black feminism/womanism thread

mcdivit85

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do we really need a patriarchy? what kind of stupid question is that. every other group functions as a patriarchy, we are the only group that doesn't have a stable patriarchy. which is why black folks as a collective are getting our asses kicked by other patriachies. the white mans patriarchy, the indian mans patriarchy, the arab mans patriarchy, the asian mans patriarchy, even the mexicans patriarchy--we're the only ones on some dumb shyt, where we've equalized our duties and responsibilities to that of our women.

this is why i dont take black feminism seriously. they brainwash nikkas into thinking everything that we would need to thrive is somehow evil and oppressive. go on, and keep trying support the unaccountable black woman and her puesdo matriarchy, see how far it'll get you.

i know this much, most complaints black feminist have stem directly from black men not being in the proper position, economically. without black men leading an intact patriarchal structure, where we control the economic landscape of black neighborhoods; the black communities problems will continue to persist.

Bro, we agree on this topic.

"Black feminism" is nothing more than a select group of black women who are upset that they cannot enjoy the fruits of patriarchy like every other race of women does. So, instead of trying to make their men stronger by supporting the uplift of black men, so they can be protected socially, politically and financially, they turn inward and start to become the black female version of the very system disenfranchising black men.

Seeing black men as competition, they align themselves with ideologies that were born out of white supremacy but packaged in a way to make black feminists feel as if they had the same fight against black men that white women had against white men.

The funniest thing about black feminists is their jealousy of white women is their main motive and always comes to the surface, which is why white feminists don't take them seriously. They know most black feminists would trade places with them in one minute....in society and in the bed with the very white patriarch who creates the system they claim to hate. Its all about sour grapes.

I say they get no quarter on this side.

Peace
 

NoMoreWhiteWoman2020

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:what:

So, what are the tenets of black feminism that do NOT originate or off shoot from those of white female feminism against white male partriarchy?

And if black feminism is not related to white women and/or their fight against white patriarchy, then we're left with black women fighting against black patriarchy, which is non-existent due to lack of resources and lack of political clout.

So, with that in mind.....

What structural inequalities within society have been setup by black men, who don't even have enough control to not be brutalized by said society, to disenfranchise black women?

When have black men created laws that prohibited black women from voting?

When have black men created laws that prohibited black women from being able to own land?

What industries controlled by black men, past and present, pay women half the amount they pay men for the same job?

Please advise.

Peace
breh, do me a favor and read some of the links in the OP. You may think your questions are profound, but all they really say is that you have read zero things on the topic, but you still want to form a critical opinion.

check this out
https://nashvillefeministart.files.wordpress.com/2014/06/1981_angela-davis-women-race-class.pdf
 

mcdivit85

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Thanks for the tag @J-Nice ....

I always viewed Black feminism or womanism as an appeal for recognition and rights from a system designed to make you less than. I don't view it as an attack on patriarchy or Black manhood.

But Black women not wanting to be treated like dirt is = white supremacy on the Coli.... Go figure

Ok, but who is "black feminism" targeted at? Does it speak to white supremacy or just complain about black women not being leaders of the NAACP?

Why are black feminists quiet when speaking about the real culprit, white male patriarchy, which is also tied to racism/white supremacy? But loud as hell when it comes to "black male privilege"?

Peace
 

mcdivit85

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breh, do me a favor and read some of the links in the OP. You may think your questions are profound, but all they really say is that you have read zero things on the topic, but you still want to form a critical opinion.

check this out
https://nashvillefeministart.files.wordpress.com/2014/06/1981_angela-davis-women-race-class.pdf

Bro, my questions are not profound at all......that's my point.

Do those links answer my basic questions about "black feminism"? If not, then that would be a waste of time since I'm only asking basic, logical questions about this "movement" and why it exists.

Peace
 

mcdivit85

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True. It's sad and infuriating. Instead of using that anger to challenge patriarchal white supremacy they take their frustration out on BW because, as much as they complain about him, BM envy WM and what want he has. These types of BM don't care about doing right. They only care about doing what benefits them (often at another's expense). Not only that but many BM are cowards and simple. It's easier to blame and fight BW since we have less power in a patriarchal society. In the end, BW get left behind.

Please answer these two questions:

How can the black populace compete with non-black communities, who are patriarchal ,for land and resources when we are matriarchal?

Considering the over-arching issue of race, why do black women feel the need to have a separate movement from the men of their race?

Peace
 

mcdivit85

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Yes, we need to come together as women, and help these baby girls know their worth, so that the next generation of black women can be even better. Through education we can boost our babies' collective self-esteem and stimulate their minds, so that they can make better choices. Black women really need to stick together. We are all we really have. I love that today's womanism is almost relentless in that pursuit.

You no care about the next generation of black men? Why not? How can you care about one half of a population and not the other?

And if you do only care about one side, then how are your ideals healthy for the larger population?

And what about the mates for the "next generation of black women"? If you don't care about black men, then one can only assume :mjpls:

Peace
 

Blackking

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nikka, don't go on a child's temper tantrum and catch a bytchy attitude because what I said goes against your agenda. You out here cherry pickin quotes and don't even know the context in what you talking about :francis:


You do know that there is more than 1 facet of feminism that has nothing to do with American feminism. Ever head of African Womanism/ Feminism?:francis:

Thomas Sankara was regarded around the world as a feminist because of his policies and efforts to put women on the same standing as men:francis:

The very definition of Feminism itself is this








You need to smarten the fukk up and think before you fukking type :francis:
I read that thing you posted about Sankara ... that's actually what I was talking about. :manny:

You're still telling me what white people, liberals, and racist feminist "regarded" Thomas sankara as. I'm not cherry picking anything... I'm saying it how he said and you're saying how white supremacist state it:manny:


What makes you think I have an attitude about it , just because I said pro black is For ALL black people?:manny:

I actually Activity participate in causes here. I even went to africa to educate on female Genital Mutations where my peps from. I always notice the Hillary Clinton style black feminist ( like you)... and the Assata Shukur , Thomas Sankura type women liberation activist....

There is a huge difference. I'm not mad, so don't be upset with me just for pointing it out:francis:





One thing that extreme black feminists and ignorant rappers have in common is that they've both been fueled by white corporate money to ignite a war against black people of the opposite gender. Don't let racism pressure you into telling a harmful lie. Let's start telling the TRUTH. Black men and black women should support and love one another, and not fall victim to the white supremacist ideal that we should be mortal enemies. When we spend all of our time disrespecting and emasculating one another, the greatest victims in this plantation warfare are our children. - Dr. Boyce Watkins

“Unity is strength; division is weakness.” —Swahili proverb



Feminism, which was touted as an avenue available to all women, has not been kind to Black women. As a matter of fact, White feminists have appropriated most of the benefits of feminists without acknowledging their own race and class privileges. – R.M.

Black Feminism has become the newest front in the war on Black unity by fundamentally destroying the male-female dynamic that produces healthy Black families. Black Feminists talk at length about the importance of understanding gender, and yet give Black children no context for what a strong, healthy, mature Black man looks like by excluding them from the home and replacing them with other women or white men.

Black Feminists are the first to suggest an alternative to the Black man. Take these screenshots from popular feminist sites…


:manny:
 

Blackout

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You no care about the next generation of black men? Why not? How can you care about one half of a population and not the other?

And if you do only care about one side, then how are your ideals healthy for the larger population?

And what about the mates for the "next generation of black women"? If you don't care about black men, then one can only assume :mjpls:

Peace
You see it too right?

All of her talk centers around black women yet she doesnt show much priority with connecting with black men.

Not to mention without both black women and black men having black love that just leaves biracial/mixed women and less black women. :yeshrug:
 

Blackking

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You see it too right?

All of her talk centers around black women yet she doesnt show much priority with connecting with black men.

Not to mention without both black women and black men having black love that just leaves biracials and less black women. :yeshrug:
we have an event on this coming up:yeshrug:

i suggest everyone does this in their city because there are those in our community who take what you just said.. for granted.

10429411_1439703856325680_6984986187049387984_n.jpg
 

Onlooker

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Please answer these two questions:

How can the black populace compete with non-black communities, who are patriarchal ,for land and resources when we are matriarchal?

Considering the over-arching issue of race, why do black women feel the need to have a separate movement from the men of their race?

Peace

Before I answer your questions I just need some clarification. When you say "we are matriarchal" are you referring to our communities or to our households?
 

Westcoastnative

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Couldn't you say the same thing about Black patriarchy? Since modern Black patriarchy is heavily derived from Western/White concepts of patriarchy. Seems to me like Black men might just be trying to parrot White men.

What are you talking about?! Every race/group has a patriarchal structure that works well except in the Black community so patriarchy isn't exclusive to just white men. Black patriarchy died in the 70's due to feminism and the black matriarchy that has plagued our community for over 40 years has been an apocalyptic failure.

This is one of main reasons Black women are not valued compared to other races of women. A patriarchal structure uplifts, protects, and promote their women as the best. Will there be sexism? Of course but you can fight sexism without fighting and destroying patriarchy, that's what other races of women do.
 
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You see it too right?

All of her talk centers around black women yet she doesnt show much priority with connecting with black men.

Not to mention without both black women and black men having black love that just leaves biracial/mixed women and less black women. :yeshrug:

:francis: I guess she plans on being a lesbian or something...

Coli woman-haters are always accused of being gay, so its only fair to assume that their counterparts are lesbians...
 

Blackking

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Yes, we need to come together as women, and help these baby girls know their worth, so that the next generation of black women can be even better. Through education we can boost our babies' collective self-esteem and stimulate their minds, so that they can make better choices. Black women really need to stick together. We are all we really have. I love that today's womanism is almost relentless in that pursuit.
Hello Queen.

Do you have any thoughts on this? I'm just wondering what you think because your opinion is so respected around here.

Peace love.

4 Reasons Feminism is a Threat to Black Consciousness

Has the rise of Black Feminism unified or divided Black men and women?
What is the purpose of Black Feminism?

Every member of United Black America and the Pan-African Alliance knows that there is only one crime punishable by expulsion and/or death – promoting disunity among our people. Every other shortcoming, from miseducation and ignorance to moral faults can be dealt with. We do not look down on others for not being “perfect”, however, when an individual seeks to divide and destroy the unity of our people, that person does so intentionally and therefore must be held to the harshest standards of accountability.

We know that unity is one of the biggest problems we face in the Black community, and so ideas and practices that seek to further divide and destroy us must be examined and corrected.

We also know, thanks to the works of Dr. Frances Cress Welsing that sex can be used as a weapon to maintain white supremacy over Black men and women.

Many of our sisters have become “Black Feminists”, and many brothers have become “Sex-negative” or “anti-sex” feminists. This relatively new movement promises a more “conscious” and less “oppressive” atmosphere for those who choose to exercise their identities in ways that mainstream society may not recognize. But in the context of Black Consciousness, is this movement responsible for the unification or the further division of the Black man and woman – the two elements that make up the Black survival unit known as the family?

dont-want-no-manedit-300x261.png


If we are to protect ourselves from the weapons of white supremacy and begin to heal ourselves from the wounds that these weapons have inflicted, we must understand how those weapons came into play in the first place, as well as how they are used in contemporary settings. Therefore, all of us must understand where feminism came from and how it is being used as a tool to keep us confused, divided, conquered, and fighting amongst ourselves.

Lets start at the beginning….

A Short History of Black Feminism
Feminism, as defined by the Webster’s New World Dictionary is “1. the principle that women should have political, economic, and social rights equal to those of men; 2. the movement to win these rights.” The term was created by a male French philosopher in 1872 who believed in a perfect, Utopian world. The world during the late 19th and early 20th century was a place where power was concentrated in the hands of white men. It was feminism that sought to bring balance to this concentration of power by granting women the right to participate in politics, parenting, and economic advancement (to include expanded job opportunities and property rights).

The “First Wave” of feminism began when white women banded together to demand a share of power, and the opportunity to fully and equally participate as members of society. Organizations like the the National American Woman Suffrage Association (comprised entirely of white women that denied membership to Black Women) drafted and pressured congress to pass the Nineteenth Amendment to the United States Constitution in 1919, granting all women the right to vote. It is important to note that all Blacks were granted the right in 1870, but were blocked from doing so in practice the end of Jim Crow laws. Black women, however, suffered from both racism and sexism, and so received virtually none of the benefits of the women’s suffrage movement.

In 1954, Blacks in America mustered together enough political and legal power to overturn school segregation in the legendary Brown v. Board of Education (Topeka, 1954) kicking off the Civil Rights Movement. One of the most important pieces of legislation was the 1964 Civil Rights Act, originally drafted to end Jim Crow laws once and for all. However, the bill was highjacked by white feminist organizations like the National Organization for Women (NOW) to advance opportunities for white women as well as all other minorities. The hijacking of the Civil Rights movement by white feminists began the “Second Wave” of feminism.

Once again, Black women found themselves left out and unrepresented in the white feminist movement but were still able to secure power for their race. Women like Rosa Parks, Daisy Bates, Mary Mcleod Bethune, and Rev. Dr. Prathia Hall (who was the inspiration for Dr. King’s I Have A Dream Speech) helped make the movement successful. Six of the “Little Rock Nine” were women, and thousands of unnamed and unknown women spilled their blood alongside Black men to secure a better future for the entire race – not just for their gender.

But whereas organizations like Stokely Carmichael’s Student Nonviolent Coordinating Committee (SNCC)’s encouraged Black female leadership, the Black Panther Party and other smaller Black Power organizations restricted women from positions of leadership. Assata Shakur and Angela Davis found themselves being subjected to the same forms of oppression that they found in the white world. Disenchanted with their subordinate role in the Black Power movement, and unwelcome in the white women’s suffrage movement, Black women set out to define their own place in the world. Thus, the “Third Wave” of feminism emerged.

Rather than serving to bridge the divide between Black male and female relations and their equality in a white supremacist society, Black Feminism became a perpetuation of the same miseducated thinking that led to the destruction of Black civilization.

The Black Power movement sought to set Blacks free from the harmful influences of white society. Black Feminism saw integration into that society and the adoption of white values as a way to achieve equality. Ideas concerning race and sex gave rise to those who believed that there are no inherent differences between the sexes and that gender roles were created by social conditioning.

Black Feminism evolved as white supremacists began to change their tactics to cope with the rise of Black Consciousness. The Black Feminist movement was fertile ground for several weapons of white supremacy, including miscegenation, integration, miseducation, sex, and eugenics. With reproductive rights being a cornerstone of the Feminist movement, Planned Parenthood launched an all out campaignto encourage Black women to voluntarily participate in eugenics.

White supremacists also saw the destruction of the community as an important factor in destroying the Black Power movement at large. Black communities were flooded with drugs by the same governments that unleashed an army of police officers to disproportionately prosecute Black men and imprison them for decades – thus leaving women to single-handedly raise children while working to cover the income lost by the male of the household.

These circumstances produced “independent women”, who came to spite the Black man missing from the family unit, and the “career woman”, who bypassed having children to attend college and climb the corporate ladder in white owned companies. Some Black feminists turned to lesbianism to have their intimate needs met. Others abandoned Black men entirely to enter interracial relationships.

All of these results played perfectly into the tactics of white supremacy, whose original goal was to prevent the rise of a unified Black movement that could destabilize the concentration of power in white hands.

Today, Black feminism has evolved into a movement that sets Black women against Black men, promotes both violence and victim-hood, spreads extremist thinking, and that demonstrates white supremacy in action. Here’s how:
 

Blackking

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@bcrusaderw Feminism Sets Black Women against Black Men
You must use the [Black] female vs. the [Black] male. And the [Black] male vs. the [Black] female. – Willie Lynch Letter

“I’d rather be a white mans whore than the gum on a black mans shoe. fukk black men.” – Kola boof, Black Feminist.

Black Feminist Kola Boof, whose tweet is shown above, has more than 17,000 twitter followers. 17,000 oftentimes young and impressionable girls and women who carry these words with them into interactions with every Black man that crosses their path. Kola Boof suggests that if she had her choice of being in one position of inferiority to the white man versus the Black man, she would choose the white man. Why? Is this not white supremacist thinking in action? And yet, this woman with this mindset serves to influence Black Feminist thought.

Even worse, this woman automatically assumes that she would be placed in a position of inferiority by Black men, thus categorizing ALL Black men of being unworthy of her companionship. With so many great Black men working hard to build themselves and their community, this type of thinking is both inaccurate and worse than any insult that could come from racist whites.

Sometimes, the misguided thinking of Black Feminists lead them to abandon all thoughts of racial solidarity out of fear of “abuse” by some mythical Black patriarchy. For instance, this feminist has said”I Won’t Accept Abuse In The Name Of Racial “Unity”. This statement assumes that abuse must always accompany their participation in the movement for Black unity.

Let me be clear: NO ONE should accept abuse from anyone. The Black Conscious movement is no patriarchy that demands our women fall back and bow down to the men. In fact, if we are to achieve our goals of unification and redemption, we will need 100% of the front-line effort from both our men and our women of equal capacity.

Black Feminists Dictate Rather Than Discuss
One of the favorite bylines of Black Feminism is “anti-oppression”, the assumption that “Men are in no position to tell women they “must” do so. That’s patriarchal control and is the antithesis of feminism. So is trying to silence Black women.”

This is true, for under no circumstances except slavery and tutelage is any one human permitted to tell anyone what they must or must not do.

The problem is that Black feminism constantly attempts to dictate to men what behaviors are acceptable and which behaviors “must not” be tolerated. By doing so, they attempt to do the same things they accuse males of doing with statements like “No Black man can tell Black women what is acceptable.”

Black Feminists choose to completely disregard the opinions of their male counterparts, even if his information is right and exact. In this video, a Black Feminist responds to Dr. Umar Johnson’s statements on Black Feminism versus Womanism. Watch it and leave comments below….



The Black community needs more dialogue, not small groups attempting to dictate to other groups how things are going to be. If unity is what we truly seek, men must learn to compromise with women and vice-verse.

, there are many Black Feminists who refuse to engage in civil dialogue with Black men and cut the conversation off before it even begins.

Black Feminism Perpetrates White Supremacy
Feminism, which was touted as an avenue available to all women, has not been kind to Black women. As a matter of fact, White feminists have appropriated most of the benefits of feminists without acknowledging their own race and class privileges. – R.M.

Media has long been used as a weapon of white supremacy. From the days of feature length films like Birth of a Nation (where African-American men (played by white actors in black face) were portrayed as unintelligent and sexually aggressive towards white women, and the portrayal of the Ku Klux Klan as a heroic force) to….The Black male image is degraded, destroyed, and distorted by record labels (controlled by whites) who seek out the most derogatory elements within the black community and promote them to superstar status.

Just as the movie Birth of A Nation portrayed Black men as unintelligent and sexually aggressive, so to does Black Feminism promote the negative images of Black men as being rapists, aggressive, “bytch” or “ho” cat-callers, or inferior to them in their intellectual capacity.

Just as the architects of this nation wove their racist beliefs into the fabric of society, founders of the feminist movement wove their beliefs on the racial inferiority of Blacks into their feminist beliefs. Here are some of the founding Feminists, in their own words:

Elizabeth Cady Stanton, 1815-1902 (Social activist, abolitionist, author)
“What will we and our daughters suffer if these degraded black men are allowed to have the rights that would make them even worse than our Saxon fathers?”


Laura Clay, 1849-1940 (Founder of Kentucky’s first suffrage group)
“The white men, reinforced by the educated white women, could ‘snow under’ the Negro vote in every State, and the white race would maintain its supremacy without corrupting or intimidating the Negroes.”


Carrie Chapman Catt, 1859-1947 (Founder of the League of Women Voters)
“White supremacy will be strengthened, not weakened, by women’s suffrage.”


The same beliefs that influenced the thinking of early Feminism finds itself preserved in the thinking of today’s Black Feminists. We know that the image of the “degraded Black man” was engineered to dehumanize the Black man and justify his mistreatment by white supremacists.

We also know that Black Feminists like all of the ones mentioned above that spew their divisive ideologies operate as agents of white supremacy. That is not conjecture – through records released through the Freedom of Information Act, we know that agents were planted within Black Feminist student organizations to engage in campaigns of misinformation, while also keeping tabs on other Black organizations.

How many COINTELPRO agents posing as Black feminists were able to draft the policies and thoughts that form the foundation of contemporary Black Feminist thought?

Black Feminism Destroys Black Families
Black Feminism has become the newest front in the war on Black unity by fundamentally destroying the male-female dynamic that produces healthy Black families. Black Feminists talk at length about the importance of understanding gender, and yet give Black children no context for what a strong, healthy, mature Black man looks like by excluding them from the home and replacing them with other women or white men.

Black Feminists are the first to suggest an alternative to the Black man. Take these screenshots from popular feminist sites…

Screen-shot-2014-01-07-at-9.02.29-AM-300x217.png




Screen-shot-2014-01-07-at-9.04.56-AM-171x300.png




Some also suggest that a “loving lesbian household” is better for a child than an imperfect Black male and female couple. For a child to understand what a “good Black man” looks like, and how he conducts himself in the administration of family affairs, the child must be able to see him in action.

Even the most heroic single woman or lesbian team in the world can’t father. So to intentionally deprive any Black child of its Black mother or Black father, except in cases like divorce for grave reasons or the death of a parent, is itself a form of abuse… Every child has a mother and father, and when that figure is missing, there is a narrative that is experienced as pain, loss, and at times shame…Whereas single parenting and divorce have always been understood as a breakdown of the married mom and dad ideal, same-sex parenting is now being elevated as normal. This is not only wrong, but dangerous.

There is Power in the p*ssy
Ladies; you have the power to positively influence the behavior of men. There is power in the p*ssy. Use your power to make better decisions when selecting men. You cannot give up the p*ssy to “cute convicts” and then lament the myth of the absence of good Black men. You cannot jump to divorce and child support as your first resort, rather than choosing the more difficult and productive path of counseling and reconciliation.You cannot choose an alternative sexual orientation, and then blame it on some deficiency on the part of men you bring into your life.

This isn’t a cop out for men – street harassment is real, as is sexual and emotional abuse, violence, and other sociopathic behavior on the part of men who have been victims themselves. Most Black men want to see an end to this behavior as much as Black women do. But perpetrating our divisions by retreating into Black feminist thinking is not the way forward. Using dialog and your power for the benefit of our community is.
 
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