Draymond: “Old fvcks” need to accept Bron>>>MJ

[LexDiamonds]

Draymond is an nba player. He knows way more about ball than Coli brehs

 

[DoubleClutch]

Penny Hardaway did everything lebron did and better

this got way more daps then I anticipated.

I may be on to something

Penny > Lebron

 

[viktordoomsecretwars]

I belive Jordan is #1 but you can absolutely find things to list that LeBron has more of than Jordan and make a similar graphic (won't be as many things of course). Assists, boards, whatever other nitpicky things someone wants to make. That's why all these types of things don't hold weight OTHER than reinforcing what people on that side of the argument already believe. Jordan dominated his era more than LeBron dominated his era. Can't we all just enjoy both lol

They don't play the same position to begin with?

What is in the graphic I posted initially constitutes MVP's, Finals MVP's, scoring titles, steals titles, it actually omits Jordan's Defensive player of the year for instance.

Look at it this way, Lebron has played 20 seasons in the NBA and in the 5 statistical categories' ..........

Lebron led the league 1 time in Points per game (2008) and 1 time in assists (2020) = 2 times overall

Jordan led the league 10 times in points per game (1986-1993 & 1996-1998) and 3 times in steals per game (1988, 1990 & 1993) = 13 times overall


Jordan is also better relative to his position (shooting guard) than Lebron is relative to his position (small forward, who has predominanty played point guard)

:

^^^^^^^^^^^^^ (these are PER GAME stats)

So this is Jordan's historical ranking relative to every SG in NBA history vs Lebron's historical ranking vs every SF in NBA history, minimum of 500 games played.

As you can see, Jordan is literally better than pretty much everything.





Side Note: when Jordan played Lebron's point forward position in the stretch between 1988-1989, he certainly played it at a higher level than Lebron ever did.

 

[LexDiamonds]

They don't play the same position to begin with?

What is in the graphic constitutes MVP's, Finals MVP's, scoring titles, steals titles, it actually omits Jordan's Defensive player of the year for instance.

Look at it this way, Lebron has played 20 season in the NBA and in the 5 statistical categories,

Lebron's only led the league 1 time in Points per game (2008) and 1 time in assists (2020) = 2 times overall

Jordan led the league 10 times in points per game (1986-1993 & 1996-1998) and steals (1988, 1990 & 1993) = 13 times overall


Jordan is also better relative to his position (shooting guard) than Lebron is relative to his position (small forward, who has predominanty played point guard)

:

So this is Jordan's historical ranking relative to every SG in NBA history vs Lebron's historical ranking vs every SF in NBA history, minimum of 500 games played.

As you can see, Jordan is literally better than pretty much everything.

Also, when Jordan played Lebron's point forward position in the stretch between 1988-1989, he certainly played it at a higher level than Lebron ever did.

Are those stat ranking cumulative or per game? either way the are far outdated as Lebron for example is 4th in rebounds per game and 2nd in total rebounds. He is also 7th among SFs in FG %. Those stats are probably from when he was still a member of the Heat.

 

[viktordoomsecretwars]

Are those stat ranking cumulative or per game? either way the are far outdated as Lebron for example is 4th in rebounds per game and 2nd in total rebounds. He is also 7th among SFs in FG %. Those stats are probably from when he was still a member of the Heat.

Per game and no, they're up to date at least till 2021 but Per game stats for a career of 20 years can hardly change in 1 year.

 

[Sunalmighty]

Are you really gonna sit here and pretend that Jerry Krause didn't put together that amazing Bulls dynasty, and fielded a team that was able to compete even WITHOUT MJ on the team? Drafting Horace, Scottie, getting Kerr, Ron Harper, Kukoc, BJ Armstrong, etc

Jordan played with ONE all star because there were now 6 new teams in the timeframe of him winning his rings, and the talent was spread even thinner throughout the league.

Rodman and Kerr were ELITE ROLE PLAYERS which is how you win championships, all throughout the NBA's history there are countless of examples of elite role players being the deciding factor in rings. Stop man

 

[Roland Coltrane]

What records are you even referring to? Cause the stuff mentioned were MEDIA AWARDS besides the scoring titles and steals titles.

Both Bron and MJ should honestly have more of these media driven awards than they do, but that 100000% is a reason why I don't put much stock into them cause they are literally given by men/women who don't watch all the games

if Bron had more you wouldn't have typed out that bullshyt

 

[Roland Coltrane]

Jordan had the benefit of one of the greatest GM's, coach, defensive player, 3pt shooter, and rebounders of all time. Let's not pretend that MJ was dragging trash all over the place

If MJ was given the ability that modern players are, to have a say in team/roster construction... he probably isn't winning as much as he did cause he's an atrocious evaluator of talent who was consistently told NOO by Jerry Krause (and rightfully so)

look at all these mental gymnastics

if if was a fifth we'd all be drunk

we're not talking about some shyt that maybe might coulda happened in the multiverse


and yes, he was dragging trash all over the place. statistically MJ has something like 4 out of the lowest scoring supporting casts in the shot clock era.

 

[Roland Coltrane]

They don't play the same position to begin with?

What is in the graphic I posted initially constitutes MVP's, Finals MVP's, scoring titles, steals titles, it actually omits Jordan's Defensive player of the year for instance.

Look at it this way, Lebron has played 20 seasons in the NBA and in the 5 statistical categories' ..........

Lebron led the league 1 time in Points per game (2008) and 1 time in assists (2020) = 2 times overall

Jordan led the league 10 times in points per game (1986-1993 & 1996-1998) and 3 times in steals per game (1988, 1990 & 1993) = 13 times overall


Jordan is also better relative to his position (shooting guard) than Lebron is relative to his position (small forward, who has predominanty played point guard)

:

^^^^^^^^^^^^^ (these are PER GAME stats)

So this is Jordan's historical ranking relative to every SG in NBA history vs Lebron's historical ranking vs every SF in NBA history, minimum of 500 games played.

As you can see, Jordan is literally better than pretty much everything.





Side Note: when Jordan played Lebron's point forward position in the stretch between 1988-1989, he certainly played it at a higher level than Lebron ever did.

damn, it's not looking good for a certain contingent in here

 

[Roland Coltrane]

Greatest GM's - how many championships did Krause win before or after Jordan?

Greatest Coach - how many championships did Phil Jackson win before Jordan? Phil Jackson was considered a weirdo and a joke around the league before he became Jordan's coach.

Defensive player, 3 pt shooter, rebounder - Jordan is the only all time great not allowed to play with good players. Besides, its been proven Jordan played with the fewest all-stars of any of the other traditionally considered top 10 players of all time.

Jordan only played with ONE all star consistently throughout his career in Pippen, yet he is the most successful player ever.

Rodman and Kerr were role players not superstars.

Your other point doesn't make any sense.

 

[Roland Coltrane]

For me it’s simple, who was better at their apex, the height of their powers, so to speak..and the answer is MJ.

it got to the point where it felt like MJ was inevitable like Thanos
no bullshyt

personally i'm hard pressed to think of another athlete like that outside of Tyson pre-death of Cus D'amato

 

[Roland Coltrane]

Uhh let's try english here for a second... What exactly is a role player. Someone who plays a specific role on a team correct (rebounding, shooting, playmaking, etc). Now what role did the Bulls ask of Kerr.. to make outside shots, specifically 3 pt shots. Now do me a favor and how well did Kerr shoot the 3 ball and take advantage of his role on the team?

I'll give you a hint, he was shooting 46-52% from 3

 

[Roland Coltrane]

And Jordan has proven that he is arguably THE WORST talent evaluator in all of the NBA. His franchise is a clown show, and it took him how many years to finally hit on his first ever high draft pick in LaMelo?

Krause was an egotistical clown, but you know who else was an egotistical a$$hole? Jordan.. who would moo at Krause, call him crumbs. Basically those 2 couldn't stand each other because Jordan was an a$$hole, lets call it what it is. Jordan was the one who said that Grant and Pippen were too soft and was lobbying for trades. Tried to get the team to pick Walter Davis (UNC alum), wanted to trade Horace for Buck Williams who was a client of his own agent David Faulk.

Thankfully (for the Bulls) they generally didn't listen to too much of Mikes input on that end.

the desperation

 

[Roland Coltrane]

Defense = even...both could be elite but were limited because they had to carry the load on offense

how is this when MJ's got more All Defense nods and a DPOY

 

[Diondon]

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