Does Lebron have sole claim to his own era?

[The Devil's Advocate]

After drafting MJ, in the next five years the Bulls proceeded to draft Horace Grant, B.J. Armstrong, Stacey King, Will Purdue, and Toni Kukoc, while also pulling off a draft-day trade that sent #8 pick Olden Polynice to the Sonics for #5 pick Scottie Pippen. That's 3 all-stars and a 6th Man of the Year they surrounded MJ with, including two Hall of Famers. The Bulls had 6 picks in the top-11 between 1985 and 1989, plus two others in the top-20, and they used them well.


After drafting LBJ, in the next six years the Cavs first-round picks were Luke Jackson, Shannon Brown, JJ Hickson, and Christian Eyenga. Only one top-11 pick (Jackson at #10), only one other pick in the top-20 (Hickson at #19). None of them became useful rotation players for the Cavs, Shannon Brown was the only decent pick and he was too young and raw at the time, spent years in the G-League bouncing around to Chicago and Charlotte and LA and then finally becoming a rotation player in his fourth season.



That's the difference. Bulls picked at #6, #8, #10, #11, #18, and #20, and used them well. Cavs picked at #10 and #19 and didn't do shyt with them.

None of them made the all star in that year... Jordan didn't play with another all star in the same year until pippen made it...

Y'all really wasn't outside

 

[The Devil's Advocate]

When Bron won his first two championships Kobe was still considered one of the Top 10 players in basketball, unless you're about to tell me 10 guys who were better than Kobe in 2012 and 2013 ...

If you're a Top 10 player you're definitely within your prime, even if its your late prime...

I could easily make the argument that '13 Duncan was the last year of his prime too, meaning Bron won two rings while Tim was in his prime, based on the fact Duncan finished 2nd in DBPM; 4th in DWS; 6th in BPM; 6th in PER; 7th in MVP voting; 13th in WS48; 14th in VORP; and averaged 18 & 10 in 69 regular season games, 18 & 10 in 21 playoff games; and 19 & 12 in 7 Finals games...

We not about to play this game like Duncan, or Kobe, were these washed rotation guys when Bron started winning championships...

But fukk all this opinion shyt, we can leave this at facts. Bron entered The League in 2003-04 season, Kobe and Duncan left the NBA in 2015-16 season. These guys had a 13-year career overlap with Bron...

In the 13 years, 2003-16, that Bron, Duncan, and Kobe were all in the NBA together:

most championships
Bron 3x ('12, '13, '16)
Duncan 3x ('05, '07, '14)
Kobe 2x ('09, '10)
most championships as a #1
Bron 3x
Duncan 2x
Kobe 2x
most MVPs
Bron 4x ('09, '10, '12, '13)
Kobe 1x ('08)
Duncan 0
most Finals appearances
Bron 7x ('07, '11, '12, '13, '14, '15, '16)
Kobe 4x ('04, '08, '09, '10)
Duncan 4x ('05, '07, '13, '14)

And I'm leaving out Top 5 MVP finishes, All-NBA teams, 1st Team All-NBAs, FMVPs, All-Star appearances, conference finals runs, because the gap just grows in favor of LeBron...

We can have separate opinions but the facts are that these 3 players were in The League together 13 years, thats a whole career, and Bron is #1 in every category during the time all 3 guys played at the same time. He dominated an era that had Duncan and Kobe still playing in their primes for most of those 13 years...

Shaq was in his prime thru '06 and Garnett was in his prime thru '08; Bron wasnt winning while those two were in their primes but hell he may not have entered his own prime whej those guys were still in theirs...

We agree on something ...

Bruh you're a repeat offender low quality poster. How does Bron not have an era that he won the most of everything in?

Kobe won 5 championships in 11 years but was the #2 for 3 of them...

Bron won 4 championships in 9 years and was the #1 for all of them...

"Too many people beat Bron" okay my nikka. None of these guys won more than Bron during his time in the NBA. Didn't win more anything. Not more rings or MVPs or anything else...

Kobe had about 13 years as a #1 and got 2 titles out if it. All-Time player but this nikka career was not on the level of Bron's and you know it, it wasn't on Duncan's...

All this typing... Bro... When was Bron's era... Point it out and we'll go from there.

 

[Professor Emeritus]

And Robert Horry.........

Ain't y'all tired of this weak argument.. Pippen was second fiddle.. Kobe was 1A. Kobe avg more points per game in those playoffs for the first three rings (21, 29, 26) than ANY year Pippen played in the playoffs but one (22).. That one year he avg 22, was the year Jordan left and they didn't even make the finals..

Y'all act like Kobe was Darko when the nikka was avg 29 fukking points a game by the second title run..

Please cut it out

PPG stans have to be the lowest info posters here. I wonder what Bill Russell is to you, since he averaged less than Pippen in 9 of his 11 titles? Or how about Wilt, since he averaged 21ppg and 14ppg in his two title years? Magic Johnson averaged 18, 17, 17, 21, and 19 in his title years....was he just a "second fiddle" player like Pippen?

Kobe was a volume shooter who took advantage of the attention Shaq got, while Pippen was the Bulls' best distributor, rebounder, and defender as well as an excellent secondary scorer who let MJ do the volume shooting. Their contributions to the first three-peat were about the same. This argument been had.

 

[Osmosis]

And Robert Horry.........

Ain't y'all tired of this weak argument.. Pippen was second fiddle.. Kobe was 1A. Kobe avg more points per game in those playoffs for the first three rings (21, 29, 26) than ANY year Pippen played in the playoffs but one (22).. That one year he avg 22, was the year Jordan left and they didn't even make the finals..

Y'all act like Kobe was Darko when the nikka was avg 29 fukking points a game by the second title run..

Please cut it out

Pippen averaged 21 points, 9 rebounds and 7 assists in the finals during the first 3peat.

Kobe averaged 22 points, 6 rebounds and 5 assists in the finals during his 3peat.

The 2001 playoffs are the only year where Kobe's numbers were comparable to Shaq. In the 2000 playoffs, Shaq averaged 10 more PPG. How is that a 1A situation?

 

[Professor Emeritus]

None of them made the all star in that year... Jordan didn't play with another all star in the same year until pippen made it...

Y'all really wasn't outside

"that year" being what year? I'm not sure you're following the discussion.

Before Pippen made All-Star, Jordan had won a total of 3 playoff series in 5 years. He wasn't going anywhere until Pippen was playing at elite All-NBA level and Horace Grant was a borderline All-Star.

 

[The Devil's Advocate]

PPG stans have to be the lowest info posters here. I wonder what Bill Russell is to you, since he averaged less than Pippen in 9 of his 11 titles? Or how about Wilt, since he averaged 21ppg and 14ppg in his two title years? Magic Johnson averaged 18, 17, 17, 21, and 19 in his title years....was he just a "second fiddle" player like Pippen?

Kobe was a volume shooter who took advantage of the attention Shaq got, while Pippen was the Bulls' best distributor, rebounder, and defender as well as an excellent secondary scorer who let MJ do the volume shooting. Their contributions to the first three-peat were about the same. This argument been had.

Everything that goes against your narrative is low info now... Shaq would tell you Kobe was 1A.... Kobe and shaq shot the same amount of attempts during their playoff run.. Kobe shot 43-46% and shaq hovered around 55%.. They literally shot the same volume of shots but he was just a role player I guess huh?

Let me repeat this cause you probably didn't read... Pippen avg his most points WHEN JORDAN WASN'T PLAYING... it was 22 motherfukking points.. As the leader of the team. So how we blaming Jordan for this? He's the better defender yet made 1 more defensive team while playing more seasons and never was the leader in anything but Jordan was the 3 time steals leader... Jordan holds a defensive rating for his career slightly worse than Pippen (103 compared to 102). But Jordan barely holds the edge in defensive box plus/minus rating (2.0 to 1.8).

Bill Russell one of the best ever cause we compare to other people in their eras.. I'm not going to compare Pippen to fukking Russell like I would Pippen to Kobe.. Pippen, Jordan, Kobe, Shaq all played each other.

 

[The Devil's Advocate]

Pippen averaged 21 points, 9 rebounds and 7 assists in the finals during the first 3peat.

Kobe averaged 22 points, 6 rebounds and 5 assists in the finals during his 3peat.

The 2001 playoffs are the only year where Kobe's numbers were comparable to Shaq. In the 2000 playoffs, Shaq averaged 10 more PPG. How is that a 1A situation?

I'm sorry. I didn't know when I said playoffs, that it only consisted of the Finals.. How exactly do you get to finals again?

 

[The Devil's Advocate]

"that year" being what year? I'm not sure you're following the discussion.

Before Pippen made All-Star, Jordan had won a total of 3 playoff series in 5 years. He wasn't going anywhere until Pippen was playing at elite All-NBA level and Horace Grant was a borderline All-Star.

The post was on some "they drafted 3 all stars"

They weren't all stars though until years after pippen was one. So Jordan wasn't playing with 3 all stars.. He didn't play with an ACTIVE all star until Pippen made it. Once that happened, he won a ring in every full season with the Bulls

 

[Osmosis]

I'm sorry. I didn't know when I said playoffs, that it only consisted of the Finals.. How exactly do you get to finals again?

You didn't mention the finals because Pippen had better finals numbers

Shaq's numbers were better in every playoff run. He was clearly the best player on the team during the 3peat, especially in 2000.

Kobe 2000-2002 playoffs: 26/6/5 on 53 TS%
Shaq 2000-2002 playoffs: 30/14/3 on 56 TS%

Kobe 2000-2002 finals: 22/6/5 on 51 TS%
Shaq 2000-2002 finals: 36/15/4 on 60 TS%

 

[The Devil's Advocate]

You didn't mention the finals because Pippen had better finals numbers

Shaq's numbers were better in every playoff run. He was clearly the best player on the team during the 3peat, especially in 2000.

Kobe 2000-2002 playoffs: 26/6/5 on 53 TS%
Shaq 2000-2002 playoffs: 30/14/3 on 56 TS%

Kobe 2000-2002 finals: 22/6/5 on 51 TS%
Shaq 2000-2002 finals: 36/15/4 on 60 TS%

No I didn't mention it because you need to get to the finals first

I forgot we in the microwave era and the only that matters is 4 games out of a 90-100(82 plus offs) game season

Also never said he wasn't the best player on the team... fukk is you talking about. I said Kobe wasn't some bum role player. He was right there with him and Shaq would tell you the same

 

[Inertia Creeps]

"Jordan didn't have his own era cause the Bulls drafted superstars like Kukoc and Stacey King". "Bron has been the best player since 2009 (The year Dwight Howard ran him out one of the weakest ever Eastern conferences) and STLL has a case right now, this era is all his!! "

Some of the literal worst takes ever in the history of human endeavor and global sport. SAS and Skip of all people would laugh at the stupidity. Find ANYTHING else to talk about. Go study how long it takes acrylic paint to dry and make TLR threads about that instead. ANYTHING but these deluded Bron takes, I'm BEGGING you goofy dumbasses to not embarrass humankind any further keeping this idiocy up nonstop.

 

[Osmosis]

No I didn't mention it because you need to get to the finals first

I forgot we in the microwave era and the only that matters is 4 games out of a 90-100(82 plus offs) game season

Also never said he wasn't the best player on the team... fukk is you talking about. I said Kobe wasn't some bum role player. He was right there with him and Shaq would tell you the same

Nobody said he was a bum role player. Was Scottie a bum role player? Kobe was arguably the best number #2 of all time but he was a number #2 for three of his rings. You can't argue that he has his own era and Duncan, Bron, Shaq, and Steph don't when they all won as many or more rings as the best player on their team.

 

[Professor Emeritus]

Everything that goes against your narrative is low info now... Shaq would tell you Kobe was 1A.... Kobe and shaq shot the same amount of attempts during their playoff run.. Kobe shot 43-46% and shaq hovered around 55%.. They literally shot the same volume of shots but he was just a role player I guess huh?

Let me repeat this cause you probably didn't read... Pippen avg his most points WHEN JORDAN WASN'T PLAYING... it was 22 motherfukking points.. As the leader of the team. So how we blaming Jordan for this?

Your post yet again ignores the fact that PPG stans are the lowest info posters out there.

I pointed out that your entire post ignored that PPG doesn't define a player's role, then you doubled down on PPG again. Explain to me how Magic Johnson was just a role player sidekick again, considering his PPG is lower than Pippen's.

 

[McPiff]

y'all are hilarious as fukk

 

[Ozymandeas]

We don't argue with psychotic Bron stans. They have an insecurity when it comes to Kobe. Neg them and move on.