Yahoo Sports: “A closer look at MJ’s 1988 DPOY raises questions about its validity”

[FunkDoc1112]

What's funny about the scorekeeping.... y'all don't think LeBron benefits from that too? My gambling brehs, bet LeBron rebounds and assists for any home game, as long as the line isn't crazy(like 9.5 boards or assists) you'll cash 95% of the time. The stat padding + home cooking is almost undefeated.

For the most part, home cooking has been cleaned up. There's internet sleuths you have to watch out for one thing, and then besides that NBA started tracking play-by-play stats more closely in 97, and then they started diving deeper when they rolled out their stat section on NBA.com in 2013, where they literally have video attached to every single recorded stat in a game so it's all bullshyt proof and open to scrutiny. And I bet legalized gambling is part of that too, the same reason they're so strict about announced lineups and injury reports now.

 

[UpAndComing]

lol. literally nobody but Bron fanboys care about this.

Negative lol.
- NBA Fans that were fans before Jordan first won in 1991 don't consider him the GOAT, respect him but aren't in awe of him at all
- NBA Fans that were born after he retired from the Bulls also don't consider him the GOAT, respect him but aren't in awe of him at all

There's plenty of fans that will take this info in this thread for fuel to create more content on social media. Buckle up lol

 

[Slaimon Khan Shah]

The G.O.A.T NBA defensive player that I @Slaimon Khan Shah have ever seen is Allen Iverson!

@Slaimon Khan Shah = Allen Iverfather

I Slaimon Khan Shah am the A.N.I.M.A.L.S of all time Streetball Ball defensive player that I have not seen!

 

[Illuminatos]

Real ones been knew that the Jordan Media Machine runs the 7 kingdoms. That's why we only acknowledge our King as the one true GOAT.

 

[VegasCAC]

Jordan stans shaking, crying, inconsolable. Screaming KLUTCH DID IT!!!! :

 

[Primetime21]

Negative lol.
- NBA Fans that were fans before Jordan first won in 1991 don't consider him the GOAT, respect him but aren't in awe of him at all
- NBA Fans that were born after he retired from the Bulls also don't consider him the GOAT, respect him but aren't in awe of him at all

There's plenty of fans that will take this info in this thread for fuel to create more content on social media. Buckle up lol

You want it to be something that its not. Bron stans will talk about it for a couple of weeks. The general public if they even catch wind of it at all will collectively sigh and roll their eyes. By the first team USA exhibition game on 7/10 nobody will even care.

 

[Sonic Boom of the South]

This is an expansive and well-researched piece but watch Jordan dikkriders discredit it without reading, as expected.

You already see it in this thread.

So even in your own post. The chart shows Jordan was getting more blocks and steals at home than all but 1 player listed at home and got a decent amount on the road.

Looking at this list, Dennis Rodman and Moncrief shouldn't have won shyt.

 

[Roger king]

Idk how you can spin this article. This is pretty damning evidence that MJ really didn't deserve that award.

strongly agree. This article is very damming and raises serious questions about Jordans stats. The disparities are just too huge to be brushed aside and ignored. I haven't seen a fact based rebuttal yet to explain such inconsistency only ad hominem attacks on the reporter.

 

[viktordoomsecretwars]

I watched an uploaded at least 50 games from that season on Youtube before the NBA copyright Nazi's took down my channel.

Let me lay my ashes on this hit piece real quick.

Not only did Jordan deserve to win the award, he was the obvious , slam dunk choice, no pun intended.

(1) Led the league in defensive box plus/minus

(2) Led the league in steals. And became the only player to have 200+ steals and 100+ blocks in a season, tying his record from the previous season

(3) Had 131 blocks. No guard in NBA history has ever even come close to this. He had more blocks than 17 starting Centers

(4) Was 2nd in defensive win shares

And Jordan's defense had a clear impact on his team.

The Bulls were

1st in fewest points allowed per game -- Despite having no other great defensive player of note on the team. FACTS

3rd in defensive rating


The Bulls starting 5 in that season was --- Jordan, Oakley, Paxson, Brad Sellers, Dave Corzine and Horace Grant with a rookie Pippen coming off the bench.

Corzine was one of the worst defensive centers in the league. He was literally a cone and food for everyone in the paint.

Brad Sellers and Paxson were both terrible defenders. Horace Grant and Pippen were below average defenders as rookies.

Oakley was the only semi-good defender in the Bulls starting 5 and even he was very undersized and used to get dominated in the low-post by taller big men, which is one of the reasons the Bulls traded him for Bill Cartwright.

So Jordan was really the only great defender on his team and led his team to be arguably the best defensive team for that regular season while averaging 35ppg on 54% shooting. Someone is obviously not telling the truth here, namely Tom Habestrogh

Don't let these dudes on the Klutch Sports , LeBron payroll decieve you. "Home-biased" stats. What a mongrel. The entire point of this is to discredit Michael Jordan, its not sincerly written.

If that 1987/1988 season was played by ANY other player other than Michael Jordan it would not have been questioned. Strange how that works

 

[viktordoomsecretwars]

If anything should be being explored from almost 40 years ago in regards to MJ, its how he didn't even make an NBA defensive team in 1986/87 , the previous season despite being clearly one of the best defensive players on the planet.

 

[Sunalmighty]

I watched an uploaded at least 50 games from that season on Youtube before the NBA copyright Nazi's took down my channel.

Let me lay my ashes on this hit piece real quick.

Not only did Jordan deserve to win the award, he was the obvious , slam dunk choice, no pun intended.

(1) Led the league in defensive box plus/minus

(2) Led the league in steals. And became the only player to have 200+ steals and 100+ blocks in a season, tying his record from the previous season

(3) Had 131 blocks. No guard in NBA history has ever even come close to this. He had more blocks than 17 starting Centers

(4) Was 2nd in defensive win shares

And Jordan's defense had a clear impact on his team.

The Bulls were

1st in fewest points allowed per game -- Despite having no other great defensive player of note on the team. FACTS

3rd in defensive rating


The Bulls starting 5 in that season was --- Jordan, Oakley, Paxson, Brad Sellers, Dave Corzine and Horace Grant with a rookie Pippen coming off the bench.

Corzine was one of the worst defensive centers in the league. He was literally a cone and food for everyone in the paint.

Brad Sellers and Paxson were both terrible defenders. Horace Grant and Pippen were below average defenders as rookies.

Oakley was the only semi-good defender in the Bulls starting 5 and even he was very undersized and used to get dominated in the low-post by taller big men, which is one of the reasons the Bulls traded him for Bill Cartwright.

So Jordan was really the only great defender on his team and led his team to be arguably the best defensive team for that regular season while averaging 35ppg on 54% shooting. Someone is obviously not telling the truth here, namely Tom Habestrogh

Don't let these dudes on the Klutch Sports , LeBron payroll decieve you. "Home-biased" stats. What a mongrel. The entire point of this is to discredit Michael Jordan, its not sincerly written.

If that 1987/1988 season was played by ANY other player other than Michael Jordan it would not have been questioned. Strange how that works

they been tugging at the cape for some years and still come up short

 

[Osmosis]

Where is the proof MJ won that DPOY based off his steal numbers? He could've had league average steals and won, his defense was impactful anyway you spin it. Guys like Iverson, steph curry, and baron davis lead the league in steals and were never considered great defenders. The idea that inflated stats means his defense was overrated doesn't hold up

First of all, his stocks were significantly inflated not just steals.

Secondly, those guys aren't good defenders so they're irrelevant to the discussion. Nobody is saying Jordan only won because of his stats.

Thirdly, there are few guard DPOYs and almost all of them are controversial because bigs are more impactful defenders by nature of their role. Jordan's statistical argument is a major reason why he won the award over Hakeem or Eaton, especially at a time where stats weren't looked at with any nuance.

The guy averaged 4 steals and 2 blocks at home and 2 steals and 1 block on the road and you don't think that factored into his DPOY case?

 

[JasoRockStar]

This is like finding out Santa isn't real for some of these dudes. They cope by blaming the Klutch boogieman.

Case in point:




The utterly egregious 2X disparity in home/road stats, the fact that no other player in NBA history has a seasonal spike even remotely close, the fact that this season is a massive outlier within Jordan's own career is nothing to see here folks. Just stannery

Strongly agree, the article appears to be credible and also has stats to back up its arguments, rather than challenge the reporter with facts to counter the narrative, its somehow all a huge conspiracy orchestrated by lebron or klutch, anything to not explain why such a huge disparity in home and road games are present. I find the article to be very credible

Apparently at six years old, Rich Paul was conspiring with the Bulls scorekeeper to artificially inflate Mike's stats so that he could then discredit his DPOY 37 years later to prop up Lebron, who he didn't even know existed at the time.



Rich Paul must be GOD to some of these dudes with the amount of power they attribute to him

 

[jaydawg08]

Jordan Stans in their feelings. No one is saying that Jordan wasn’t a good defender

But, according to this article and research, his stats totaled were doctored. Doesn’t mean he wasn’t a good defender

 

[viktordoomsecretwars]

And the scorekeepers conspired to make the 1987-1988 Chicago Bulls arguably the best defensive team in the league. Scorekeepers can't do that.

I mean they let in the fewest PPG of any team and were 3rd in Defensive rating with no great defensive players other than Jordan.

And the majority of that had to do with Jordan's defense.

What's the debate exactly?

How many of you arguing Jordan did NOT deserve to win it actually watched these games?

So 99% of people are just arguing blindly on this.

No one in NBA history ever played with more intensity on both ends than Jordan did in that 1986-1989 time frame. His DPOTY was a no-brainer. Those are just facts. This CAC cornball is talking about scorekeepers