why can't DC films be like the DC cartoons of 90s/early 2000s

[Devilinurear]

Sucker punch was ass.

Watchmen was ok at best

And Man of Steele was ok @ best as well.

U dont get an avg nikka they keys to the dc universe

Watchmen made money, man of steel made money. Sucker punch made money.

 

[Art Barr]

So watchmen was ass?

after sucker punch and you never got to see that lil chick dance. anyone showing any faith in Zack Snyder is not paying attention.


art barr

 

[Devilinurear]

after sucker punch and you never got to see that lil chick dance. anyone showing any faith in Zack Snyder is not paying attention.


art barr

Sucker punch was his original idea. When it came to comic books he was good. Watchmen and 300 proved that.

 

[Art Barr]

Watchmen made money, man of steel made money. Sucker punch made money.

superman and batman are too iconic to just be given to a guy with a decent spreadsheet return

Sucker punch was his original idea. When it came to comic books he was good. Watchmen and 300 proved that.

not really,....
Snyder never showed he really knew how to make an actual comic book film with mainstream characters of this magnitude.
as in watchmen he never made any of those characters in that movie into anything marketable. That real talk,... All those watchmen toys in the movie were never and never gonna be a thing with him at the helm. When those properties should have if he was that guy like that.
like real talk,....
even 300 never spawned some boom amoung the demographic that supes and batman are intended to draw in.

real talk,...
I ain't never seen no kid flying around with a man of steel toy.
I ain't never seen no kid flying around with his version of the batmobile and batman.[when 89 dropped those two toys ruled after a time period when toys generally were faltering]
I ain't never seen no kid with a 300 toy.
I ain't seen no kid with the owl vehicle toy playset from watchmen.
which is what is supposed to be the end goal of all this at the end of the day.
of which Snyder has not made into anything.

like real talk,....
Zack Snyder does not know how to make children slash marketing draw properties of this magnitude.
which is what needs to be discussed.
he has no idea how to film to make things a draw that creates booms to properties. Which is what this is about.

when I was a kid,...
if I went to Mickie d's in any state. There were kids everywhere with toys and we played together.
when, I go with my daughter and in the world. Kids are not enjoying toys and these properties and that is what should be noted about this.
as Snyder creates no adult intrigue to spawn the adulation of children to want to be like adults and emulate that activity via toys. That is the issue.


art barr

 

[Devilinurear]

superman and batman are too iconic to just be given to a guy with a decent spreadsheet return





not really,....
Snyder never showed he really knew how to make an actual comic book film with mainstream characters of this magnitude.
as in watchmen he never made any of those characters in that movie into anything marketable. That real talk,... All those watchmen toys in the movie were never and never gonna be a thing with him at the helm. When those properties should have if he was that guy like that.
like real talk,....
even 300 never spawned some boom amoung the demographic that supes and batman are intended to draw in.

real talk,...
I ain't never seen no kid flying around with a man of steel toy.
I ain't never seen no kid flying around with his version of the batmobile and batman.[when 89 dropped those two toys ruled after a time period when toys generally were faltering]
I ain't never seen no kid with a 300 toy.
I ain't seen no kid with the owl vehicle toy playset from watchmen.
which is what is supposed to be the end goal of all this at the end of the day.
of which Snyder has not made into anything.

like real talk,....
Zack Snyder does not know how to make children slash marketing draw properties of this magnitude.
which is what needs to be discussed.
he has no idea how to film to make things a draw that creates booms to properties. Which is what this is about.

when I was a kid,...
if I went to Mickie d's in any state. There were kids everywhere with toys and we played together.
when, I go with my daughter and in the world. Kids are not enjoying toys and these properties and that is what should be noted about this.
as Snyder creates no adult intrigue to spawn the adulation of children to want to be like adults and emulate that activity via toys. That is the issue.


art barr

Kids don't spend the money like 13-30 year olds who but the comics and figures. The fact that he took something as dense as watchmen and made it into a movie that turned a profit is amazing and that is why they prob gave him superman. The highest grossing movie were never kids movies that is impossible and you know this.

 

[Art Barr]

Kids don't spend the money like 13-30 year olds who but the comics and figures. The fact that he took something as dense as watchmen and made it into a movie that turned a profit is amazing and that is why they prob gave him superman. The highest grossing movie were never kids movies that is impossible and you know this.

were you cognitive when watchmen was out and as a graphic novel. Simply because I have pictures of being at the comic store when my moms copped watchmen as a graphic novel. That even my moms does not give a shyt about the movie like that and she is the original watchmen freak. Like i said he has no idea how to create a boom as he misses the whole shyt evident by suckerpunch.
then never seeing that lil chick dance and the whole movie was about her dance performance. Snyder may have this videogame demo come to life style. Yet he suffers from what every great video game demo does. When you get to the actual work in the overall game.
it does not resonate in the same manner as the demo.
like real talk, he does not even connect in recognizing theme songs and intros.
plus he was silly as fukk to try to even put the death of superman into any of this. As it recounts dc's one of two most inept moves ever.[the other being breaking batman's back]
then on top of that, he set himself up to fail by making dc movies. With to much to them.
when dc as a gateway property and not amalgamated with vertigo has never been viewed as edgy or of substance past the narcisssistic ideal of Jewish superman.
what does Snyder do,...
continue to set himself up to fail by revisiting and then revising the worst decision of any company in the past twenty years with a mainstream property.
if he was smart he would have never filmed any of the shyt that was filmed.
simply because history would tell you that it was destined to fail. Plus it was a call back to the worst time in the history of the company as well. That is why Zack Snyder as a choice for this was stoopid. As it was obvious he missed the little things. Like did dude even realize, or know they made an edgy lone ranger movie that was rated r and it failed. At least tho,.. That lone ranger line had a great toy line every kid clamored for and was rabid about.

With Snyder he makes essentially a rated r movie and makes it so no kid will ever want a superman or batman. That is how much of a disconnect Snyder has.
it was evident in 300, too.
as he did not spawn kids to like 300 in toy form like clash of the titans did when i was a kid.

the proof was there but i guess i am the only person who lived these booms to realize Snyder was incapable of creating a boom because he has no idea how to create that. He can make videos which never drew which is why MTV does not show videos at all anymore. Yet he has no idea how to create an actual large property with all the accompanying revenue streams.


art barr

 

[Devilinurear]

were you cognitive when watchmen was out and as a graphic novel. Simply because I have pictures of being at the comic store when my moms copped watchmen as a graphic novel. That even my moms does not give a shyt about the movie like that and she is the original watchmen freak. Like i said he has no idea how to create a boom as he misses the whole shyt evident by suckerpunch.
then never seeing that lil chick dance and the whole movie was about her dance performance. Snyder may have this videogame demo come to life style. Yet he suffers from what every great video game demo does. When you get to the actual work in the overall game.
it does not resonate in the same manner as the demo.
like real talk, he does not even connect in recognizing theme songs and intros.
plus he was silly as fukk to try to even put the death of superman into any of this. As it recounts dc's one of two most inept moves ever.[the other being breaking batman's back]
then on top of that, he set himself up to fail by making dc movies. With to much to them.
when dc as a gateway property and not amalgamated with vertigo has never been viewed as edgy or of substance past the narcisssistic ideal of Jewish superman.
what does Snyder do,...
continue to set himself up to fail by revisiting and then revising the worst decision of any company in the past twenty years with a mainstream property.
if he was smart he would have never filmed any of the shyt that was filmed.
simply because history would tell you that it was destined to fail. Plus it was a call back to the worst time in the history of the company as well. That is why Zack Snyder as a choice for this was stoopid. As it was obvious he missed the little things. Like did dude even realize, or know they made an edgy lone ranger movie that was rated r and it failed. At least tho,.. That lone ranger line had a great toy line every kid clamored for and was rabid about.

With Snyder he makes essentially a rated r movie and makes it so no kid will ever want a superman or batman. That is how much of a disconnect Snyder has.
it was evident in 300, too.
as he did not spawn kids to like 300 in toy form like clash of the titans did when i was a kid.

the proof was there but i guess i am the only person who lived these booms to realize Snyder was incapable of creating a boom because he has no idea how to create that. He can make videos which never drew which is why MTV does not show videos at all anymore. Yet he has no idea how to create an actual large property with all the accompanying revenue streams.


art barr

LMAO 300 for kids? Things like watchmen and 300 should not be for children.

 

[KevCo]

@Art Barr you seem to be relatively well versed in comics, films and genre over all..who would you have had start off this DCEU if not for Snyder? Personally i liked the choice after watchmen, and still like MOS as a film alot (i dont read superman tho and feel the old movies aged poorly) BvS was OK, but not nearly what it should have been... i had fun with JL but I see zero replay value, like how I feel with most marvel movies....and in all actuality it really wasnt Snyder who they chose, but Martin Campbell who successfully rebooted Bond, twice. Just wondering breh...

 

[Art Barr]

LMAO 300 for kids? Things like watchmen and 300 should not be for children.

like i said,...you were not cognitive to know about this whole licensing game and how it works and draws.
regardless of what a mother's group had to say.
those r rated properties should have been large enough, so if there was products out there.
it created the boom where the media and mother's groups could express outrage.
with lone ranger, and clash of the titans..it was outrage, but the toys were still on fire before the outrage.

i lived why movies are not rated r, for most action figure properties.
yet, when movies were rated R, and were potentially an action figure property.
they were on fire more in the demographic where it counts than snyder's films are.

what you don't get is what execs don't get is.
you are making a property that has a large draw but you want the trickle down in licensing from a property that never really wanes as a draw, ala star wars.

instead dc, who has been inept the entire time star wars arose before and after has never understood any of this at all.
while having the actual resources to make these properties into what star wars is as far as a drawing property based license.

you don't understand this just like people at dc never understood this.
regardless what type of rating the property has.
said property if it is marketed as this type of thing should still resonate on a level that emulates what happened as far as the overall boom of star wars.

this is superman and batman, and jl.
they are supposed to be bigger than star wars and because people are inept at dc.
they will never be larger or more praised than star wars in this gen.
that is because dc has been inept and only wants to move supes and batman back into reeves and west territory.
while not understanding any dynamics to what the realm of draw is for those properties.
plus not understanding reeves and west era style batman and supes are completely loathed in this era and for the future.
yet, and still dc wants and continues to pigeon hole batman and supes like adam west and reeves.
all these gritty relaunches are just to create a gateway to the reeves and west.
when, batman 89 was made to move away batman from that funk.
yet, what happened then....
batman in the nolan series was made to move batman away from the funk of west and schumacher.
yet as soon as that was over we got this.



the problem is dc is inept and snyder was equally inept as well.
both caused exactly why this occurred and will continue to occur.
as dc really just wants reeves supes and adam west batman, and all the deviation and gritty takes.
are just to authenticate a move back to the west and reeves direction.

if you know this company in wb and dc then you know what time it is.

i went to comic book school dually while in high school for four years.

so i know this from not just a stand point of a consumer, but from someone actually taught and schooled in the actual business in discussion as well.


art barr

 

[Real]

Watchmen made money, man of steel made money. Sucker punch made money.

nikka, who gives a fukk? When i watch JL, i dont sit down and hope that it makes money. I hope its good.

Is it too much to ask to have a studio put it a competent director to make a good movie AND make money?

Cuz marvel seems to be doing that with no problem

 

[Devilinurear]

nikka, who gives a fukk? When i watch JL, i dont sit down and hope that it makes money. I hope its good.

Is it too much to ask to have a studio put it a competent director to make a good movie AND make money?

Cuz marvel seems to be doing that with no problem

The people who bought tickets and dvd give a fukk. They just don't complain so you don't hear them.

 

[Devilinurear]

like i said,...you were not cognitive to know about this whole licensing game and how it works and draws.
regardless of what a mother's group had to say.
those r rated properties should have been large enough, so if there was products out there.
it created the boom where the media and mother's groups could express outrage.
with lone ranger, and clash of the titans..it was outrage, but the toys were still on fire before the outrage.

i lived why movies are not rated r, for most action figure properties.
yet, when movies were rated R, and were potentially an action figure property.
they were on fire more in the demographic where it counts than snyder's films are.

what you don't get is what execs don't get is.
you are making a property that has a large draw but you want the trickle down in licensing from a property that never really wanes as a draw, ala star wars.

instead dc, who has been inept the entire time star wars arose before and after has never understood any of this at all.
while having the actual resources to make these properties into what star wars is as far as a drawing property based license.

you don't understand this just like people at dc never understood this.
regardless what type of rating the property has.
said property if it is marketed as this type of thing should still resonate on a level that emulates what happened as far as the overall boom of star wars.

this is superman and batman, and jl.
they are supposed to be bigger than star wars and because people are inept at dc.
they will never be larger or more praised than star wars in this gen.
that is because dc has been inept and only wants to move supes and batman back into reeves and west territory.
while not understanding any dynamics to what the realm of draw is for those properties.
plus not understanding reeves and west era style batman and supes are completely loathed in this era and for the future.
yet, and still dc wants and continues to pigeon hole batman and supes like adam west and reeves.
all these gritty relaunches are just to create a gateway to the reeves and west.
when, batman 89 was made to move away batman from that funk.
yet, what happened then....
batman in the nolan series was made to move batman away from the funk of west and schumacher.
yet as soon as that was over we got this.



the problem is dc is inept and snyder was equally inept as well.
both caused exactly why this occurred and will continue to occur.
as dc really just wants reeves supes and adam west batman, and all the deviation and gritty takes.
are just to authenticate a move back to the west and reeves direction.

if you know this company in wb and dc then you know what time it is.

i went to comic book school dually while in high school for four years.

so i know this from not just a stand point of a consumer, but from someone actually taught and schooled in the actual business in discussion as well.


art barr

They get the same results with there cartoons why should there blockbuster movies follow that same route now?

 

[Art Barr]

@Art Barr you seem to be relatively well versed in comics, films and genre over all..who would you have had start off this DCEU if not for Snyder? Personally i liked the choice after watchmen, and still like MOS as a film alot (i dont read superman tho and feel the old movies aged poorly) BvS was OK, but not nearly what it should have been... i had fun with JL but I see zero replay value, like how I feel with most marvel movies....and in all actuality it really wasnt Snyder who they chose, but Martin Campbell who successfully rebooted Bond, twice. Just wondering breh...

i am not an expert on these newer filmmakers.
to be able to offer who could take it over or be a good candidate.
as i am really not the directer of the film choice guy.
if a suggestion on a director is made,..i can offer a critique.
yet i am not the person who can give you the list of guys who should be the candidates.

as far as batman and superman, both characters are so welled in fiction.
casting and making a movie for both is really the most difficult shyt ever.
simply because in reality these two white guys in bruce and clark, expressively do not exist.

there is no billionaire playboy who is 6.4 and smooth as fukk.
who comes complete with a ninja background with great hair in real life we can point to, to be what bruce should be.
with superman we just got lucky that reeves was alive and then his son was there as well.
yet past that, we don't and have never seen a white cat be as cool or look like superman in real life.
so, it is a general disconnect with both properties on levels dc does not address, and that is also why they will fail as well.

past that, superman is the next most difficult anything to ever make.
as superman was written as literally superman, with no real definitive power and any situation he was ushered in.
a new power was created to say he could get out of it nonsensically.
which insulted generations of readership and it never tried to grow up with readership as a gateway property to make this dynamic more believeable.
so, that mantra stood pat, for generations.
well before batman with adam west created the word phoney and then dually batman and superman were attached to the label of phoney.
not to mention, before vertigo..dc really ignored the real world issues or content with weight that exist in continuity of their mags.
while alternatively, marvel was engrained in real world issues and would not shy away from it.
such as the robbie robertson is a black man and takes over ownership and being editor to j jonah.
who had a black son who went to college with peter parker and dealt with issues of race and economics.
or feeling like an outsider from a number of position in the real world to the black community as well.
the xmen is built around the narcissistic two in america.
that it grafts this destructive component onto races that are deemed in the poleposition.
to vy for contention to take over and eliminate racism and the racist pulse of the country with malcolm and martin depicted as xavier and magnus.
plus, marvel is welled in making ny a real literary place that emulates nyc and the real world.
while dc is written with two fictional towns.
who don't really delve much into real real world issues as a basic scope of the actual universe and comics, in that gateway.
after vertigo was kinda logged into their mythos as a company story wise.
dc gravitated towards this whole mature take on comics.
yet before that, as a gateway property.
they would undermine their reader and viewership and never really tried to fix it.
just create another scenario to insult the intelligence of the viewer.
same as the movies, in this incarnation.
yet the fanbase has staunchly told dc this for decades now.
instead of listening what does dc, and warner do.
continue to create a divisive product that insults the viewer.

till dc/warner stops insulting the viewer.
they are always going to fail.

the reason why marvel is winning is because they were cognitive to realize.
yo, if we continue to insult the viewer. they will bolt and we won't exist as a credible drawing brand.
so, with their movies, they said we are not going to make captain america the original over and over again.
we are not going to make fantastic four the cartoon style movies and live action film.
then think it will draw to create interest for a universe.
marvel got down to its core, and said what do we have that makes sense and can we do it.
so it never insults the viewer as we did in the past.
marvel showed keen ability to learn from their mistakes.
from the entire blade saves us and we fukk it up till, our very enemy juxtaposed from us in disney take over us.

instead marvel stopped insulting the fanbase and then gave the fanbase an amalgamated compromise.
dc, and warner have not understood to find what that amalgamated compromise is.
as they don't think they ruined anything as far as branding.
the longer dc/warner acts oblivious to this they are never going to be able to compete with marvel.
plus, dc can continue acting dumb, but now since marvel is at disney.
they better pay attention, cause real talk...that bicep-less mouse will eventually get enough liquid to try to buy out warner and at the very least dc.


so, if dc wants to have a gateway property like batman and superman be worth a damn.
they need to do the market research and repair this.
as real talk...this could be the very end for superman and batman as gateway drawing properties.

yet dc, is so stuck up...plus so spread sheet driven.
they don't think batman and superman can become irrelevent like the phantom or the spirit.
when, batman and superman can become as irrelevent as the phantom and the spirt.
superman and batman can become that irrelevent, .they absolutely can become that irrelevent.

so, dc better fix this.
or they risk literally destroying their gateway properties in bruce and supes, forever.


art barr

 

[Art Barr]

The people who bought tickets and dvd give a fukk. They just don't complain so you don't hear them.

dc has always been criticized.
you really don't know wtf you talembout as far as dc is concerned.
if you say people who bought tickets and dvd's don't give a fukk.
dc, is the one company with every talking point made to fix this.
as no stone has been unturned in this dialogue.
dc just chooses to play revenue grab games with batman and supes.
while thinking it can never die..when the draw for them has been and could have died numerous times.

dc has never been a believeable brand but once in this gen.
that was after the 89 batman, of which they had gold in the batman tas, and even a superman relaunch and jl cartoon relaunch.

yet, they jagged't it all by giving into wanting the spreadsheet return from adam west style batman.
thus ruining it trying to chase that aesthetic in the post burton schumacher era.
plus previously hammed'd up superman so horrifically. he would have never recovered without the batman tas series to create a look for superman to run with.
which required a later reboot by nolan.
after a failed reboot by then xmen director on superman as well.

of which,..once again dc has ruined yet again.

i buy tickets, dvd's and used to collect comics.
dc just chooses to not hear the complaints and that is why they have failed this entire gen.


art barr

 

[Art Barr]

They get the same results with there cartoons why should there blockbuster movies follow that same route now?

like i said..you don't know this shyt like that.
which in your case being a casual means you would not have known if the cartoon featured in this link was adapted and loved it.
plus, after you like the film adaptation.
you possibly would have double downed and got the animated intrepretation.
similar to how people go buy the book adaptation of the film after it is made.
plus go buy the original source material based book of a film even if it was changed.
yet in this instance, the fandom for the suicide squad animated is what created the boom like reception for the idea and created the cosign draw for the movie.
originally, all that was asked was just port the cartoon.
when rightly so, as the cartoon is completely brilliant.

if you saw the cartoon, and you saw suicide squad the movie.
then, you know you got hosed out of an excellent batman and joker story, that also featured an incredible ensemble of the suicide squad and waller.
where, dc marketed us seeing the real batfleck in suicide squad because the draw for the movie was built off of the boom draw for the cartooon movie.
plus the swerve to turn suicide squad into an actual joker and batman conflict based film.
instead we got a dumb ass movie with the villian being turned into some bullshyt doing jazzercise routines when using her powers.
plus, no real use of a relaunched joker as well.
on top of no real actual romantic tension between deadshot and harley like the cartoon movie brilliantly navigated.


art barr




with justice league the cartoon, we got an excellent re-imaging of the dc universe amidst the new 52.
that completely had new superman and new batman and featured gl, shazam, wonder woman, batman, and flash.
that featured the fighting spirit of the team on such a level even darkseid got whooped't.

plus past jl cartoon movies, featuring batman versus darkseid story arcs.
that showed batman to be so bad ass darkseid is more scared of bruce than supes.
not to mention, this new jl movie nerfed on cyborg so bad.
when, cyborg originally was the heart of both the live action and the animated film.
to the point cyborg's origin was not present.
when at the very least given how large a gateway character cyborg is on teen titans.
you would think dc would be forward enough to create a larger gateway using cyborg for their child to teen properties as well.
instead, racism cut out cyborg is all we can see being why he was omitted from the film.
when, it makes no sense because cyborg right now is dc's most popular gateway character, period.

evidenced by how large this is and other links as well.





instead we got this.





art barr