Dr Marcus Garvey Jr. The Arab Slave Trade

[Hip-Hop-Bulls]

and again i wasnt talking about slavery in africa, i was talking about the arab slave trade which involved taking african out of africa or within arab held territory

and that slave trade can be compared to the transatlantic slave trade

and the big picture as far as the slave trade within africa, is that that trade is what led to the arab slave trade and the european slave trade, so even downplaying the slave trade amongst africans i find to be a problem

the slave trade withing africa is the reason why there wasnt even any point in going back to africa for africans that had been transported away

nobody is down playing anything as far as the arab slave trade or the history of slavery in africa as a whole. If anything the trans atlantic slave trade is being down played, and I really shouldn't have to explain all the stuff that went down starting with Elmina Castle in 1482. I know it's the cool thing on thecoli to bash islam as if the religion itself did all these horrible things but lets be real. religion is NOT responsible for anything. All religion is is a system used to help guide people to a more positive way of living. When PEOPLE start doing otherwise and other religious people think their religion is better, that's where the confusion comes in at. They say religion divides but in reality people divide people. No need to try to puff up the arab slave trade to get people thinking the religion of islam is this big bad religion that shouldn't be lived out if said person chooses too.

 

[88m3]

nobody is down playing anything as far as the arab slave trade or the history of slavery in africa as a whole. If anything the trans atlantic slave trade is being down played, and I really shouldn't have to explain all the stuff that went down starting with Elmina Castle in 1482. I know it's the cool thing on thecoli to bash islam as if the religion itself did all these horrible things but lets be real. religion is NOT responsible for anything. All religion is is a system used to help guide people to a more positive way of living. When PEOPLE start doing otherwise and other religious people think their religion is better, that's where the confusion comes in at. They say religion divides but in reality people divide people. No need to try to puff up the arab slave trade to get people thinking the religion of islam is this big bad religion that shouldn't be lived out if said person chooses too.

games muslims play

 

[thekingsmen]

This has to be the 10th Muslim/African Slave thread in a month.



@Shabazz Mathematics Allah...stay getting at these ignorant fools. Kick that knowledge to them.

 

[Dusty Bake Activate]

I don't think that's TWISM's basic point first of all. But your saying "it" again like it is a body, but it's more like an ideology.

Outside of the semantics, the argument your making doesn't make sense. You can't say Islam in practice has been X or Y when it's an ideology. If you want to say Muslims or Islamic nations that makes more sense but lets go to that point.

Nah, what doesn't make sense is the notion that Islam is just an ideology. When it forms the basis of governance, legality, and social norms, there's not separation between church and state it takes on the form of an institution as well, sorry. The concept of a caliphate is an institutional and political one.

I'm not being an apologist for those people who enslaved Africans, they are horrible people and they could have been from any religious background, but unfortunately they are from mine, and I will condemn them as I do anybody who does anything I think is wrong, but that sporadic and in comparison sparse enslavement by some Arab groups to the greatest genocide and injustice in terms of scale and brutality the world has ever seen and hopefully ever will see, in the Trans-Atlantic slave trade.

I don't see why that's even worth pointing out. We all know about the trans-Atlantic slave. The Arab slave trade was horrific as well, and I think a lot of black Americans at least are ignorant of it. Probably more than a 140 million Africans fell victim to it. They died on slaveships, were whipped and tortured just like black slaves in the trans-Atlantic slave trade. They were systematically castrated due to fears about their sexual prowess and habits. They were deemed animalistic. These racist misconceptions established by Arab slave traders in many ways informed the Europeans who did it later.

I don't really see this point of always throwing in "but when white people did it it was worse." Everyone knows what white people did. Somehow Arab slavery of Africans has been swept under the rug to the point that the average American doesn't even know it happened.

 

[Dr. Sebi Jr.]

Don't know if you know but the original arabs were dark black

Of COURSE they were. EMPHATICALLY.

 

[Hip-Hop-Bulls]

This has to be the 10th Muslim/African Slave thread in a month.



@Shabazz Mathematics Allah...stay getting at these ignorant fools. Kick that knowledge to them.

Peace to you and everybody that contributed to the thread

 

[NZA]

I reject people who are bad for our communities. Black elitist are one of those groups if they look down on the majority of the respective populations in our diaspora.

Some how in HL, there's a belief that religion is the main motivator of imperialism. Which is funny because most (if not all) of the people who fight against imperialism are religious. Africans had similar religions long before the religions, we discuss, ever existed..

And I guess our situation would be better if every black person in America was no longer a Muslim? It surprises me sometimes how little you all understand about our situation.

a lot of what you are talking about is not in my post. if you are going to quote me, why not stick to what the quote says?

elitism and religion as the end all-be all culprit are not in my post, nor are they positions i have upheld in other threads, and considering your history here and on SOHH, you should be able to remember as much. all one can accurately surmise from my post is that i think adoption of foreign imperialist religions is a problem to some degree. the actual degree is not mentioned at all, but given my time posting, anybody who is a KTL/HL regular knows that i have never once stated that religion was the cause of all that is bad in the world, let alone islam. so a regular poster would be able to put together that i only blame islam and christianity partially. i fully agree that removing them from the equation would not account for everything.

so now that we have established that my only point is that imperialist religions play a part, and that's a fact, so lets move on...

being against foreign-born religions does not translate into also blaming native african religions, so "Africans had similar religions long before the religions, we discuss, ever existed.." doesnt matter. i actually have said on several occasions in other threads that i would prefer africans worship their native beliefs over islam and christianity. this is something i have specifically advocated, breh. you have to not let your caping for muhammed cloud your judgement. the "main motivator" for imperialism is profit or power, not religion. religion just softens up the victim.

the most ironic thing is your attack on elitism, when quite a few of your posts in your time posting from all the way back, sound like someone who either is an elitist, or wishes he were one in terms of socioeconomic status.

 

[theworldismine13]

nobody is down playing anything as far as the arab slave trade or the history of slavery in africa as a whole. If anything the trans atlantic slave trade is being down played, and I really shouldn't have to explain all the stuff that went down starting with Elmina Castle in 1482. I know it's the cool thing on thecoli to bash islam as if the religion itself did all these horrible things but lets be real. religion is NOT responsible for anything. All religion is is a system used to help guide people to a more positive way of living. When PEOPLE start doing otherwise and other religious people think their religion is better, that's where the confusion comes in at. They say religion divides but in reality people divide people. No need to try to puff up the arab slave trade to get people thinking the religion of islam is this big bad religion that shouldn't be lived out if said person chooses too.

actually you are playing it down when you call it child's play, and the point is that the arab slave trade was just as bad as the transatlantic slave trade and another side point is that muslims were also involved in the transatlantic slave trade

and as had been said in the videos posted, its important to get the facts out because people have been known to say things like islam is the black man's religion or try to suggest islam is morally superior to christianity

marcus garvey jr was saying that black people should distance themselves from both christianity and islam because they both engaged in enslavement and genocide in africa, as far as i can see no pro islam person has disputed any of the facts presented about the arab slave trade

 

[theworldismine13]

[ame=http://youtu.be/bKyGxBCR_HE]ISLAM & MUSLIM SLAVE TRADE - YouTube[/ame]

 

[Hip-Hop-Bulls]

actually you are playing it down when you call it child's play, and the point is that the arab slave trade was just as bad as the transatlantic slave trade and another side point is that muslims were also involved in the transatlantic slave trade

and as had been said in the videos posted, its important to get the facts out because people have been known to say things like islam is the black man's religion or try to suggest islam is morally superior to christianity

marcus garvey jr was saying that black people should distance themselves from both christianity and islam because they both engaged in enslavement and genocide in africa, as far as i can see no pro islam person has disputed any of the facts presented about the arab slave trade

All of the main religions were started by black people. Is religion, peoples natural way of life, no but I'm not going around trying to get people to stop what they've been doing. If they practice christianity, islam, judaism etc and it's helping them as a person then there's nothing wrong with that. I could sit here tell all the people everything white christians did to them. Are they going to change, some perhaps, but the majority will keep following. And that's ok because I know and understand that religion isn't responsible for the genocide. PEOPLE WITH INTENTIONS USING RELIGION are responsible for things like that. When you try to destroy peoples belief system, they wont like that because that's all they have. Normally people don't stand in harsh weather, they go for shelter.

Peace

 

[Blackking]

If it informs and constitutes the basis for the legal system of state or territory, it essentially operates as an institution, even though it cannot be completely reduced to that.

Regardless of the semantics of the word institution, whatever you want to call it, Islam in practice hasn't historically been a benevolent force toward black people on a macro-level. I think that's twism's basic point.

A black individual choosing to be a Muslim or whatever other religion or lack thereof is a separate issue.

I agree.. and I know what ur saying. Slavery was gross in any case. You guys aren't pro black and aren't fully invested in the black community -so you can't see why the Tran Atlantic is the one that is pointed out.

It's pointed out because it's the one that has effected us the most. None of us downplay gross things that have happened. Arabs were violent, mutilating, and rapist. So were the cac's. The translantic is spoken about and focused on because of the mental brainwashing it provided was slightly more potent. Most black Muslims pre translantic were still proud black men. Many of the current black muslims 1900 -2013 are converts to the religion... converted either because they feel it or because it's associated with groups that have broken down mental chains of oppression placed on us by cac's.
NTM, some of the greatest black leaders lead from the Mosque.. Furthermore it's not a religion that's accepted by the average CAC and America shyts on it.. and it's a religion that helps keep u focused on ur business and family. So That the reason y the other slavery is spoken about more. IT affected us the most and it's effects are now self perpetuating with little maintenance needed by current cac's. That's not a way to ignore or make excuses for Arab slavery... But that's not the one that hits home. problack people are concerned about black people... When arabs effect us we speak out about it... for example degrading businesses in our communities. We don't give a fukk if they are Muslim at that point.. There is more to it than this.... but basically the reactions are appropriately targeted.

 

[theworldismine13]

All of the main religions were started by black people. Is religion, peoples natural way of life, no but I'm not going around trying to get people to stop what they've been doing. If they practice christianity, islam, judaism etc and it's helping them as a person then there's nothing wrong with that. I could sit here tell all the people everything white christians did to them. Are they going to change, some perhaps, but the majority will keep following. And that's ok because I know and understand that religion isn't responsible for the genocide. PEOPLE WITH INTENTIONS USING RELIGION are responsible for things like that. When you try to destroy peoples belief system, they wont like that because that's all they have. Normally people don't stand in harsh weather, they go for shelter.

Peace

i believe in freedom of religion, people should practice whatever religion they want to practice, the slavery background of christianity is well known and the history of islamic slavery should also be well known

and it should also be known that arabs and white people are not friends of black people

that is what some black scholars from henrik clarke and chancelor williams to now marcus garvey jr and i co-sign that

beyond making sure the facts are straight i dont really have any comment about another human's personal beliefs or about religions in general, i am a strong believer in individual freedom

 

[Dusty Bake Activate]

You guys aren't pro black and aren't fully invested in the black community -so you can't see why the Tran Atlantic is the one that is pointed out.

Lol... you are such a cornball.

 

[Blackking]

a lot of what you are talking about is not in my post. if you are going to quote me, why not stick to what the quote says?

elitism and religion as the end all-be all culprit are not in my post, nor are they positions i have upheld in other threads, and considering your history here and on SOHH, you should be able to remember as much. all one can accurately surmise from my post is that i think adoption of foreign imperialist religions is a problem to some degree. the actual degree is not mentioned at all, but given my time posting, anybody who is a KTL/HL regular knows that i have never once stated that religion was the cause of all that is bad in the world, let alone islam. so a regular poster would be able to put together that i only blame islam and christianity partially. i fully agree that removing them from the equation would not account for everything.

so now that we have established that my only point is that imperialist religions play a part, and that's a fact, so lets move on...

being against foreign-born religions does not translate into also blaming native african religions, so "Africans had similar religions long before the religions, we discuss, ever existed.." doesnt matter. i actually have said on several occasions in other threads that i would prefer africans worship their native beliefs over islam and christianity. this is something i have specifically advocated, breh. you have to not let your caping for muhammed cloud your judgement. the "main motivator" for imperialism is profit or power, not religion. religion just softens up the victim.

the most ironic thing is your attack on elitism, when quite a few of your posts in your time posting from all the way back, sound like someone who either is an elitist, or wishes he were one in terms of socioeconomic status.

Whatever about the religious stuff.

About attacks on elitist.... I mean I don't like elitist for obvious reasons... but I only attack black elitist. That's what you've seen me attack.

I don't like them and I don't like how they look down on urban black and poor blacks. They love to ignore how societal factors and economics play a role is status and culture. They think of the black community like a hostest cupcake. I know that's a wack metaphor.. but it's all I can think of. The 'white' middle is them and their identity and culture.. and that's the good part. Only if they can't break off the dark, urban, ignorant, poor parts then we will be more accepted as a whole by society and the world. They want to leave the masses in the dust and basically talk shyt about them. They talk about all the problems in the black community but don't do shyt to help.

Of course I promote economic prosperity, of course I have to make money n shyt.. I have 7 people to support. There are hood nikkas who might say I'm uppity, but I'm not a black elitist. by definition I might be close to it, but my mentality isn't the same as theirs. I find their methods and agendas counterproductive. Also, I actually love urban culture and don't diss it... I don't like the super ignorant shyt... but I at least understand it.

 

[Hip-Hop-Bulls]

i believe in freedom of religion, people should practice whatever religion they want to practice, the slavery background of christianity is well known and the history of islamic slavery should also be well known

and it should also be known that arabs and white people are not friends of black people

that is what some black scholars from henrik clarke and chancelor williams to now marcus garvey jr and i co-sign that

beyond making sure the facts are straight i dont really have any comment about another human's personal beliefs or about religions in general, i am a strong believer in individual freedom

as long as you understand that the religion itself is not bad everything is good. there's a reason why blacks say the white man is the devil, not "christians are devils".