that must not be ignored. "It's something we can't deny," he said. "This was this man's story in this era. The way I look at it, this is a story that has to be told."

Floridian: Giving a name to 'Nobody'

 

[gluvnast]

saying hip hop is the so-called "1st time" when you had this in our history....

 

[4-Rin]

Intresting...

 

[smokeurobinson]

No holes at all



how did you skip over this part?

they were self inflicted because :


1)black people wrote and directed these early movies

2)Even if a script was written by a white person, you self inflicted the damage on yourself by willingly acting out/in the script




Nope..it's much more complex than that and if you had deeper knowledge on the subject, you would have known that. Read below on Oscar

never that.....step up your knowledge on the subject

My dude.....U keep destroying your arguments with your own info.


Look at what u just posted...a book excerpt that says "The demand for stereotypes of African americans persisted"

well who was demanding it??


Was it African Americans?


Lets go back to your own info...

Again, major studios were controlling the supply and demand. These major studios were not Black owned. Hence, the demand was what white people wanted.

And I see u tried to put a safety net under that by pointing out that even if a white director blah blah blah...Yeah, the overall white demand of such stereotypes are not self inflicted. You cant compare what Blacks did as a means of survival in entertainment to appease white audiences to an artform started in the hood by DJs in clubs and Block parties were there was no white demand for a specific sound or look.

 

[smokeurobinson]

saying hip hop is the so-called "1st time" when you had this in our history....

The directors name is jack Kemp but who is jack Kemp??

Well since that info is unknown lets look at the distributor shall we..

Miracle in Harlem(1948)

Distributions Co: Screen Guild Productions, Inc.
Dissatisfied with what he believed to be exorbitant rental fees charged by major studios, Lippert formed Screen Guild Productions in 1945,


Robert L. Lippert (March 31, 1909 – November 10, 1976) was a prolific film producer and cinema owner who eventually owned a chain of 118 theatres

This is not a Black man. The topic is self inflicted stereotypes and u posting movies with white distributors. Thats a white demand thing not self infliction like when NWA pushed their music independently for the hood.

 

[dondraper]

Hiphop culture is the BIGGEST reason all black people are stereotyped. Its the biggest reason blacks are judged as a group instead of individually, like every other race.

You do realize blacks were stereotyped and judged as a group before hip hop right?

 

[gluvnast]

The directors name is jack Kemp but who is jack Kemp??

Well since that info is unknown lets look at the distributor shall we..

Miracle in Harlem(1948)

Distributions Co: Screen Guild Productions, Inc.
Dissatisfied with what he believed to be exorbitant rental fees charged by major studios, Lippert formed Screen Guild Productions in 1945,


Robert L. Lippert (March 31, 1909 – November 10, 1976) was a prolific film producer and cinema owner who eventually owned a chain of 118 theatres

This is not a Black man. The topic is self inflicted stereotypes and u posting movies with white distributors. Thats a white demand thing not self infliction like when NWA pushed their music independently for the hood.

You want to use NWA who was controlled by a white Jewish manager, distributed by a WHITE record label and so forth? Yet dismiss this for the same thing? yea... okay.

 

[smokeurobinson]

If this wasn't an example of self inflicted stereotyping, I don't know what is and it predates HipHop....so let me someone spin this

An undated photo of vaudevillian Bert Williams, who started his career in the 1890s and began recording in 1901. Williams became a star after donning blackface onstage.

Bert Williams was a Broadway star who had to demean himself to get onstage. A new play gives voice to the man behind the blackface.

Vaudeville is white entertianment fool

Broadway is white entertainment fool.


You cant compare white demand to an artform started by Black people for Black people. I already pointed out how u keep doing that. U keep pointing out white demand for entertainment and thats not self infliction, thats white demand for entertainment.Hip Hop didnt start out as no white demand shyt.

 

[smokeurobinson]

You want to use NWA who was controlled by a white Jewish manager, distributed by a WHITE record label and so forth? Yet dismiss this for the same thing? yea... okay.

No...U are comparing independent distribution to major distribution. I already posted the book excert with the red underlines stressing major distribution = white demand.


Did NWA do it for white demand?? There's to many NWA bios that explain that NWA was doing music for their hood not no white demand.

 

[gluvnast]

No...U are comparing independent distribution to major distribution. I already posted the book excert with the red underlines stressing major distribution = white demand.


Did NWA do it for white demand?? There's to many NWA bios that explain that NWA was doing music for their hood not no white demand.

Ruthless Records had MAJOR distribution.... courtesy of PRIORITY RECORDS... who owned Priority Records again?

Again... you try to have it one way, but reality speaks another. Or MAY you are blind to the fact that the white devil OWNS and controls everything. So any so-called stereotype there is about the black man... the WHITE MAN invented it. These so-called stereotypes you speak of been around since slavery. You obviously so uneducated in your history that you cannot look beyond rap music which isn't even that old....no music OR culture have that negative effect in comparison to the 400 years of physical and then mental enslavement. The word c00n isn't a word that Tariq Nasheed made up... it is a term used at black people for over a century, and black people back THEN lived up to many of those negative stereotypes... this shyt AIN'T brand new. This shyt isn't something that SUDDENLY SPROUTED because some people in the BRONX felt so. Why not READ A BOOK... learn about your history. Study your lessons... maybe you realize this issue among black enslavement and white supremacy is bigger than hip hop.