Does the large Caribbean presence in NYC's Hip Hop scene explain the disconnect with other regions?

[Kanika]

nothing revisionist about what she said.

And dancehall wasnt around when hip hop was created. Hip hop is comparable to funk and disco not early 70's reggae

A lot of Jamaicanstuff believe that reggae and dancehall music birthed hip hop, but it didn't. Hip hop artists sampled a lot Jazz, Funk, Soul, and Disco records in their songs.

 

[Kanika]

Prior to hip hop there was funk and soul which is more linked to it than reggae.

 

[Kanika]

If rapping is the art of rhythmically rhymin over a beat then jazz and blues artists were doing this in the 1920s.

 

[Kanika]

We could start with the 100s of jazz records that were sampled to make at least 50% of classic rap records

 

[IllmaticDelta]

@Kanika why you going so hard?



This is total fukkery

The fact you keep saying toast shows you're on some revisionist shyt. How old are you?

Rapping and DEEJAYing both come from the mic man/selector dynamic.

what we now call rapping, Aframs were doing on record since the 1920's. What Jamaica's call Deejaying came from what they call Toasting, which they got from Afram R&B radio DJ's who were doing rhyming jive/patter/slick talk live on air in the 1940's/1950's. This same Jive was found on Jazz and R&B records.

Dancehall and rap music are mirror images of each other.

The similarities in the 2 first come from both having roots in older Afram practices that I just explained above. The 2nd influence when Rap/HipHop became a full blow musical genre by the late 1970's, Jamaican's heard early HipHOp records which shifted the Jamaican Toasting styles syncopation which is why they went from







..........then they heard American Rap in the late 1970's






...and then in the early 1980's modern jamaican dancehall was born when they started using HipHop-Rap style syncopation to the beat when the jamaica toasting was always freelanced/not relating directly to the beat










this is basically all confirmed by Supercat

Supercat basically hints at it here

Super Cat was saying specifically that Rappers Delight was HUGE in Jamaica.

@2:23



shouts to @The Ruler 09 for posting that.

 

[Kanika]

This was being discussed in another thread:
The biggest lie in Hip hop history is that DJ Kool Herc introduced Jamaican toasting to New York and therefore created rapping/mc'ing. I keep telling people that DJ Kool Herc is not an MC. He's a DJ! So many hip hop pioneers always mention DJ Hollywood, Jocko Henderson, Hustlers Convention, The Last Poets, James Brown, Hank Spann, Eddie Cheeba, The Watts Prophets, Scott-Heron, etc.. as their inspiration for rapping. No mentions of Jamaican music legends.










And then it get brought up again with someone referencing my first post:














Anyone got any thoughts on this?

@IllmaticDelta @Meh @mobbinfms @K.O.N.Y

 

[IllmaticDelta]

As a New Yorker who grew up in the 80's the Caribbean influence was not significant. Most people from the islands are in Brooklyn. Unless they're fresh off the boat they're usually Americanized. Hip Hop is African American culture as most black people in NY have southern roots especially in Harlem.

Musically where is the Caribbean influence in early hip hop? It was James Brown, break beats, funk, disco, and soul which are all American. The only reggae song I knew as a kid was "Pass the Dutchie." It wasn't until Shelly Thunder or Shabba Ranks did reggae/dancehall pick up in NY.

In this recent interview with Fat Joe below, he was talking about Krs "Bridge Is Over" and said that was about the first time he heard Jamaican styled/flavor music and remember, he was street kid from the South Bronx and that was already in the mid 1980s

http://www.thecoli.com/threads/the-cipher-show-podcast-fat-joe-remy-ma.418033/#post-18667831

The only Carib music that was really known in NY on a mainstream scale was a combination of AfroCuban and Puerto Rican music through Salsa and Latin-Boogaloo.

 

[bouncy]

I was watching "Noisey:Jamaica" on viceland, and one of the professors said rap came from Jamaica because of Kool Herc, and Bambatta, being they're both west indian

She had the host saying it too!


THANK YOU @IllmaticDelta for helping spread the truth, because we have proof to counteract the lies that seems to be part of hip hop history in the mainstream.

Salute to YOU

BTW, for those who think that people like myself are hating on Jamaicans just because we argue against the teaching of rap music starting in Jamaica, that isn't true. I have love for Jamaicans who have love for me. When I was watching the show, it reminded me of the people I grew up with, and enjoyed life with, I would be foul to shyt on Jamaicans when I had fun times with them. I just like the truth to be told, that is it. I'm not banging on Caribbean people

 

[↓R↑LYB]

Reading this thread really made me fukking miss block parties. There were two things I couldn't wait for during the summer. When nikkas would open up the fire hydrants and the block parties on Church Ave

I always told myself one day I'd throw a block party, but I don't think it'd have the same effect as them Brooklyn summers in the 90s

 

[bouncy]

Reading this thread really made me fukking miss block parties. There were two things I couldn't wait for during the summer. When nikkas would open up the fire hydrants and the block parties on Church Ave

I always told myself one day I'd throw a block party, but I don't think it'd have the same effect as them Brooklyn summers in the 90s

People not even outside like it used to be for us back then

 

[head shots101]

Nah, there is a lot of grey area within the concept of "Caribbean" in NYC. Most of the cats you mentioned probably don't have a lot of interaction with Caribbean culture like that. At some point cats become "Americanized" completely to the point the Caribbean influence is minimal. It should be noted that the South Bronx which is deemed the birthplace of hip-hop has always had a very small Caribbean population/influence, my classmates always talked about going down south growing up...outside of PR's nobody talking about there Caribbean background.

Real talk Jamaicans were never heavy in the south bx....mostly Spanish cats....yardies heavy in the north Bronx.....white plains road, gunhill Rd, baychester Ave etc

 

[IllmaticDelta]

I was watching "Noisey:Jamaica" on viceland, and one of the professors said rap came from Jamaica because of Kool Herc, and Bambatta, being they're both west indian

She had the host saying it too!

 

[IllmaticDelta]

listen to andre 3000's thoughts

 

[ISO]

Nah, there is a lot of grey area within the concept of "Caribbean" in NYC. Most of the cats you mentioned probably don't have a lot of interaction with Caribbean culture like that. At some point cats become "Americanized" completely to the point the Caribbean influence is minimal. It should be noted that the South Bronx which is deemed the birthplace of hip-hop has always had a very small Caribbean population/influence, my classmates always talked about going down south growing up...outside of PR's nobody talking about there Caribbean background.

The South Bronx is full of PR, DR, West Indians, Africans, and AA's. Lots of people from the Carribbean.

On my block there's a rasta spot where you see old Jamaicans drinking and playing dominos. On 167th street there is a Jamaican bakery. They not as deep as North Bronx and Gun Hill area but they in the South BX heavy too.

 

[AB Ziggy]

The South Bronx is full of PR, DR, West Indians, Africans, and AA's. Lots of people from the Carribbean.

On my block there's a rasta spot where you see old Jamaicans drinking and playing dominos. On 167th street there is a Jamaican bakery. They not as deep as North Bronx and Gun Hill area but they in the South BX heavy too.

Dominicans and Mexicans are on the come up fast