black feminism/womanism thread

[Red Shield]

I hear a lot of parroted rhetoric but no substantial evidence that a movement that seeks to empower both men AND women in our race is somehow eroding black masculinity. Moreover if the latter is tied to black women being in lesser role it's already flawed and vulnerable to corruption. You cannot dismiss one half of ur race as less than and win when with our demographics. Instead we should be uplifting EVERY person in our race regardless of gender and valorizing their own unique talents as different but no less equal in value as an apple is to an orange.

Historically they did. West African women ran entire business and trade guilds, land ownership could be held separately even by married women and no one blinked an eye if a ruler was happened to be a woman b/c leadership capabilities in women weren't counted as a threat to black masculinity. It is only in the myriad of African historical cultures that you find entire lineages of female rulers (ie candakes), female elder leaders (leadership according to seniority) females trained and educated (Egypt had entire schools of medicine where women attended)...ect.

There is a fascinating study about how Western concepts of gender roles through the Judeo-Christain tradition completely disrupted the family structure and gender interactions of many traditional African countries resulting in a complete paradigm shift in the way women were regarded and catastrophic results to these communities.

Traditional African patriarchy was very very different from the Western patriarchy many black men have adopted in order to grasp some illusion of power within a white world. And with the ignorance of Western patriarchy which is based on the devaluing of white women to men, comes the backlash which is feminism.

That's nice an all but none of that shyt worked out when Africans met other far more aggressive groups.

 

[George's Dilemma]

Are you a child? Why do you need to be spoon fed and handheld? Get up and do your own research. Figure out what is real and what is not. We are not your parents to be looking after you. This is the real world. If you have questions then ask but don't expect people to readily serve things to you.

It's your choice to judge things based on "what it looks like" rather than what it is but don't expect anyone to take your opinions seriously.

How is black feminism/womanism "primed for and exclusive to liberal white women"

Here's the thing, again the onus is on you to convince me and other men why feminism has any value and benefits society. You're the ones yelling and trying to bring attention to your cause. When I or another man stops to listen to what you and your ilk have to say, the message gets lost in translation. It's the very reason why only 18% of people in this country even identify as feminists, despite the majority of Americans agreeing on the basic textbook definition of the word. I imagine that figure (18%) is even less if the number ever gets broken down by race. In other words your movement is failing, and your ability to spread your message, whatever that might be, needs to be examined.

Black feminism/womanism to me is like Black people appropriating white superheroes and then adding melanin to them in an effort to live vicariously through them. You're not original.

 

[Onlooker]

Women may be empowered to reach their full potential without destroying black male patriarchy, just as white women can be empowered to reach their full potential without relinquishing the white man's control over the America. Patriarchy is nature. It is as ubiquitous as conflict and as inviolable as energy. Until the world commits to getting rid of patriarchy or reaches an impasse where one man's patriarchy cannot infringe on another's, logic dictates that that black men shouldn't relinquish their patriarchy. Doing anything else amounts to losing the arms' race





All men and women are oppressed and not for whom they are. If you see black females as b but whether it is worthwhile to do anything about all oppressions. Men are controlled by laws in order to protect society, which is a necessary type of oppression. Men are drafted into wars to protect nations, which is a necessary type of oppression. Nations are ruled by men, which is another necessary type of oppression. The old Europeans would never give control of their nations to women so that their enemies could invade them the next day.



If you view the natural world where black men rule over black soceities as oppression, then all black societies--and all societies in general--are irretrievably oppressive. And, ultimately, should remain so. There are no societies ruled by women for the same reason all societies are ruled by men. There is only division in this structure if you see it as so and unity if you see it that way too. This "oppressive" societal structure led to the European's control of the world.



All men and women variously receiver fai and unfair treatment for whom they are. Black men suffer more than black women yet we don't see the need to sow division as we inherently believe our race comes before our gender. So despite similar conditions between black men and women, If we have no reason to protest against our own, black women have none either.



Women may be empowered to reach their full potential without destroying black male patriarchy, just as white women can be empowered to reach their full potential without relinquishing the white man's control over the America (an extension of white patriarchy). Patriarchy is nature and can help the people for whom it is meant. By itself patriarchy is as ubiquitous as conflict and as inviolable as energy. Until the world commits to getting rid of patriarchy or reaches an impasse where one man's patriarchy cannot infringe on another's, logic dictates that that black men shouldn't relinquish their patriarchy. Doing anything else amounts to losing the arms' race.

Yeah, fukk patriarchy, breh I don't care whose it is but that shyt can fukk right off.

 

[godkiller]

Yeah, fukk patriarchy, breh I don't care whose it is but that shyt can fukk right off.

I wrote a post with actual points, refutations and arguments, and all you do is reply with "fukk patriarchy". Like a troll, you have no actual points, refutations or counterarguments, just inane nonsense.

 

[Onlooker]

Here's the thing, again the onus is on you to convince me and other men why feminism has any value and benefits society. You're the ones yelling and trying to bring attention to your cause. When I or another man stops to listen to what you and your ilk have to say, the message gets lost in translation. It's the very reason why only 18% of people in this country even identify as feminists, despite the majority of Americans agreeing on the basic textbook definition of the word. I imagine that figure (18%) is even less if the number ever gets broken down by race. In other words your movement is failing, and your ability to spread your message, whatever that might be, needs to be examined.

Black feminism/womanism to me is like Black people appropriating white superheroes and then adding melanin to them in an effort to live vicariously through them. You're not original.

Feminism has many branches/schools of thought so if you are looking to get educated on the philosophy then go enroll in a class or read a book. If someone is telling you their cause then I'm not sure what's getting lost in translation and how.

I'm not sure what all the math has to do with feminism being bad. 18% doesn't mean it's failing if people agree with the movement's basic principles.

BW are the original feminists so yeah.

 

[Onlooker]

I wrote a post with actual points, refutations and arguments, and all you do is reply with "fukk patriarchy". Like a troll, you have no actual points, refutations or counterarguments, just inane nonsense.

Breh, idk. I have no desire to go back and forth over patriarchy rn.

 

[godkiller]

Breh, idk. I have no desire to go back and forth over patriarchy rn.

You already did go "back and forth", and now you have no reply to what I said, which means I won the debate. Thanks for playing, troll.

 

[Windwaker]

as long as these other groups subjugate our black men, will we ever have a true patriarchy? Do we simply want to emulate the masters tools, or try something different?
I dont believe that the black woman is unaccountable, and I do not believe that by supporting black feminism you support a matriarchal society. We all need to reevaluate our worth, and define our roles outside of white definitions. There are unaccountable people in both genders, and us talking about black women being unaccountable is like white people judging us by the lowest of our people.
btw, i mean for this dialogue to stay positive and not male-centered, so lets not talk about patriarchy in here; we talk about patriachy so much, this is a thread dedicated to our sisters.
all love breh, 100

This is bout the dumbest shyt I've ever read in my life. AT LEAST let us, as black men, catch up to even half of where white men are in this society before we concentrate on black women. Equality? What do black women want to be gunned down, and terrorized by the police like us black men?!?!?!? Is that the type of equality they want?!?!?!?!

"Do we simply want to emulate the masters tools, or try something different? " The fukk are you talking about!?!?!!? We've BEEN trying something different...and look how it has effected the black community. This matriarchy within the black community is why we are losing!!!! And I believe that was the plan all along. The WORST you can be in this society is a black man. We are enemy number one. I don't understand this argument of equality when black women are outnumbering us in college, and the work field. What the fukk is wrong with you?!?!?!?!?

 

[Windwaker]

I just think it's hilarious that black males want to emulate the societal structure of a group of people they regard as inherently evil. Your "masculinity" is challenged daily, so of course you have to get your power some kind of way.

A man leading isn't a societal structure created by whites. African tribes ALWAYS had the man as the head. And as far as your analysis on us getting our "masculinity," this...THIS type of speak is why so many of us hate black feminism.

 

[marcuz]

This is bout the dumbest shyt I've ever read in my life. AT LEAST let us, as black men, catch up to even half of where white men are in this society before we concentrate on black women. Equality? What do black women want to be gunned down, and terrorized by the police like us black men?!?!?!? Is that the type of equality they want?!?!?!?!

"Do we simply want to emulate the masters tools, or try something different? " The fukk are you talking about!?!?!!? We've BEEN trying something different...and look how it has effected the black community. This matriarchy within the black community is why we are losing!!!! And I believe that was the plan all along. The WORST you can be in this society is a black man. We are enemy number one. I don't understand this argument of equality when black women are outnumbering us in college, and the work field. What the fukk is wrong with you?!?!?!?!?

you get it what site did you come from

 

[Windwaker]

The truth of the matter is that black males are just pissed that they cannot rule in the way that they want. If given the opportunity they'd jump ship if they could. Which is why as women we need to promote the betterment of one another at any cost, and shed light on our issues. No one else will, and modern womanism has done a great job of that.

Right, because we're the ones walking around with somebody else's hair glued to our heads giving ourselves cancer to look white. Because we're the ones writing blogs, books, and creating youtube channels dedicated to catching the very same type of men who raped our ancestors. Most people don't even care or like feminism so how has modern womanism done a good job at shedding light on black women's issues??? Anytime a black woman gets a platform to address said issues she wastes it on pushing interracial dating and chasing white men. See: Scandal, Awkward Black Girl, Beyond Black and White. PATHETIC!!!!

 

[Biscayne]

Here's the thing, again the onus is on you to convince me and other men why feminism has any value and benefits society. You're the ones yelling and trying to bring attention to your cause. When I or another man stops to listen to what you and your ilk have to say, the message gets lost in translation. It's the very reason why only 18% of people in this country even identify as feminists, despite the majority of Americans agreeing on the basic textbook definition of the word. I imagine that figure (18%) is even less if the number ever gets broken down by race. In other words your movement is failing, and your ability to spread your message, whatever that might be, needs to be examined.

Black feminism/womanism to me is like Black people appropriating white superheroes and then adding melanin to them in an effort to live vicariously through them. You're not original.

Couldn't you say the same thing about Black patriarchy? Since modern Black patriarchy is heavily derived from Western/White concepts of patriarchy. Seems to me like Black men might just be trying to parrot White men.

 

[Windwaker]

True. It's sad and infuriating. Instead of using that anger to challenge patriarchal white supremacy they take their frustration out on BW because, as much as they complain about him, BM envy WM and what want he has. These types of BM don't care about doing right. They only care about doing what benefits them (often at another's expense). Not only that but many BM are cowards and simple. It's easier to blame and fight BW since we have less power in a patriarchal society. In the end, BW get left behind.

I love my brothers but they need come to their senses

I really want to experience that sisterhood though Us coming together and supporting each other

Maybe you should become a lesbian.

 

[Windwaker]

you get it what site did you come from

LOL, I actually used to lurk on LSA and read through their bullshyt. They would mention the coli a lot and so I came to check it out. Free advertising at its best. I love this site now. Black feminism is a joke. Feminism in general is a flawed ideology that relies on generalizations that don't take into account the fact that black men in this country have NEVER had the power, influence, or freedom that white men or even white women have had. I would argue that we are at the bottom of the barrel. What black women seem not to understand is that the patriarchy benefits them seeing as how men have been conditioned to protect women. That type of mentality is represented when you see the government giving black women funding and housing whenever they fukk up their lives and have children by "aint shyt nikkas." Where as we as black men get sent to JAIL!!!! There is no safely net for black men, any benefits we would receive under this supposed "patriarchy" immediately get replaced with the disadvantages of racism. I really don't get black feminists.

 

[Northern Son]

What's stupid about the picture, exactly? Defend your opinion. The most oppressive patriarchies in the world, the Middle East, don't allow such heresy from their women. Women have their heads chopped off for less and the Arab dude just makes another daughter tomorrow.

I already explained and defended my opinion. There is zero correlation between ghetto gaggers and feminism. You would have to be an idiot (and well, you are one) to even entertain that connection. White male misogyny/hegemony and black feminism are world's apart, and that porn is clearly a reflection of the former. Black feminism aims to subvert things like ghetto gaggers.