Yvette Carnell (w/ Dr. Tommy Curry) - Straight Black Men are the White Men of Black People? 9/20/17

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The Smart Negroes
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yes.



Colorism isn't a privilege... its self hate in its most superficial form and I've said its overblown and trivial.



Gotta disagree.

Our lack of capital and resources + 100s of years of conditioning are the root issue to all of our problems.
I actually disagree. I feel as if only an selected few of non whites can have white privilege. Whites have white supremacy. It comes with a benefits package as soon as you are born. It's permanent. They have a code of honor like any tribe but this is based all on race. There are some people who simply are passing. Those have white privilege too but it can be removed at a moments notice.

Colorism is real as it comes to a little privilege, not much but it don't take much privilege when you barely get any anyway for others to notice.
 

Wear My Dawg's Hat

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The Land That Time Forgot
I remember this New York Times Magazine cover story from 1993.

Almost 25 years later, non-LGBT black male-focused analysis is being completely wiped from the record.

It is Orwellian.

backissues.cgi
 

Poitier

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I actually disagree. I feel as if only an selected few of non whites can have white privilege. Whites have white supremacy. It comes with a benefits package as soon as you are born. It's permanent. They have a code of honor like any tribe but this is based all on race. There are some people who simply are passing. Those have white privilege too but it can be removed at a moments notice.

Colorism is real as it comes to a little privilege, not much but it don't take much privilege when you barely get any anyway for others to notice.

A person "assimilated" into Whiteness is White.

A person "passing" as White is White.
 

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A person "assimilated" into Whiteness is White.

A person "passing" as White is White.
I think an Ashkenazi Jew is passing. They get white benefits, i.e. Donald Sterling but it can be removed at a moments notice. They aren't Black but they aren't exactly white. That being said, they practice white supremacy.
 

dongameister

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The black boogeyman trope has been going on since the 80s with the adaptation of the Color Purple from Alice Walker's book. This narrative of black men is still trendy among many black feminists, and other non-black feminists. Black men get it from all sides.
 

CBSkyline

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If you said Black women are the White women of the Black community I can compare the parallels it the overall community and the role women play in it.
Context is crucial.

Which is why people are going at him. The article lacks correct framing and context. The premise goes against all data and metrics that state otherwise. Even the author himself admits this.

The correct context for an article talking about Black male violence would be to frame the conditions that cause it. The biggest one being poverty. I can't speak for others, but my take would be much different if he laid out how poverty leads to an increase in tension, which in turn leads to an increase in violence as it relates to Black men because we're more likely to experience it. If he stated that and the harmful effects it has on Black women or something that could be backed up with figures and solutions he would have quite a powerful piece.

But that's not what he did. He framed it by saying fukk the data Black men are the same as white men. No they're worse because they bring nothing of value and are therefore trash who only hurt and hinder other Black people. That's the direction he went in, and that's why people are calling him out.
 

Gravity

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yes.



Colorism isn't a privilege... its self hate in its most superficial form and I've said its overblown and trivial.
Biracial Privilege: the List


When someone experiences political privilege, typically it's at the inconvenience or expense of someone else ...
... and that's the main reason I feel racial privilege needs to be acknowledged, even when that privilege is limited.
On a Black forum I frequent, there's ongoing debate as to whether or not biracial people (about equally Black and White) and those who are mostly White, experience racial privilege, relative to people who are mostly or fully Black. Because I believe biracials do, I promised to generate a list of some BR/White privileges I've either experienced, or witnessed other BRs receive. First, here are a few factors I suspect help determine the degree of privilege:

  • phenotype (ethnic appearance)
  • lightness/darkness of skin
  • white acculturation (to what degree someone is familiar with or participating in White culture)
  • dress style (Euro-associated, Afro-associated, Asia-associated, etc. ... and/or some combination)
  • racial demographics (specifically: level and duration of exposure to Whites)
  • local politics (conservative, liberal, moderate, etc.)

In my opinion, the Whiter or more ambiguous your BR phenotype, the lighter your skin tone, and the more White or biracial-acculturated you are, the more likely you are to experience quite a few of the following privileges. ...

Overt racism

You've never had a "negro wake up call" (to your conscious awareness):
For example: Was never called an n - - - - r, or other slur for Blacks; never had someone let you know "your type isn't wanted around here." ... No one has locked a car door or clutched her purse as you walked by.
Whites and non-Blacks typically give you a warm social reception. They readily smile and initiate discussions and don't usually seem nervous or standoffish to you, as a group.

Achievements, accolades and media exposure

As of 2010, BRs still only represent 2.7% of the American population, according to the USCB, but are disproportionately over-represented in American academia, politics, and other vocations and industries, especially relative to Blacks.

In reality, there are likely more than 2.7% of us. While dual ancestry could have been claimed on the 2010 census, (waning) acceptance and practice of the "One Drop Rule" may have led some BRs to only identify as "Black". But even if there are twice as many BRs in the US compared to the latest USCB report, BRs still appear to over-represent Black people in the areas described above. In that way, BRs may have some privilege as a group, based on model minority status, relative to Blacks.
BRs are also disproportionately over-represented in media. BRs - most often ambi-BRs - tend to suffer less negative stereotyping in the media, relative to Blacks. This may translate into social privilege in the form of a warmer, or at least more neutral, reception by many non-Blacks.

As a BR, you see people like you playing a variety or roles in movies and on TV, that are meant for Blacks, BRs, Latinos, Italians, Greeks, Whites and others.

That over-representation is a privilege. Some groups are less psychologically visible as Americans, because they must go out of their way to find images of themselves in American media, or in public venues. BR presence is especially dominant in "Black" magazines and advertising.

Social Situations
You will more likely have immediate social acceptance from White and non-White Americans.
For example: If you're a White-appearing or ambi-BR, Non-Blacks may say things like, "You're so handsome ... I need to introduce you to my daughter," while looking you directly in the eyes and wrapping an arm around your shoulder.
A less dramatic example: Older, conservative-looking White strangers act in familial ways, like offering to fix your shirt collar, or flip a tag back into your shirt). They tend to ask before touching your hair.

Positive stereotypes are often ascribed to you.

Any stereotype can be problematic. Positive stereotypes create pressure to live up to high expectations, and any stereotype paints a group with too broad a brush. But those positive assumptions can result in unearned, relative privilege, because those who are positively stereotyped are often given the benefit of the doubt in many situations, where others aren't. While BRs sometimes get negatively stereotyped as "confused" or (less frequently) "tragic", there are several very positive stereotypes that likely offset the negative ones. ...

For example: Statements commonly made about BRs are, "You have the best of both worlds" (whatever in the Hell that means), "You guys are always so great looking","You represent a better future", etc. Silly BR stereotypes will often be more positive or neutral than negative.
You can often express negative feelings openly without fear of being reduced to a negative stereotype.

For example: Assuming you look ambi-BR or White, you've likely never really thought twice about possible racist backlash for spontaneously expressing your anger, outrage or disgust toward a White person in a position of authority over you, or in front of a larger White audience. You're pretty sure you've been viewed as an individual expressing a problem you wanted fixed, rather than as a (Black) trouble maker to be tolerated, dismissed or punished.
You've done inappropriate things like raise your voice at your boss or yell at a White cop, and you weren't treated harshly or arrested as a result. There may have been a neutral reaction, as if the person decided you're just having a bad day. They don't tend to reprimand you or give you that citation you deserved for going twice the speed limit.
No one's given you cause to believe you've been stereotyped as the "aggressive Black man" or the "angry Black woman", etc. You don't worry about coming across as a stereotype and you don't selectively watch what you say around Whites.

You're unaware of racial tension between you and White people.
For example: In-store security people barely notice you. You're not uncomfortable or self-conscious of your ethnicity while in White public spaces, or when there are cops nearby. When you're a tourist in a heavily White area, you know from experience that all it takes is looking slightly lost, and people will immediately volunteer to give you directions. (Yes, even in "unfriendly" cities like Los Angeles, NYC and Newark; and regardless of your gender.)
You've never been questioned about your intentions when shopping or momentarily sitting/standing outside a business establishment. You don't wait longer than non-Blacks to be seated at restaurants. You aren't praised for being "articulate". You aren't expected to speak for all Black people in discussions. If you are a women: from experience, you know that when your car breaks down, a good samaritan of any "color" will likely show up very soon, if not right away, to help you.

When it's just you and a bunch of your White friends or acquaintances ...

You don't notice White strangers staring or giving dirty looks when it's just you among your White friends or acquaintances. (Geography needs to be kept in mind here. The more racially diverse the region, the less likely you are to get open reactions.)

Racial shape-shifting

If you are racially ambiguous, certain groups may immediately treat you "as one of theirs", leading to warm, "familiar" social exchanges and easier business interactions.

Dating/marriage
You will attract people from diverse ethnic groups with relative ease (though racial barriers to marriage may or may not exist).

Of course the degree of ethnic diversity in your environment is a pretty big factor.
You have been openly hit on by hard-core racists (like neo-Nazis or other "White pride" enthusiasts), in front of their racist White friends. I'm not suggesting it's a privilege to be hit on by these knuckle heads. I'm saying their reaction to you is a strong indicator you're accessing White privilege in every day life, possibly without knowing it.
People don't seem to care who you date or marry.

If you've dated (or date) Whites and/or non-Blacks, no one bothered to point it out. No one acted like it was unusual. You didn't get incredulous or dirty looks from anyone. Once again, geography needs to be kept in mind. A more racially diverse region typically means less open reactions.

Business/employment
You clearly think that the lighter a black person's skin is the more privileged that he/she is.




Gotta disagree.

Our lack of capital and resources + 100s of years of conditioning are the root issue to all of our problems.
Dont move the goal posts. We're talking about this particular article and the rift between black men and women that it represents. Obviously white racism is the root cause of our issues but a hurdle in us overcoming white supremacy is blacks like the ones Damon young represents. We making excuses and giving cover to c00ns now?
What he's saying is

1. "Privilege" is quantifiable so if you make the claim you better have some data to back it up
There's plenty of data backing up the fact that black womwn are privileged over black men. The anti-straight black man article itself even conceded the point. Read @Wear My Dawg's Hat post breaking it down.

2. Even if there is a privilege in our community it's so fukking small that bringing up is pretty pointless especially when blacks don't control the privilege
Except black women are the one's on the oppression Olympics crusade hell bent on scapegoating black men for our plight indirectly giving whites cover. I'm simply setting the record straight and telling the truth. Again, I don't subscribe to that bytchass scared of the truth shyt.

You even just said it. If lightskinned blacks are more privileged because of white Supremacy. Who should the anger be directed to?

The idiots who agreed with the article will say the light skinned blacks :skip:
Im not scapegoating black women for white supremacy. In each of my posts I've acknowledged that it's not just black women down with this anti-straight black male white liberal bullshyt. The person who wrote this article is a black man. My point is that it's important to acknowledge that black women and gays are being privileged over straight black men because it's directly manipulating our relationship with black women on a collective level.
 

dongameister

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Look at the comments. :scust:






These dudes were the black kids that grew up around 90% cacs and compensated their insecurity of being black by being fake pro-black during their college years.


If you're a black person on reddit I can't fukk with you



Blackfellas has become an echo chamber. You can't critique feminist theory without being called hotep or some other pejorative. The mods will even delete comments that are critical of feminist theory.
 

dongameister

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Which is why people are going at him. The article lacks correct framing and context. The premise goes against all data and metrics that state otherwise. Even the author himself admits this.

The correct context for an article talking about Black male violence would be to frame the conditions that cause it. The biggest one being poverty. I can't speak for others, but my take would be much different if he laid out how poverty leads to an increase in tension, which in turn leads to an increase in violence as it relates to Black men because we're more likely to experience it. If he stated that and the harmful effects it has on Black women or something that could be backed up with figures and solutions he would have quite a powerful piece.

But that's not what he did. He framed it by saying fukk the data Black men are the same as white men. No they're worse because they bring nothing of value and are therefore trash who only hurt and hinder other Black people. That's the direction he went in, and that's why people are calling him out.


It's not just poverty. People forget that the media and social media socializes a lot of young black men and women to behave destructively.
 

Poitier

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You clearly think that the lighter a black person's skin is the more privileged that he/she is.

Care to quote something less than 4 years old? I've given my views on colorism just a few months ago...no need to dig up old post like views don't evolve with information.

That said, Biracials have privilege because they have a White parent and family and thus ways to access into White privilege. Has little do with skin tone.


Dont move the goal posts. We're talking about this particular article and the rift between black men and women that it represents. Obviously white racism is the root cause of our issues but a hurdle in us overcoming white supremacy is blacks like the ones Damon young represents.

I don't think fixing this gets us the reparations we need or somehow makes African nations get their shyt together to then invest in the diaspora.

My point is that it's important to acknowledge that black women and gays are being privileged over straight black men because it's directly manipulating our relationship with black women on a collective level.

Its important in the sense of survival meaning we don't let the wool get pulled over our eyes but being cognizant isn't suddenly going to change our position as an underclass in America.

We could have the healthiest relationships between Black men and women and would still be suffering because of economic apartheid.
 

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Look at the comments. :scust:






These dudes were the black kids that grew up around 90% cacs and compensated their insecurity of being black by being fake pro-black during their college years.


If you're a black person on reddit I can't fukk with you

I would say this is the average Black male idiot who has a degree. You must realize, thecoli wasn't much different when I first joined in 2012. In 2012, ya'll nikkas sounded like c00ns too to me. Nowadays everyone with the shytz on this site and white supremacists get banned ASAP.
 
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